Character Discussion Why Sanji has more self respect as a fighter than Zoro, without even having fight oriented dream?

[Manos. AsuraZoro]

What is wrong with this guys ?
All the treads they create to shit on zoro, could be used way more effective against sanji.
This magic sword uses Zoro energy dude, whatever is that magic that scares you, comes from Zoro. There is not a panel in the manga that shows enma uses energy without taking it from zoro first.
There are weapons that only kings can weild and enma is one of those. The previous owner was oden, the guy that beat kaido and make him scared for his life even 20 years later.
To gain an ability from a sword is something so wrong for you when your favourite characters have powers from experiment and df lol
And no, sanji can't make a wish to be strong and everything would be ok.
He hated everything that had to do with his family, yet you know what he did.
And i am not even bashing sanji but your take on zoro is full of bias and hate.
Don't try to bs the character who trains more than everyone, with bs words like shortcuts and magic, when sanji gain so much power from a pajama. Even his fire was hinted to be something from experiment and queen didn't have knowledge about it because sanji was a failure project

 

[BuggyDGod]

Serious.

Sanji doesn't have strength dream, so he can get stronger by gathering 7 dragonballs, wishing to be stronger and it still wouldn't ruin his character. Yet Oda writes him as this character who doesn't want a shortcuts to strength

Spoiler

Which is a total contrast compared to Zoro, who seeks out every possible shortcut to getting stronger, like magic swords. Which is jarring because his character is purely just about fighting and getting stronger, yet he has no self respect to get stronger with just normal swords

Spoiler

Zoro gets an unfair advantage to his road to WSS compared to his other rivals (whoever they are). There are very finite number of graded swords and only lucky people can get their hands on them and gain their powers. Not to mention Zoro gets 3 of them.
So if Zoro's other rivals weren't lucky enough to get a good graded sword, they are automatically at the massive disadvantage.

What if a future challenger that challenges Zoro for his WSS title and only loses by a hair because he had a normal sword, while Zoro had 3 legendary swords? Wouldn't that show how much better swordsman who didn't use magic swords is?

And no, the "Zoro needs to train with them" excuse doesn't work because the "training" is done offscreen, showing how little it takes and in return you gain so much more power than you could ever get with training with a normal sword.

Kozaburo calls normal swords "crap"

If Zoro actually followed his character, he should throw his magic swords away and use "crap" swords to be beat Mihawk and prove that he is WSS without needing magic swords and can do it using any swords.

I have no idea how you can be a fan of Zoro and like him using magic swords. Right now, the road to WSS title is just about who gets stronger swords

Sanji is literally genetically enhanced and uses a suit. Does someone like Garp cheat by enhancements? No. Does he use a suit no?

Every top level swordsman has named swords. Even WB had a supreme grade sword, Shanks has gryphon, Roger has Ace a supreme grade sword....

So literally the only cheater is Sanji. No other hand to hand guy cheats like him besides other Vinsmoke jobbers. Every top tier swordsman we see uses a good sword.

Sanji is basically worse than a steroid user who uses technology too to get an edge.

 

[Finalbeta]

 

[RYNO]

Bro me and you both know queen would not have even come close to wiping out the alliance. At most Jinbe and Brook would have to handle him if Sanji got clapped.

This has nothing to do with what we think or know about the situation only thing matters is that sanji believes that if he doesn't win people will die, putting peoples live before his hatred for his father is the right thing to do.

he didnt broke it by using his hands he broke it by using something other than his feet

sanji only uses his legs because he doesn't want hurt his hands in a fight losing the ability to cook thats all and believe his hands are only for cooking and not fighting.

 

[JoNdule]

If Zoro was serious, he wouldn't ask Mihawk (WSS) to teach him even for Luffy's sake.
He wouldn't accept magical sword Enma
He wouldn't claim to be dirty to beat King if he has to.

This whole WSS code and pride is nonsense
Same with "I will never lose again" a cap
Oda poorly wrote Zoro's dream and Posthawk

 

[bennbeckman]

Germa Sanji... No shortcuts there

 

[Monster Zoro's Tesla Supplier]

If Zoro was serious, he wouldn't ask Mihawk (WSS) to teach him even for Luffy's sake.
He wouldn't accept magical sword Enma
He wouldn't claim to be dirty to beat King if he has to.

This whole WSS code and pride is nonsense
Same with "I will never lose again" a cap
Oda poorly wrote Zoro's dream and Posthawk

I agree Zoro is a dipshit but when did he ever lose after Mihawk?

 

[Peroroncino]

If Zoro was serious, he wouldn't ask Mihawk (WSS) to teach him even for Luffy's sake.
He wouldn't accept magical sword Enma
He wouldn't claim to be dirty to beat King if he has to.

This whole WSS code and pride is nonsense
Same with "I will never lose again" a cap
Oda poorly wrote Zoro's dream and Posthawk

Nonsense all conquerors humble themselves at some point luffy did to boa zoro did to mihawk oden did to orochi and roger did to wb
Stay salty

 

[Monster Zoro's Tesla Supplier]

Nonsense all conquerors humble themselves at some point luffy did to boa zoro did to mihawk oden did to orochi and roger did to wb
Stay salty

Sorry, but what the FUCK are you talking about? Oden wasn't humbled by Orochi. Neither was Roger humbled by anyone, he already knew there were people on par with him since Garp existed.. Luffy humbled Hancock, not the other way around. Zoro being humbled by Mihawk is the only good point there.

 

[nik87]

can do it using any swords.

That's what Sandai Kitetsu is for, sister.

 

[Peroroncino]

Sorry, but what the FUCK are you talking about? Oden wasn't humbled by Orochi. Neither was Roger humbled by anyone, he already knew there were people on par with him since Garp existed.. Luffy humbled Hancock, not the other way around. Zoro being humbled by Mihawk is the only good point there.

Dogeza is literally the act of humbling oneself when asking for something lol.
Looks like you comprehend what hou are reading

 

[DonWick]

Sanjis body is a shortcut he’s an android.

 

[gz89]

Bullshit.
He bow down to his greatest rival to protect his captain

Trained forever to become the WSS

Risked his hand back in Loguetown

Enma didnt suddenly gives his magical haki, its his own.

On the contrary we have a guy with daddy issues, abandoned his crew, attack his captain even when he came to "save" his shitty ass, he depends heavily on his magic exoskeleton and he even used his daddy's RS when he said many times he wont use it.

No my friend a cook who trained only with Zeff and Okamas has little to no self respect against a guy who's whole life is to become the strongest swordsman and on top of that risked his life twice to save his captain even if it means his dream is over.

Post automatically merged: Aug 4, 2022

Also Oda clearly doesnt give two shits about Sanji because after Jabra in EL he was just a joke. All he did from EL until Wano was fighting Absalom, Wadatsumi with Jinbe's help, fucking nonstop nosebleeds, getting his leg cracked by Vergo, fodderized by Mingo, kicked his brothers and Oven. This so called "fighter" named Sanji didnt do shit for almost 15 years. Just try to imagine a "fighter" that doesnt have a proper fight for 15 years. It's just ridiculous

 

[kurwa]

He bow down to his greatest rival

and in return got trained by WSS
Absolute loser. Imagine how many swordsmen actually are training by themselves.

to protect his captain

From what? lmao

Trained forever to become the WSS

so? Everyone trains, yet for some reason his training is special and justifies him getting magical sword shortcuts? huh?

Risked his hand back in Loguetown

What's that got to do with anything? lmao what?

Enma didnt suddenly gives his magical haki, its his own

Actually it does give him advanced haki to damage Kaido on the roof. Without Enma, Zoro wouldn't have been able to scratch Kaido.

On the contrary we have a guy with daddy issues, abandoned his crew, attack his captain even when he came to "save" his shitty ass, he depends heavily on his magic exoskeleton and he even used his daddy's RS when he said many times he wont use it.

Yes, Zoro's character will never get pushed into hard situations because that's how 1 dimensional he is.

But I have no idea why you keep comparing Zoro to Sanji, who doesn't have a strength dream and can get with any shortcut without cheapening his dream and goal.

No my friend a cook who trained only with Zeff and Okamas has little to no self respect against a guy who's whole life is to become the strongest swordsman and on top of that risked his life twice to save his captain even if it means his dream is over.

Tell me which character was reluctant about using their handout power up?
Tell me which character actually destroyed his power up?
Tell me which character keeps thirsting after magical sword power up?

 

[gz89]

and in return got trained by WSS
Absolute loser. Imagine how many swordsmen actually are training by themselves.

From what? lmao

so? Everyone trains, yet for some reason his training is special and justifies him getting magical sword shortcuts? huh?

What's that got to do with anything? lmao what?

Actually it does give him advanced haki to damage Kaido on the roof. Without Enma, Zoro wouldn't have been able to scratch Kaido.

Yes, Zoro's character will never get pushed into hard situations because that's how 1 dimensional he is.

But I have no idea why you keep comparing Zoro to Sanji, who doesn't have a strength dream and can get with any shortcut without cheapening his dream and goal.

Tell me which character was reluctant about using their handout power up?
Tell me which character actually destroyed his power up?
Tell me which character keeps thirsting after magical sword power up?

He swallow his pride and asked his rival to train him exactly so he can be stronger to protect his captain/crew like he did in TB or even in rooftop. The enma didnt give him magical powers its stated that its ZORO's haki and not some magic power or Oden's haki that gives him strength. Enma drives out the user's power not somene's else.

If zoro wanted shortcuts he would murder Mihawk while he slept and claimed to be the WSS. He doesnt prefer shortcuts, on the contrary he devoted his whole life training while the cook depended on his daddy's genetics.

 

[Monster Zoro's Tesla Supplier]

He swallow his pride and asked his rival to train him exactly so he can be stronger to protect his captain/crew like he did in TB or even in rooftop. The enma didnt give him magical powers its stated that its ZORO's haki and not some magic power or Oden's haki that gives him strength. Enma drives out the user's power not somene's else.

If zoro wanted shortcuts he would murder Mihawk while he slept and claimed to be the WSS. He doesnt prefer shortcuts, on the contrary he devoted his whole life training while the cook depended on his daddy's genetics.

Murdering people while they sleep often fails in One Piece. Ace tried that with Whitebeard, Whitebeard's observation haki allowed him to beat Ace's ass while sleep.

 

[kurwa]

He swallow his pride and asked his rival to train him

Yes, we are truly in the bad timeline where zoro is bowing down to everyone in order to get shortcuts

You think getting trained by WSS is not a shortcut compared to other swordsmen who are training on their own to beat the WSS?

exactly so he can be stronger to protect his captain/crew like he did in TB

He never did. Kuma was Dragon's ally and Luffy was always safe.

or even in rooftop.

lmao, he did not that loser. If Oda wanted Law could've easily teleported Luffy everywhere on the roof.

The enma didnt give him magical powers its stated that its ZORO's haki and not some magic power or Oden's haki that gives him strength

Actually it did give him advanced haki shortcut that it took Luffy whole arc to train to get.
Nowhere did I mention it wasn't Zoro's haki, but Enma makes Zoro's haki advanced haki in order to cut Kaido like Scabbards or Luffy.

Was Zoro's haki ever mentioned or was it always Enma the one mentioned?
Did Zoro ever cut Kaido without Oda focusing on Enma glowing, or was it always Enma?

If zoro wanted shortcuts he would murder Mihawk while he slept and claimed to be the WSS

or you know... gathering magic swords and kneeling to Mihawk?

You think Zoro could ever kill Mihawk in his sleep? lol? Not to mention no one would believe such a weakling ever killed Mihawk in a fight. So it's a pointless plan

He doesnt prefer shortcuts

Yet he uses magic swords instead of regular swords, hm?

on the contrary he devoted his whole life training

So like everyone else in the story?

while the cook depended on his daddy's genetics

You mean the thing Sanji only unlocked by accident in the last 20 chapters of the 1050+ chapter story? Meanwhile Zoro keeps suckling on magic swords for 1050+ chapters for power ups?

Also, you didn't answer my last questions:

Tell me which character was reluctant about using their handout power up?
Tell me which character actually destroyed his power up?
Tell me which character keeps thirsting after magical sword power up?

 

[gz89]

Yes, we are truly in the bad timeline where zoro is bowing down to everyone in order to get shortcuts

You think getting trained by WSS is not a shortcut compared to other swordsmen who are training on their own to beat the WSS?

He never did. Kuma was Dragon's ally and Luffy was always safe.

lmao, he did not that loser. If Oda wanted Law could've easily teleported Luffy everywhere on the roof.

Actually it did give him advanced haki shortcut that it took Luffy whole arc to train to get.
Nowhere did I mention it wasn't Zoro's haki, but Enma makes Zoro's haki advanced haki in order to cut Kaido like Scabbards or Luffy.

Was Zoro's haki ever mentioned or was it always Enma the one mentioned?
Did Zoro ever cut Kaido without Oda focusing on Enma glowing, or was it always Enma?

or you know... gathering magic swords and kneeling to Mihawk?

You think Zoro could ever kill Mihawk in his sleep? lol? Not to mention no one would believe such a weakling ever killed Mihawk in a fight. So it's a pointless plan

Yet he uses magic swords instead of regular swords, hm?

So like everyone else in the story?

You mean the thing Sanji only unlocked by accident in the last 20 chapters of the 1050+ chapter story? Meanwhile Zoro keeps suckling on magic swords for 1050+ chapters for power ups?

Also, you didn't answer my last questions:

I really dont understand why you continue this conversation about magic swords. Its not magic it uses only the owner's power i dont care to continue about this. By your logic WB's bisento or Roger's sword were magic and gave them power jusr because they were in the category of supreme blades?

Killing mihawk in his sleep was just for fun of course he wouldnt try something like that, only Ace was stupid and not proud enough to do this against WB. Zoro would never do something so embarrassing.

Also by your logic Luffy took the shortcut for training with Ray, or Robin being under the RA etc etc. Zoro had to make a decision, to be stronger firstly for his captain/crew and second for his dream of being WSS and he decided to swallow hiw pride against his strongest "enemy". Its not like he asked everyone he met to train him or bowing to every better swordsman.

I dont have a problem if he didnt comlpain about RS, he could using it as many times he wants.
Sanji destroying RS after using it 2 times doesnt change the fact that he used it despite shitting in his daddy.
Zoro is a swordsman whats the problem for wanting to obtain supreme swords? If he tried to hold a sword with some DF or random powers i could say you are right but he doesnt. Enma is just a sword that uses Zoro's haki thats it i dont understand why you keep refering about magic swords.

 

[BillSlipton]

I agree Zoro is a dipshit but when did he ever lose after Mihawk?

Lmao many times. The yeti Brothers come to mind

Post automatically merged: Aug 4, 2022

I really dont understand why you continue this conversation about magic swords. Its not magic it uses only the owner's power i dont care to continue about this. By your logic WB's bisento or Roger's sword were magic and gave them power jusr because they were in the category of supreme blades?

Killing mihawk in his sleep was just for fun of course he wouldnt try something like that, only Ace was stupid and not proud enough to do this against WB. Zoro would never do something so embarrassing.

Also by your logic Luffy took the shortcut for training with Ray, or Robin being under the RA etc etc. Zoro had to make a decision, to be stronger firstly for his captain/crew and second for his dream of being WSS and he decided to swallow hiw pride against his strongest "enemy". Its not like he asked everyone he met to train him or bowing to every better swordsman.

I dont have a problem if he didnt comlpain about RS, he could using it as many times he wants.
Sanji destroying RS after using it 2 times doesnt change the fact that he used it despite shitting in his daddy.
Zoro is a swordsman whats the problem for wanting to obtain supreme swords? If he tried to hold a sword with some DF or random powers i could say you are right but he doesnt. Enma is just a sword that uses Zoro's haki thats it i dont understand why you keep refering about magic swords.

You're lying. Reread the original post. When zoro gets Shusui he straight up says the attacks are stronger automatically. Just less control. A reoccurring theme eh?

 

[Monster Zoro's Tesla Supplier]

I really dont understand why you continue this conversation about magic swords. Its not magic it uses only the owner's power i dont care to continue about this. By your logic WB's bisento or Roger's sword were magic and gave them power jusr because they were in the category of supreme blades?

Killing mihawk in his sleep was just for fun of course he wouldnt try something like that, only Ace was stupid and not proud enough to do this against WB. Zoro would never do something so embarrassing.

Also by your logic Luffy took the shortcut for training with Ray, or Robin being under the RA etc etc. Zoro had to make a decision, to be stronger firstly for his captain/crew and second for his dream of being WSS and he decided to swallow hiw pride against his strongest "enemy". Its not like he asked everyone he met to train him or bowing to every better swordsman.

I dont have a problem if he didnt comlpain about RS, he could using it as many times he wants.
Sanji destroying RS after using it 2 times doesnt change the fact that he used it despite shitting in his daddy.
Zoro is a swordsman whats the problem for wanting to obtain supreme swords? If he tried to hold a sword with some DF or random powers i could say you are right but he doesnt. Enma is just a sword that uses Zoro's haki thats it i dont understand why you keep refering about magic swords.

Fyi I sort of agree with you but technically Rayleigh only told him what to do, he didn't exactly teach it to him and hold his hand all the way, he even left during the last like five months of his training. Like, by this logic, Albert Einstein was actually a fraud and his teacher is the real genius for teaching him everything he knows, right? Nope. It's up to you to put two and two together, ultimately. No matter how much people TELL you the right answers for things you need to come to your own conclusions of what it is and be able to build on it your self. Like how Luffy learns how to counter a future sight user, via being so fast and so unpredictable that they can't block. Rayleigh never tought him that, he made his own inferences and conclusions on how to fight and tie with Katakuri.