[FNZ] Super Role Madness World Of Warcraft: Wrath Of The Lich King

[Grammaton]

Again with the "b-but you're Indie" despite me very clearly not being a typical Indie for the purposes of this game. I can't win with Scum, I've seriously lost count of how many times I need to claim my wincon. If you had actually tried to work with me instead of making me play blind we could have had 2 nights of no kills. Instead we might have 0.

Like, am I not getting through. Do I need to use pictures, because English doesn't work to convey what I'm saying? My abilities are designed around helping Town. They're supposed to be used to help Town. I've gotten the most I could possibly get out of them. And despite me being Town for all intents and purposes, you people keep relying on the same stupid "hurr you're an indie" when it suits you to maintain your farce of an argument instead of accepting that clearly I'm pro-Town and screwing me over helps scum. And no doubt you'll respond with "hurr you're an indie so I can't trust you" despite literally everything I've done this game working towards town winning. Like it's super obvious I'm basically just town with an extra aside to my wincon, keyword being "extra", and you people just don't seem capable of understanding. When words fail, what am I left with?

I feel like you are wilfully being obtuse at this point. You made the error of judgment in fusing your wincon with flowers. Nobody but you two wanted or asked for this.

you are an indie. You are not a reliable narrator. I understand that our goals mostly align, certainly at face value, but after your posts before I was revived, my charity, to use one of your terms, ends there.

to reiterate for about the 8th time - I will help flower if I can, purely because I agreed to do that. You two winning is no longer a priority to me, you broke the detente when you started mooting scum siding. Whether you took actual hostile actions is immaterial, you lined up nukes on my border, and to not expect a response is naive.

I’m not trying to actively screw anyone, my priority is eliminating scum. I have 90% of the vanilla scum wrapped up, only care about the last one and after that, who wins or loses is immaterial to me

 

[Ratchet]

I feel like you are wilfully being obtuse at this point. You made the error of judgment in fusing your wincon with flowers. Nobody but you two wanted or asked for this.

I didn't have any say in the matter, and you're clearly not reading - Flower's wincon is secondary, it doesn't matter in terms of me winning or losing because I win regardless.

you are an indie. You are not a reliable narrator. I understand that our goals mostly align, certainly at face value, but after your posts before I was revived, my charity, to use one of your terms, ends there.

What indie that isn't basically town revives town? Hunts, finds, and votes for scum? Buffs town? Like, I'm actually going to ask Fuji to explain in detail after the game, to you and a few others specifically, exactly how my role should have been treated this game. I'm going to hazard a guess it'll be "town, moreso than a neutral indie". You people keep invoking "indie" when I'm pretty much just town. Except I have it a bit harder than you guys.

to reiterate for about the 8th time - I will help flower if I can, purely because I agreed to do that. You two winning is no longer a priority to me, you broke the detente when you started mooting scum siding. Whether you took actual hostile actions is immaterial, you lined up nukes on my border, and to not expect a response is naive.

I mean, anyone with a brain could see it was bluster. The most I would go maybe is stalling the game which once scum got revived, which got attributed to me, was no longer in play even if I wanted to. Don't keep telling me I broke it when most of the town were saying that they'd choose me losing if they could just to speed the game up. I wouldn't actually lose, but they didn't know that.

I’m not trying to actively screw anyone, my priority is eliminating scum. I have 90% of the vanilla scum wrapped up, only care about the last one and after that, who wins or loses is immaterial to me

Cool, irrelevant to anything I'm saying.

 

[Grammaton]

I didn't have any say in the matter, and you're clearly not reading - Flower's wincon is secondary, it doesn't matter in terms of me winning or losing because I win regardless.
What indie that isn't basically town revives town? Hunts, finds, and votes for scum? Buffs town? Like, I'm actually going to ask Fuji to explain in detail after the game, to you and a few others specifically, exactly how my role should have been treated this game. I'm going to hazard a guess it'll be "town, moreso than a neutral indie". You people keep invoking "indie" when I'm pretty much just town. Except I have it a bit harder than you guys.
I mean, anyone with a brain could see it was bluster. The most I would go maybe is stalling the game which once scum got revived, which got attributed to me, was no longer in play even if I wanted to. Don't keep telling me I broke it when most of the town were saying that they'd choose me losing if they could just to speed the game up. I wouldn't actually lose, but they didn't know that.
Cool, irrelevant to anything I'm saying.

ok, at this point I have no interest in continuing this further. If you want to take that as a concession to your point of view (it isn’t) you can.

You cried wolf, and I now have to assume that you’re serious, you will obviously keep saying you had no intention of betrayal, and maybe you didn’t. But the point is, maybe you did. I’ll end it there, or you can have the last word, whatever floats your boat.

 

[Ratchet]

ok, at this point I have no interest in continuing this further. If you want to take that as a concession to your point of view (it isn’t) you can.

You cried wolf, and I now have to assume that you’re serious, you will obviously keep saying you had no intention of betrayal, and maybe you didn’t. But the point is, maybe you did. I’ll end it there, or you can have the last word, whatever floats your boat.

My intent was at most to stall, which is technically scum-siding in that it keeps them in the game, but it would only be to allow more time for Flower to win. Hence why I voted "No Lynch". The least-harmful path of resistance. The majority of the town were more than happy to go out of their way to prevent me from winning with them, because their assumption was I needed Brann to win, not because they would otherwise risk losing, but because they wanted the game to end quicker. I am shocked you don't see that, and I suspect you do in fact see it, but don't mention it because you want to maintain whatever highground you believe you have.

This coming after I've been more responsible for the town being in this position that most of the remaining townies put together. Not all, but most. In other words, leech off of efforts and then screw over when they can. I think I'm within reason to be frustrated.

 

[RippedCal]

Hello

 

[Grammaton]

My intent was at most to stall, which is technically scum-siding in that it keeps them in the game, but it would only be to allow more time for Flower to win. Hence why I voted "No Lynch". The least-harmful path of resistance. The majority of the town were more than happy to go out of their way to prevent me from winning with them, because their assumption was I needed Brann to win, not because they would otherwise risk losing, but because they wanted the game to end quicker. I am shocked you don't see that, and I suspect you do in fact see it, but don't mention it because you want to maintain whatever highground you believe you have.

This coming after I've been more responsible for the town being in this position that most of the remaining townies put together. Not all, but most. In other words, leech off of efforts and then screw over when they can. I think I'm within reason to be frustrated.

Its not about the high ground for me. Ive been consistent about what my priorities are. The town players want to secure the win quicker at minimal risk. This is not an unreasonable position, despite your protestations.

@Town If you have any legendary items you can send Flower's way, I'd appreciate it. With us going into the final stretch here she needs let's say 3 max to cover her item requirement, she can win tonight.

Not to ring the alarm or anything but I strongly suggest town does this. Something something break time something something.

It can be any legendary you have so even the weaker/more useless ones. But I really need 3 sent to her today to allow me to finish this game up otherwise I'm going to have to scum side, I'm sure you can understand.

You also initiated hostilities unprompted this phase. No one was talking about denying you anything.

 

[Grammaton]

Hello

were you recruited? If you were, this will be unfortunate but you dont have the numbers to win regardless, best to surrender now

 

[Ratchet]

You also initiated hostilities unprompted this phase. No one was talking about denying you anything.

By voting to end the game, instead of waiting for Flower to get what she needs, this is exactly what they thought they'd be doing. Because they were under the belief I would only win with Flower. As far as they knew, I'd just lose, and that was worth it to end it more quickly. Come on now.

 

[Grammaton]

By voting to end the game, instead of waiting for Flower to get what she needs, this is exactly what they thought they'd be doing. Because they were under the belief I would only win with Flower. As far as they knew, I'd just lose, and that was worth it to end it more quickly. Come on now.

The only thing Im surprised about is that youre surprised by this. You can blame the likes of Zem and the hordes of other 'pro-town' indies that have profited from towns naivety over the years.

 

[RippedCal]

were you recruited? If you were, this will be unfortunate but you dont have the numbers to win regardless, best to surrender now

I was not

 

[Grammaton]

Anyway, does anybody have any solid leads on who the last blue is?

People are saying Soul is a townie, but how does this compute with Kag also likely being a townie? Is it Zolo being the jester?

 

[Peroroncino]

Anyway, does anybody have any solid leads on who the last blue is?

People are saying Soul is a townie, but how does this compute with Kag also likely being a townie? Is it Zolo being the jester?

isn't reborn still in the game?

 

[Kagumon]

Anyway, does anybody have any solid leads on who the last blue is?

People are saying Soul is a townie, but how does this compute with Kag also likely being a townie? Is it Zolo being the jester?

By PoE, the options which are popping up before me are Reborn and Robin. As for Soul, he said that he RC’d Jinri yesterday and today Ratchet. Further Broki vouches for him which again contradicts with the list that Worst gave us earlier. As for me as you can see that I’m a confirmed town. Which leaves to believe there’s something wrong with Soul. Odd also said that he’s bleeding out and will die tomorrow. I voted for Odd earlier but I let him be to self resolve himself.

 

[Kagumon]

Also congrats @Ratchet for overtaking Ekkologist by post count. It’s an incredible feat 🎉🎉

 

[Ratchet]

The only thing Im surprised about is that youre surprised by this. You can blame the likes of Zem and the hordes of other 'pro-town' indies that have profited from towns naivety over the years.

I mean, I'd like to think a meta I've established of over 8 years by now would go some way to alleviating said paranoia. If not that, then any one of the myriad actions I've took this game should have sufficed. If anything, the Town here are the reason why Indies don't work with the town. You guys want me to do more than most townies, and when it comes to helping me, you pull the "well, we don't neeeeeed to help you out" schtick. In this specific case it doesn't actually screw me, but it doesn't change the principle of the matter here. It has been like this every single game I've played Indie here too.

 

[Kagumon]

Vote Count

Sallu - Worst
Broki - Sallu > Lind > Sallu
Muugen - Sallu
Jinri - Blue
Odd - Blue > Ratchet

Ratchet - Lind > Sallu > Jinri
Cal - Zolo
Grammaton - Sallu
Peroroncino - Sallu

Blue - Zolo
Nana - Jinri
Soul - Jinri
Kag - Sallu

Ultra - Sallu > Ratchet > Robin > Pero > Jinri > Kagu > Cal > Soul > Flower > Muugen > Odd > Brokie > Blue > Worst > Reborn > Nana > Xlaw - Zolo
Adam - Sallu
Zolo - Sallu

Total

Sallu - 7
Zolo/ Jinri-3
Worst/Ratchet/Blue- 1

no guilties in sally lynch

I wish Robin would have voted here atleast.

 

[Ratchet]

Odd/Cal/Soul/Reborn/Robin

That's the remaining PoE for all Scum.

 

[Grammaton]

I mean, I'd like to think a meta I've established of over 8 years by now would go some way to alleviating said paranoia. If not that, then any one of the myriad actions I've took this game should have sufficed. If anything, the Town here are the reason why Indies don't work with the town. You guys want me to do more than most townies, and when it comes to helping me, you pull the "well, we don't neeeeeed to help you out" schtick. In this specific case it doesn't actually screw me, but it doesn't change the principle of the matter here. It has been like this every single game I've played Indie here too.

Then it seems to me the moral of this story is if you draw indy here, consider very carefully before you out it, as if youre expecting a smooth ride, youll likely be disappointed.

Which is the convention Ive always played to, but then we don't really use truly benign indies, as whats the point, just make them town

 

[Underworld Broker]

By PoE, the options which are popping up before me are Reborn and Robin. As for Soul, he said that he RC’d Jinri yesterday and today Ratchet. Further Broki vouches for him which again contradicts with the list that Worst gave us earlier. As for me as you can see that I’m a confirmed town. Which leaves to believe there’s something wrong with Soul. Odd also said that he’s bleeding out and will die tomorrow. I voted for Odd earlier but I let him be to self resolve himself.

Little sheep, im only vouching for him cause his actions and targets check out, the guilty result is still smth that we have against him so this scummy sheep isnt off the hook, i need to check all his posts since back then i was suspecting him of being red, but why would he target juliet when everything was bouncing back? it feels like red mafia wouldnt bother helping.

 

[Mashiro Blue]

Then it seems to me the moral of this story is if you draw indy here, consider very carefully before you out it, as if youre expecting a smooth ride, youll likely be disappointed.

Which is the convention Ive always played to, but then we don't really use truly benign indies, as whats the point, just make them town

The point for Pro Town indies is to add variety to the game, as they have a Town aligned wincon.

Instead of a "Eliminate all threats to Town" they could have a wincon to protect certain Town roles or dispose of certain Mafia roles and be specifically geared towards achieving that wincon.

Basically the whole point of it is to add variety to Mafia games, enriching it, which is beneficial long-term in terms of captivating players and keeping them.