Character Discussion Remember when Sanji used to be this badass?

[BleakAsh]

Freeing the others from Capone was badass, so was freeing the Vinsmokes and engaging Page One. He saved Momo from two guys with billion bounties, badass. Trying to step into the deal with Kuma was cool, but not badass. Same could be said for his relatively minor role in Skypiea or his decision to give up against Khalifa when Robin was at stake. What's irrelevant is the timeskip and using two different situations to determine the difference between cool and badass to argue for a timeskip difference.

Honestly the saving nami and all was a 500iq move no cap...

but it honestly isn't AS badass as what was stated... and walking up to pay pay.. was cool not bad aass.. the perspective of bad ass here is being defiant, independent, wise in perilous situations..

Saving momo was dope but not as dope as saving ussop from Jabura and insulting that wolf by calling yourself a hunter.. Saving the Vinsmoke was anything but badass.. it was a cool stance that he stood and looked down on his dad

Mr Prince is being badass, showed his mindset and the execution of his entrance to save his crew was badass....


What Goat said was actually very relevant...on the sea train he took charge of the team while admitting his desire to save Robin to luffy and luffy admitted that he cannot stop sanji.. while in post timeskip the Twerly Brow crew moment.. he actually asks luffy to grant him permission.. so it was a similar situation where he was in contact with luffy.. one where he was told to do as he pleases.. another sanji asking luffy for permission



Besides I'm no way claiming that there aren't any bad ass moments post TS... its just that they are not that much and not that intense

 

[Fn Lucci]

Honestly the saving nami and all was a 500iq move no cap...

but it honestly isn't AS badass as what was stated... and walking up to pay pay.. was cool not bad aass.. the perspective of bad ass here is being defiant, independent, wise in perilous situations..

Saving momo was dope but not as dope as saving ussop from Jabura and insulting that wolf by calling yourself a hunter.. Saving the Vinsmoke was anything but badass.. it was a cool stance that he stood and looked down on his dad

Mr Prince is being badass, showed his mindset and the execution of his entrance to save his crew was badass....


What Goat said was actually very relevant...on the sea train he took charge of the team while admitting his desire to save Robin to luffy and luffy admitted that he cannot stop sanji.. while in post timeskip the Twerly Brow crew moment.. he actually asks luffy to grant him permission.. so it was a similar situation where he was in contact with luffy.. one where he was told to do as he pleases.. another sanji asking luffy for permission



Besides I'm no way claiming that there aren't any bad ass moments post TS... its just that they are not that much and not that intense

I mean if all you want to do is subjectively deny one over the other, sure. Every good moment pre timeskip can be called badass and every post timeskip moment is merely cool, because that's how opinion can work.

But if you say something like "badass is defiant, independent, and wise" then you have to account for the fact that he manages to work against his own ego or pride. Calling Robin for help completely went against the grain and that to me is badass. He does most things not because he's ordered but out of tactical wisdom, but he will also follow orders by using that same wisdom.

Again I'm saying those two things are different, so you have to use your head and actually understand that difference. On the Sea Train the matter was of confronting the enemies in order to save Robin who was in immediate and proximal danger. That was NOT the same as firing back on Big Mom's ship because that action was unnecessary to the task at hand. The Sunny is in a class of its own when it comes to evasive ability so engaging the enemy was nothing like recovering Robin

 

[BleakAsh]

I mean if all you want to do is subjectively deny one over the other, sure. Every good moment pre timeskip can be called badass and every post timeskip moment is merely cool, because that's how opinion can work.

yea i Mean all you have to do is be ignorant to the main point i was making about something not being as cool as something else! yea there is that subjectivity.. but saying that i was generalizing every post timeskip badass moment as merely cool is, yes, a misconception to what i said... i agreed that there were badass moments in post time skip.. but you honestly can't compare the the vast majority of moments in pre timeskip that were consistently splendid compared to post time skip which weren't AS splendid .. now this isn't subjective if you wanna make a poll regarding this i am ready to do so..

2nd i specified the perspective of what badass pretime skip sanji was, he was defiant, independent,and wise etc etc..and there are much more you can arguably out in the bill, compare that to post timeskip.. sanji has done MEAGRE compared to pretime skip incomparable for that fact... and good moment just leads to a bad one kinda just ruining the whole moment..


3rd... no one brought narrative into this... similar never meant taking narrative into consideration... the moment with BM ship and sanji talking to luffy.. and the sea train moment where again they both both were similar.. tho narrative mattered here GOAT WAS JUST TRYING TO FORM PARALLEL BETWEEN MOMENTS NOT NARRATIVE SITUATION.. basically not ass cool as it once was... i get that the situations narratively were different but were similar.. but the it could have been made better in other way.. but it was just dope not as badass in comparison...



again the crux of my argument is.. pretime skip was a whole different level of badass.. and POST TIMESKIP NOT AS BADASs... period.

 

[Sir Tuna Sandwich II]

Nice fanfic.

 

[Fn Lucci]

yea i Mean all you have to do is be ignorant to the main point i was making about something not being as cool as something else! yea there is that subjectivity.. but saying that i was generalizing every post timeskip badass moment as merely cool is, yes, a misconception to what i said... i agreed that there were badass moments in post time skip.. but you honestly can't compare the the vast majority of moments in pre timeskip that were consistently splendid compared to post time skip which weren't AS splendid .. now this isn't subjective if you wanna make a poll regarding this i am ready to do so..

2nd i specified the perspective of what badass pretime skip sanji was, he was defiant, independent,and wise etc etc..and there are much more you can arguably out in the bill, compare that to post timeskip.. sanji has done MEAGRE compared to pretime skip incomparable for that fact... and good moment just leads to a bad one kinda just ruining the whole moment..


3rd... no one brought narrative into this... similar never meant taking narrative into consideration... the moment with BM ship and sanji talking to luffy.. and the sea train moment where again they both both were similar.. tho narrative mattered here GOAT WAS JUST TRYING TO FORM PARALLEL BETWEEN MOMENTS NOT NARRATIVE SITUATION.. basically not ass cool as it once was... i get that the situations narratively were different but were similar.. but the it could have been made better in other way.. but it was just dope not as badass in comparison...



again the crux of my argument is.. pretime skip was a whole different level of badass.. and POST TIMESKIP NOT AS BADASs... period.

I didn't say you did anything. I said "can be called" because it's a subjective possibility. If one says Sanji isn't badass or is less badass, well, all anyone actually has to start and end with is their own opinion. That's why it's pointless to take contention.

What I'm saying though, is asking permission vs not taking orders is a poorly set up argument because those situations are different. Just like Luffy says Zoro wouldn't have listened either when much earlier in the series he saved Smoker merely because it was Luffy's order. Disobedience in and of itself is a foolish trait to admire, it's really the unwillingness to compromise one's beliefs that Oda uses to make the one scene work. Just like Franky, within the same conversation in Dressrosa, declares that he won't back down. Oda didn't transplant Sanji's nuts or anything, he just gave them two different scenarios. It's dumb to think Sanji wouldn't ask permission for something like that now or then, and it's dumb to think Sanji would ask permission if another friend was in the same spot as Robin was on the Sea Train. That's why a parallel doesn't work, for the fifth time.

As far as meager showings go, you're obviously going to get less good moments with less of the character being relevant. Pre timeskip Skypiea was exceptional in how Sanji didn't play in, but now we have characters being out for whole arcs or the cast expanding to the point where the actual crew is shown less. Some of us love a Law or Yamato though, so it's more of a trade than a loss.

 

[Julius]

Sanji still a badass, thats clear

 

[Peroroncino]

No i dont

 

[Finalbeta]

Which moments do you guys consider badass exactly?

 

[BleakAsh]

I didn't say you did anything. I said "can be called" because it's a subjective possibility. If one says Sanji isn't badass or is less badass, well, all anyone actually has to start and end with is their own opinion. That's why it's pointless to take contention.

What I'm saying though, is asking permission vs not taking orders is a poorly set up argument because those situations are different. Just like Luffy says Zoro wouldn't have listened either when much earlier in the series he saved Smoker merely because it was Luffy's order. Disobedience in and of itself is a foolish trait to admire, it's really the unwillingness to compromise one's beliefs that Oda uses to make the one scene work. Just like Franky, within the same conversation in Dressrosa, declares that he won't back down. Oda didn't transplant Sanji's nuts or anything, he just gave them two different scenarios. It's dumb to think Sanji wouldn't ask permission for something like that now or then, and it's dumb to think Sanji would ask permission if another friend was in the same spot as Robin was on the Sea Train. That's why a parallel doesn't work, for the fifth time.

As far as meager showings go, you're obviously going to get less good moments with less of the character being relevant. Pre timeskip Skypiea was exceptional in how Sanji didn't play in, but now we have characters being out for whole arcs or the cast expanding to the point where the actual crew is shown less. Some of us love a Law or Yamato though, so it's more of a trade than a loss.

omg.... just agree to disagree mate

 

[Fn Lucci]

omg.... just agree to disagree mate

I already did that. Omg read guv

 

[BleakAsh]

I already did that. Omg read guv

I already did that. Omg read guv

thats great.. no. more of this pointless crap.. and ludicrous arguments just to win an argument when you can't even gauge the most basic of premises of an argument..

gg enjoy

 

[Fn Lucci]

thats great.. no. more of this pointless crap.. and ludicrous arguments just to win an argument when you can't even gauge the most basic of premises of an argument..

gg enjoy

So maybe you now know not to just quote me outta nowhere fool. You're like Luffy when he asks Nami a question. I'll waste your time right back though lmao

 

[BleakAsh]

So maybe you now know not to just quote me outta nowhere fool. You're like Luffy when he asks Nami a question. I'll waste your time right back though lmao

i didnt know you we're this dismissive and pretentious... my bad

Post automatically merged: Jul 16, 2021

@Fn Lucci don't take this as a sign of friction.. I haven't been in a good mood lately and seeing someone persistent ticks me off...you have your way of reasoning and have mine.. hopefully we'd converge with out opinions at a different topic

 

[Zoro the badass god]

Never.as I remember sanji always act like an OKAMA.btw when pudding make fun of him,it still remain one of the funniest episode in one piece.my stomach hurt

 

[Warchief Sanji D Goat]

Btw, I'm not saying current Sanji is not cool. It's just that Pre-TS Sanji is more raw and fluid than current Sanji when it comes to badass moments......

I can't believe you didn't include the moment when Sanji asked Enel for a light!

I didn't find any similar Post-TS moment like that lol.

Where's the context? @Zoro D Goat

Basically comparison of Sanji's "badass" and "cool" moments from Pre-TS and Post-TS.

"no matter what"

"Requesting permission"

...did you center your point around Sanji having two different responses in two different situations?

I mean Sanji did talk to Luffy in both scenarios but the fact that Sanji have to personally requested permission from Luffy in Dressrosa doesn't really stand out to be honest.

Lmao why did you not include this panel? It goes good with his cHaRacTeR

And Lmao @ Choppers Priceless Reaction. He’s like is this dude serious.

He's right though.

Which moments do you guys consider badass exactly?

Like these.....

 

[matt245]

If you want something badass look at this:

Or this:

This one also works:

Oh oh, this one looks epic:

My fav one so far tho:

Forgot this one, sorry not sorry:

HE IS SO FUCKING BADASS!!! 🤧🤧

 

[Ballel]

Sanji DOES get a lot of hate nowadays. But he has his cool moments. He is suffering from Oda's attempt to make characters into stereotypical versions of themselves.
Luffy becomes dumber, Chopper becomes a cute mascot for merchandise, Nami became all boobs etc. and Sanji became mostly nose bleeds. He has always had a function of a gag/comedic relief character but post ts Oda changed the focus to these funny traits of Sanji's.

 

[Warchief Sanji D Goat]

If you want something badass look at this:

Or this:

This one also works:

Oh oh, this one looks epic:

My fav one so far tho:

Forgot this one, sorry not sorry:

HE IS SO FUCKING BADASS!!! 🤧🤧

I can easily turn those into a badass moments but I don't have the energy to do so.

 

[matt245]

I can easily turn those into a badass moments but I don't have the energy to do so.

Ugh, hurting his leg against Kuma, Arlong trash-talking him, Vergo breaking his leg, Doffy no diffing him, "he gave in so easily?" and King one shotting ass. Shit's so badass... Watch them Sanji stans waking up to cry about it. 5 mins for the next reply crying.

 

[Warchief Sanji D Goat]

Ugh, hurting his leg against Kuma, Arlong trash-talking him, Vergo breaking his leg, Doffy no diffing him, "he gave in so easily?" and King one shotting ass. Shit's so badass... Watch them Sanji stans waking up to cry about it. 5 mins for the next reply crying.

If that's how you see it then I won't stop ya. It's just that for me, those scenes have more meaning to it rather just some bag hitting spot.