Questions & Mysteries Who is the traitor?
- Thread starter Johnny B. Decent
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The traitor storyline has become one of the biggest plotlines in OP history (no exaggeration).
Just think of it: Oda has been carefully setting it up for almost a decade (!) now. It all started back in PH (2012), when Kinemon told them that he, Momonosuke, Kanjuro and Raizo tried to flee Wano but somehow the enemy knew their plan and chased after them. Then things got even more suspicious in Zou (2016) and intensified even more in Wano (2018 - present). Now we're obviously only a few inches away from the climax.
I think Oda is going to present a major twist/shocker when the traitor is revealed.
The most logical choice is Kanjuro imho. He would make sense and certainly have an emotional impact. However, I wonder if him being the traitor would be Oda's style. He left many obvious hints in that direction and I keep wondering if those weren't a bit too obvious.
So I will ask some questions, while trying to figure out the traitor:
1) Why is the traitor so loyal to Orochi?
We've seen that basically ALL of his subordinates think of him as a joke and ridicule him behind his back. Literally nobody we've seen so far would take a bullet for him. Yet the traitor obviously takes great risks trying to inform Orochi and snitch on the alliance.
So what is his/her big goal? What does he/her gain from keeping Orochi and Kaido in place?
2) How come that nobody has a clue about the traitor, despite him/her already being active for 20+ years?
We know the traitor already snitched on Oden back in the day. He or her is already active in the present day. In all those years nobody seemingly got a clue about the traitors intentions. That means two things in my eyes: The traitor is a damn good spy and actor and nobody suspects him/her at all. Like ZERO suspicion, not just "nah, this is a cool dude, he/she won't betray us!".
3) How does the traitor deliver his messages so quickly?
Kanjuro would be the easiest answer to this question, but hear me out: If Kanjuro really is the traitor, how come nobody has ever seen him send one bird-drawing (or something like that) to Orochi for more than 20 years? I mean he/she must've delivered hundreds of messages to always give updates for Orochi, it would be very fishy if Kanjuro dialed up several of those drawing-messengers per day/week. Somebody should've noticed such suspicious behavior during those 20 years imho.
4) What is Toki's role in all of this?
Toki is one major mystery right now. We still know almost nothing about her. She pushed Oden to stay away from Wano and pursue his journey, even going so far as to threaten him with divorce. Oda randomly showed us the scar on the leg. It's obvious this scar will have a role to play. She has been in the castle for quite a while now and Kaido tells Oden that there is a spy at his castle. Given Toki's careful personality (she immediately recognized the human traffickers back in the day, too), shouldn't she have noticed the spy over the years?
Last but not least: Why is she so damn relaxed right now? She flipped when Oden wanted to stay back in Wano a year earlier, but now, when her husband and friends will probably die, she's calm and relaxed.
Just think of it: Oda has been carefully setting it up for almost a decade (!) now. It all started back in PH (2012), when Kinemon told them that he, Momonosuke, Kanjuro and Raizo tried to flee Wano but somehow the enemy knew their plan and chased after them. Then things got even more suspicious in Zou (2016) and intensified even more in Wano (2018 - present). Now we're obviously only a few inches away from the climax.
I think Oda is going to present a major twist/shocker when the traitor is revealed.
The most logical choice is Kanjuro imho. He would make sense and certainly have an emotional impact. However, I wonder if him being the traitor would be Oda's style. He left many obvious hints in that direction and I keep wondering if those weren't a bit too obvious.
So I will ask some questions, while trying to figure out the traitor:
1) Why is the traitor so loyal to Orochi?
We've seen that basically ALL of his subordinates think of him as a joke and ridicule him behind his back. Literally nobody we've seen so far would take a bullet for him. Yet the traitor obviously takes great risks trying to inform Orochi and snitch on the alliance.
So what is his/her big goal? What does he/her gain from keeping Orochi and Kaido in place?
2) How come that nobody has a clue about the traitor, despite him/her already being active for 20+ years?
We know the traitor already snitched on Oden back in the day. He or her is already active in the present day. In all those years nobody seemingly got a clue about the traitors intentions. That means two things in my eyes: The traitor is a damn good spy and actor and nobody suspects him/her at all. Like ZERO suspicion, not just "nah, this is a cool dude, he/she won't betray us!".
3) How does the traitor deliver his messages so quickly?
Kanjuro would be the easiest answer to this question, but hear me out: If Kanjuro really is the traitor, how come nobody has ever seen him send one bird-drawing (or something like that) to Orochi for more than 20 years? I mean he/she must've delivered hundreds of messages to always give updates for Orochi, it would be very fishy if Kanjuro dialed up several of those drawing-messengers per day/week. Somebody should've noticed such suspicious behavior during those 20 years imho.
4) What is Toki's role in all of this?
Toki is one major mystery right now. We still know almost nothing about her. She pushed Oden to stay away from Wano and pursue his journey, even going so far as to threaten him with divorce. Oda randomly showed us the scar on the leg. It's obvious this scar will have a role to play. She has been in the castle for quite a while now and Kaido tells Oden that there is a spy at his castle. Given Toki's careful personality (she immediately recognized the human traffickers back in the day, too), shouldn't she have noticed the spy over the years?
Last but not least: Why is she so damn relaxed right now? She flipped when Oden wanted to stay back in Wano a year earlier, but now, when her husband and friends will probably die, she's calm and relaxed.
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imo last chapter almost certainly removed Shinobu from the candidates list :
- of course first obvious reasons many people already mentioned : how she helped in the fight and how Oden saves her ass... no reason for her to come out exposed, she is a damn kunoichi so she could have stayed in the shadows if her only intention was to give intel to Kaido
- but also it'd make absolutely no sense for Oda to draw her expression when Oden says "the ninjas were right to leave and no longer trust a stupid Lord" if she was indeed the traitor... my interpretation of that panel is that as she knows the whole deal, she is the only one to understand why Oden acted that way for 5 years... that face looks more like a mix of remorse, helplessness and sadness than "fuck it Oden you betrayed us all"
Guys, I've finally uncovered who the traitor is.
It's O-Kiku, guys. The chick says she's a woman at "heart". What else do we know lives in your heart?
That's right, Sniper Island, where our glorious senpai, Sogeking lives.
Is O-Kiku a sniper? Nope.
Is O-Kiku sogeking? Nope. (pfft, everyone knows Sogeking is Arlong).
Have we ever heard O-Kiku sing the lululala song? Nope.
She's a LIAR.
And why only "heart"? She can just ask Law to give her body parts to be a woman.. Vag? Check. Boobs? Check. This is why she got the beast pirates to track him down, its coz Law got those skillz.
It's O-Kiku, guys. The chick says she's a woman at "heart". What else do we know lives in your heart?
That's right, Sniper Island, where our glorious senpai, Sogeking lives.
Is O-Kiku a sniper? Nope.
Is O-Kiku sogeking? Nope. (pfft, everyone knows Sogeking is Arlong).
Have we ever heard O-Kiku sing the lululala song? Nope.
She's a LIAR.
And why only "heart"? She can just ask Law to give her body parts to be a woman.. Vag? Check. Boobs? Check. This is why she got the beast pirates to track him down, its coz Law got those skillz.
I'd be pretty pissed as a traitor right now, sitting there getting boiled by oil vapor
But if it's not one of the scabbards, who else should it be?
Carrot is out of the picture, since she wasn't even alive back then.
Shinobu is also out of the picture after the last two chapters.
Law is out of the picture, too, since he had nothing to do with Wano 20 years ago.
All other candidates simply aren't impactful enough for Oda to consider them.
Only crackpt candidate left would be Toki.
After this chapter, the only possible reasons I can think of, for a traitor being one of the scabbards who traveled to the future, is if he/she was threatened by Orochi and forced to co-operate with him, with the cost that if he didn't do so, he will lose something, or someone... In other words, the traitor had something or someone to protect (maybe related to the 100 hostages) to his dying breath.
It's a debatable reason - given the whole 20 years - but if not this, I can't think of any other reason for a traitor that is among those who traveled to the future... But recalling the scabbards' backgrounds:
- Kanjuro was persecuted in the past (no mention of family, so anything goes, really)
- Kiku's father was convicted and arrested back then (is he still alive even today? No idea).
But all this aside, if the spy Kaido mentioned is not the same spy as today (Kurozumi hag?), then my thoughts are still the same, regarding who the traitor could be.
EDIT: Could it be Kiku was doing it to protect her brother? I mean, Wano is a closed country, and Kaido is considered a monster... everyone in Wano would've believed Kaido could destroy anyone.. even someone like WB, though this is just not true... but even so, Kiku might've been threatened of Izo's life around that time, if she didn't comply... then found out he was still alive all these years.. and carried on..... *shrugs*
I'm just going off a few thoughts here and there..
Lol, I'm just having fun. xD
It's a debatable reason - given the whole 20 years - but if not this, I can't think of any other reason for a traitor that is among those who traveled to the future... But recalling the scabbards' backgrounds:
- Kanjuro was persecuted in the past (no mention of family, so anything goes, really)
- Kiku's father was convicted and arrested back then (is he still alive even today? No idea).
But all this aside, if the spy Kaido mentioned is not the same spy as today (Kurozumi hag?), then my thoughts are still the same, regarding who the traitor could be.
EDIT: Could it be Kiku was doing it to protect her brother? I mean, Wano is a closed country, and Kaido is considered a monster... everyone in Wano would've believed Kaido could destroy anyone.. even someone like WB, though this is just not true... but even so, Kiku might've been threatened of Izo's life around that time, if she didn't comply... then found out he was still alive all these years.. and carried on..... *shrugs*
I'm just going off a few thoughts here and there..
Lol, I'm just having fun. xD
Since Orochi hasn't seen the scabbards since 20 years ago when the castle was burnt down:
And after seeing this chapter, I can't see any of the scabbards being the traitor.
No Shinobu, no Law, no Carrot...
A random Wano character like Tengu guy would have zero impact.
Toki who is in fact the Hiyori we saw with Zoro. They lie to us!
Or maybe the spy at Oden time was just the old hag with Mr2's fruit who infiltrated Oden Castle. But now that she's dead (since Mr2 has the fruit) then maybe there's a new traitor for the present time.
And after seeing this chapter, I can't see any of the scabbards being the traitor.
No Shinobu, no Law, no Carrot...
A random Wano character like Tengu guy would have zero impact.
Toki who is in fact the Hiyori we saw with Zoro. They lie to us!
Or maybe the spy at Oden time was just the old hag with Mr2's fruit who infiltrated Oden Castle. But now that she's dead (since Mr2 has the fruit) then maybe there's a new traitor for the present time.
Since Orochi hasn't seen the scabbards since 20 years ago when the castle was burnt down:
And after seeing this chapter, I can't see any of the scabbards being the traitor.
No Shinobu, no Law, no Carrot...
A random Wano character like Tengu guy would have zero impact.
Toki who is in fact the Hiyori we saw with Zoro. They lie to us!
Or maybe the spy at Oden time was just the old hag with Mr2's fruit who infiltrated Oden Castle. But now that she's dead (since Mr2 has the fruit) then maybe there's a new traitor for the present time.
And after seeing this chapter, I can't see any of the scabbards being the traitor.
No Shinobu, no Law, no Carrot...
A random Wano character like Tengu guy would have zero impact.
Toki who is in fact the Hiyori we saw with Zoro. They lie to us!
Or maybe the spy at Oden time was just the old hag with Mr2's fruit who infiltrated Oden Castle. But now that she's dead (since Mr2 has the fruit) then maybe there's a new traitor for the present time.
As for the "two different traitors theory" : It's interesting, but I don't believe Oda takes this route. From a story perspective it just wouldn't work if the traitor back then wasn't the same as right now.
I just saw an interesting post on NarutoForum:
The moment they went to the future, 2 birds that accurately represent Kanjurou's drawings, went to Kaido and Orochi, which initiated the witch hunt.
Not a fan of the Kanjuro=traitor theory but there is arguments.
But at the same time with what I said above (words of Orochi+Kanjuro who was about to be boiled)...
Oda keeps the suspense well, I have no idea about the traitor.
Or there is no traitor, Oda kinda forgot
The moment they went to the future, 2 birds that accurately represent Kanjurou's drawings, went to Kaido and Orochi, which initiated the witch hunt.
Not a fan of the Kanjuro=traitor theory but there is arguments.
But at the same time with what I said above (words of Orochi+Kanjuro who was about to be boiled)...
Oda keeps the suspense well, I have no idea about the traitor.
Or there is no traitor, Oda kinda forgot
Since Orochi hasn't seen the scabbards since 20 years ago when the castle was burnt down:
And after seeing this chapter, I can't see any of the scabbards being the traitor.
And after seeing this chapter, I can't see any of the scabbards being the traitor.
--- Orochi says he never saw any of those present in the burning castle (Kinemon and co),
--- Even ignoring the first point, they were still part of that execution only 3 months ago, with Oden saving their lives.. for the traitor to recover from a trauma like that and still be a traitor is mind-boggling.
Yeah, I agree, with Shinobu, Carrot or Law not being the traitor... It's impossible for Shinobu to be the traitor, imo.. and even if we ignore the fact that Carrot and Law have nothing to do with Wano, they didn't know any of the details that was revealed to Orochi in the second leak, as they weren't in the meeting.
But I still think it has to be one of the scabbards... even with this chapter... they are the only ones who knew all the details that were forwarded to Orochi in the second leak... something that no-one else but the SH know, and Tenguyama, but like you said.. he wouldn't deliver much of an impact, if he was the traitor.
In this case, I'm going to go an extreme tangent here, but it's an idea I've had since 4 months ago, tho' I could be wrong... I think the traitor's motives are actually way more honorable than one might expect...
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