Yeah, earth; not plants. Caribou's "swamp" is "wet earth", that's a single entity with a uniquely identifiable aesthetic, hence why it works as an element; still far from the same as leaves plus roots plus wood plus vines plus flowers plus any part of a plant in the sape of specific species of trees, bushes and grass.
When hit Caribou's body turns into a mass of mud; what is Ryokugyu's body turning into? Wood? Leaves? Flowers? An explosion of different trees? What would his "logia body" be made of, considering that any other logia user breaks apart into a homogeneous mass of a single identifiable element?
I just don't think that it would work out with a mythical zoan like what could it be?
Forest God?
Then he probably shouldn't have a hybrid as it would look pretty weird.
I think Logia is just easier to write. Well and i personally prefer logias lol
I usually prefer logias too but with the whole forest theme, I think a forest deity/god would be the better solution for Greenbull's DF, especially if he happens to battle Luffy who is Nika now.
Tbh, I think 3 mythical models are too few, one of them is literally the most ridiculous power explained by the Gorosei.
We've seen the Seiryuu with Kaido, then Marco being the phoenix with high regen but an additional mythological creature like whatever represents Greenbull wouldn't be bad either. I was thinking about something similar like the Forest God of Princess Mononoke, who was creating and destroying life as well.
I think what's happening there is Katakuri is using his Logia and Adv CoA to stop the bullets.
What he's saying is that you can hit Katakuri without Armament IF Katakuri ISN'T using Haki.
The reason bullets/Luffy's punches don't damage Katakuri is because of his Haki, not because of his Fruit. If Katakuri can't use Haki, normal punches can damage him. Mochi is naturally force-absorbant, like Rubber, though, which definitely helps him out.
usually prefer logias too but with the whole forest theme, I think a forest deity/god would be the better solution for Greenbull's DF, especially if he happens to battle Luffy who is Nika now.
I dunno about Nika (personally, I liked G5) but I think it just fits Greenbull thematically if he is a mythical zoan as well.
And again, there's a clear pattern: paramecia (Issho), logia (Kizaru), zoan/mythical zoan (Aramaki). Would be odd if Oda introduces two admirals of the same DF category while there is the odd one.
Paramecia Admiral was introduced in the arc where Paramecia awakening was shown for the first time. The current arc is about awakened Zoans, so I guess Greenbull is Zoan, most likely mythical.
I think what's happening there is Katakuri is using his Logia and Adv CoA to stop the bullets.
What he's saying is that you can hit Katakuri without Armament IF Katakuri ISN'T using Haki.
The reason bullets/Luffy's punches don't damage Katakuri is because of his Haki, not because of his Fruit. If Katakuri can't use Haki, normal punches can damage him. Mochi is naturally force-absorbant, like Rubber, though, which definitely helps him out.
How is he using "advanced CoA" when the bullets are just naturally sinking into the mass of elastic mochi that mades Katakuri's body and then falling from it? The exact same thing happens when Pedro slashes his leg without haki: he just cuts mochi. The other user is overcomplicating it this unnecessarily: the only thing that feels odd with Katakuri's "logia" is that mochi is a manmade element; in every other regard he works like one, hence why he was introduced as such but later retconed.
Luffy explicitly addresses that he can't fight Katakuri without haki and once he finds out his trick he reflects on how armament can hit the real body of a logia yet it didn't work against Katakuri because of his observation allowed him to dodge without getting hit. Never has it been hinted that Katakuri can be hit without armament; in my opinion, and since paramecia includes pretty much any power not fitting the two other classes, the only way his fruit can be a special paramecia is if he has all the properties of another class but breaks one
technicality. If Katakuri could be hit without armament then I see no reason why his fruit can't be just paramecia.
Not an Eastern creature, doesn't fit the rest of mythical zoans (this includes Marco, in case you're thinking of him; his fruit is a modern Fenghuang more than anything).
The power Aramaki used to absorb King and Queen is inspired by the Japanese folkloric take on the Jubokko tree, which is said to absorb the blood of slaughtered bodies on the battlefield by piercing their skin and draining them. So it seems to me that Oda is taking a more mythical route with his abilities which may be an indication that he is a mythical zoan of some sorts. Him being a Logia doesn't make much sense since the plants he can sprout are so varied and diverse it wouldn't make sense to boil it down to a single element. I could however see him being a paramecia since he does not only alter his own body but also the environment around him, it would also account for the versatility of his powers, since paramecia abilities aren't limited to only the elemental. But he of course cannot be a normal Zoan nor an Ancient Zoan this is self explanatory, so I believe the only two options are Paramecia or Mythical Zoan and I would go with the latter since there aren't that many Mythical Zoans around and an Admiral having one seems fitting; also keeps it fresh with the Logia, Paramecia and Zoan pattern among the Admirals.
Tbh, I think 3 mythical models are too few, one of them is literally the most ridiculous power explained by the Gorosei.
We've seen the Seiryuu with Kaido, then Marco being the phoenix with high regen but an additional mythological creature like whatever represents Greenbull wouldn't be bad either. I was thinking about something similar like the Forest God of Princess Mononoke, who was creating and destroying life as well.
I don't know why you mention Kaidou and Marco; I'm talking about three mythical models of the human fruit: Onimaru, Sengoku and Luffy. A fourth Hito Hito for a class that is so scarce sounds like a waste to me.
I don't know why you mention Kaidou and Marco; I'm talking about three mythical models of the human fruit: Onimaru, Sengoku and Luffy. A fourth Hito Hito for a class that is so scarce sounds like a waste to me.
The power Aramaki used to absorb King and Queen is inspired by the Japanese folkloric take on the Jubokko tree, which is said to absorb the blood of slaughtered bodies on the battlefield by piercing their skin and draining them. So it seems to me that Oda is taking a more mythical route with his abilities which may be an indication that he is a mythical zoan of some sorts.
His ability is very VERY similar to that of the Yokai called the Jubokko though. His ability could fall into all three categories. If he is a mythical zoan he is a Jubokko-man. If he isn't, Oda's just used the Yokai as inspiration for Aramaki
Personally I'm hoping he's a logia with Jubokko-inspired abilities. In much the same way other Admiral Logias were scaled up versions of other Logias in some way (Magma > Fire, Ice > Snow), this absorption ability seems to be a scaled up version of the drying ability of the Suna Suna no Mi. I just think it would make a lot of sense given we know Logias affect the environment around them passively (e.g. Drum Island not snowing when Ace was present) and this hasn't been demonstrated by the other categories. We've seen Ryokugyu's path blooms flowers
I also think a plant Logia offers a lot more than a Zoan and marginally more than a Paramecia (just the intangibility really). A Zoan would limit the scale of abilities to those limited to that creature. A Logia seemingly would have no real limit for scale or what plants can be used or the methods in which they can be used for his advantage.
Given he can sustain/feed himself like a plant, this implies he is not a Paramecia but that his body has been changed either to something like a Jubokko or his body has become plants themselves (as is like all Logias).
How is he using "advanced CoA" when the bullets are just naturally sinking into the mass of elastic mochi that mades Katakuri's body and then falling from it? The exact same thing happens when Pedro slashes his leg without haki: he just cuts mochi. The other user is overcomplicating it this unnecessarily: the only thing that feels odd with Katakuri's "logia" is that mochi is a manmade element; in every other regard he works like one, hence why he was introduced as such but later retconed.
Luffy explicitly addresses that he can't fight Katakuri without haki and once he finds out his trick he reflects on how armament can hit the real body of a logia yet it didn't work against Katakuri because of his observation allowed him to dodge without getting hit. Never has it been hinted that Katakuri can be hit without armament; in my opinion, and since paramecia includes pretty much any power not fitting the two other classes, the only way his fruit can be a special paramecia is if he has all the properties of another class but breaks one
technicality. If Katakuri could be hit without armament then I see no reason why his fruit can't be just paramecia.
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Not an Eastern creature, doesn't fit the rest of mythical zoans (this includes Marco, in case you're thinking of him; his fruit is a modern Fenghuang more than anything).
Same way Luffy uses Armament so that he can stretch when hit with offensive Armament. Katakuri is using his Fruit and CoA at the same time to stop the bullets, then knock them back.
Kodama (木霊, 木魂 or 木魅) are spirits in Japanese folklore that inhabit trees. The term is also used to denote a tree in which a kodama supposedly resides. The phenomenon known as yamabiko, when sounds make a delayed echoing effect in mountains and valleys, is sometimes attributed to this kind of spirit and may also be referred to as "kodama".
These spirits are considered to nimbly bustle about mountains at will. A kodama's outer appearance is very much like an ordinary tree, but if one attempts to cut it down, one would become cursed, etc., and it is thus considered to have some kind of mysterious supernatural power. The knowledge of those trees that have kodama living in them is passed down by the elderly of that area over successive generations and they are protected, and it is also said that trees that have a kodama living in them are of certain species. There is also a theory that when old trees are cut, blood could come forth from them.
Kodama is also seen as something that can be understood as mountain gods, and a tree god from the 712 CE Kojiki, Kukunochi no Kami, has been interpreted as a kodama, and in the Heian period dictionary, the Wamyō Ruijushō, there is a statement on tree gods under the Japanese name "Kodama" (古多万). In The Tale of Genji, there are statements such as "is it an oni, a god (kami), a fox (kitsune), or a tree spirit (kodama)" and "the oni of a kodama", and thus, it can be seen that kodama are seen to be close to yōkai.
They are said to take on the appearance of atmospheric ghost lights, of beasts, and of humans, and there is also a story where a kodama who, in order to meet a human it fell in love with, took on the appearance of a human itself.
@Charlotte Horchata Thumbs up, mate. You perfectly put into words, what was bugging me about him potentially being a logia.
I think people would have a point if he would only create wood based stuff and therefore it would make it seem like he has got a "wood" logia, basically being OP's Hashirama, but based on everything you've said it really does not seem to add up, as he creates all different kinds of plants and flowers. He really seems to lack that uniformly element.
His awakening even makes mushrooms grow and stuff.
For now I'd bet my money on a plant based paramecia. That one fits everything very well imo.
Edit: Just thought about Baby 5's buki buki no mi.
Imo it illustrates very well, how Aramaki's fruit might function.
@Charlotte Horchata Thumbs up, mate. You perfectly put into words, what was bugging me about him potentially being a logia.
I think people would have a point if he would only create wood based stuff and therefore it would make it seem like he has got a "wood" logia, basically being OP's Hashirama, but based on everything you've said it really does not seem to add up, as he creates all different kinds of plants and flowers. He really seems to lack that uniformly element.
His awakening even makes mushrooms grow and stuff.
For now I'd bet my money on a plant based paramecia. That one fits everything very well imo.
Edit: Just thought about Baby 5's buki buki no mi.
Imo it illustrates very well, how Aramaki's fruit might function.
I don't understand what the issue would be. Caesar can make innumerable types of Gas. Caribou can make both solid and liquid state mud. Heck even Monet to a limited extent could make/use Ice and not just snow. why shouldn't a Plant logia be able to make innumerable types of plant?
Hashirama made more than wood too though. Mokuton was shown producing hallucinogenic flowers, trees and crops.
I personally dont care, but I think a Logia or Mythical Zoan would be the coolest options to go for.
You don't have to use scientific logic but artistic, that's the problem with your approach. Fluids and solids are too distinctive for the reader to work like a sole element; hence why we have ice, magma, fire, sand and so on, because you can portray them as single elements whether it's scientifically accurate or not (hence why we have both an ice and a snow fruit). Caesar's "Gasu Gasu" power includes oxygen, helium, nitrogen... —in other words, what the average reader would put into a single category of "gas" element because you can't distinguish each of them with ease so we simplify them into one concept.
That's not true though. Monet used snow but also to a limited extent can use that snow to make Ice. Caribou has been shown using solid and liquid mud. There's more nuance to it that you're ignoring for convenience/headcanon sake.
Yes, Helium, Oxygen etc. can all be put in 'Gas' category. This is literally the opposite of what you're trying to argue though as I can put Flowers and Vines into the 'Plant' category no problem. This idea that they need to be easily distinguishable is headcanon and has no basis based on any kind of evidence. Your argument is contrived.
Again, just look at it from that perspective and you will see how little a power that allows you to grow specific species of plants each with a distinctive shape identifiable by the public actually fits the category. How would Ryokugyu's intangibility even work, what would his body be made of? You can make an Ace's replica made of fire; an ice statue of Aokiji; dissolve Caesar into undefined gas...; but what about Ryokugyu? Once he's broken is his body turning into wood, into flowers, into leaves, into roots...? Or are you replicating his body with shape-defined trees, bushes and such?
Dumb argument. We've already seen him grow four different types of plant - two types completely passively. Again as stated above this doesn't rule out the Logia possibility.
If he were a Logia Oda could do whatever he wanted for intangibility. Could be made of vines, wood, leaves, anything he goddamn wanted. Much like Kuzan it would be a case of "intangibility" while remaining tangible - just a way to heal from wounds and be unaffected by attacks. Just because you personally cannot visualise it does not make it impossible. Oda's creative - give him some credit.
And I insist, I can see the argument behind "flora" being natural and therefore fitting a logia. If Oda follows this reasoning I will buy it. But it's clear to me that it doesn't work as well as the rest because you can't depict plants as a single, homogeneous element; they are too complex and have too-defined shapes for that to work in the way "a man made of fire", "a man made of electricity", "a man made of smoke", "a man made of snow"... and yes, "a man made of gas" do work.
Yeah that's exactly why being a Logia cannot be ruled out. Same for Mud and Gas as we've already seen. I wouldnt be surprised if Sakazuki could also create some solid-state hardened Magma either. All of these can be a single homogeneous type of element but have multiple facets and complexities.
An argument against this is something like Pica's Ishi Ishi no Mi. He could assimilate stone but specifically stone - he couldn't assimilate earth, dirt etc. Surely by your own baseless rules he should be a Logia type, no?
Special Paramecia was given to Kat because Oda wanted to leave Logia as found in nature only.
Plants exist without human interference so that there is no need for for special Paramecia.
There are also no Paramecia nor Logia based on living things that I recall. So he is some kind of Zoan or Oda is being liberal with the rules and will give GB a Logia found in nature but is NOT an element. . . . Special Logia?
Cmon dude he's not Logia, it's either Mythical Zoan or Special paramecia, a logia doesn't have side Tricks, He literally can survive without eating he was shown absorbing other Nutrients,
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it's either Mythical Zoan or Special paramecia, a logia doesn't have side Tricks, He literally can survive without eating he was shown absorbing other Nutrients, 