Spoiler General Kingdom Spoiler
- Thread starter Guan Yu
- Start date
- Tags cruzeiro > your fav team kaneki & mutin kouen > all ousen ousen>cruzeiro riboku>ousen shin > ouhon wingdom
Like I said to Lee, Kanki is getting up there with Kyoukai for a character that makes me less invested in an arc.
First of all, whenever Kanki is the focus of an arc, somebody else looks underwhelming. Zhao Hills, Keisha gets jobbered so Kanki can succeed. Battle of the Great Dumpling, Kochou doesn't even get to do anything cool on-screen and Sei somehow gets talked down to by an uneducated, emo bandit after having dealt with great intellects like Ryofui, King Ouken and Riboku.
I guess you could also include Riboku in this arc. Personally I don't think he has actually looked bad but folk are ripping into him so include him if you want. Lol.
Secondly, Kanki and his "method" of warfare get grossly over wanked by Hara. Kanki won Zhao Hills as effectively as he did because Shin killed Keisha. Kanki succeeds against Kochou because Shin arrived 1/2 a fucking day earlier than expected. Does any of this get acknowledged by anybody? No. Lol.
Not to mention Kanki's high risk/high reward methods border on insanity and are only considered genius because the high reward aspect payed off while the high risk aspect doesn't get acknowledged as nearly as much as it should. There is a reason as to why we can see other Generals like Riboku get to lose. It is because Generals like Riboku can take an L to their Plan A and move on to Plans B and C. If Kanki's Plan A didn't work, he would typically be completely fucked.
Rumble hit the nail on the head when he said that what makes Kanki truly dangerous isn't his tactics, it is his complete lack of restraint. Most Generals are loyal to King and/or country and so must wage war sustainably so that their war efforts don't drain their own nation and their own own troops.
Kanki holds no loyalty to anyone nor anything, not even his to his own troops. Kanki would happily grind down his own army for shits and giggles if it meant scalping the enemy boss. Pyrrhic victories mean nothing to Kanki because it doesn't affect him personally so he doesn't care if he loses an entire army.
Which makes it even weirder that he loses his shit over Raido dying. Like, Kanki man, you revel in high risk/high reward strategies and tear opponents limb from limb for laughs but get pissed when someone force feeds you your own medicine? Lol.
Which brings me to the last reason I don't like Kanki's character even if I do think it is probably an intentional part of it that will hopefully be addressed in the future.
Kanki is a feckin man child. Lel.
Like I said, him losing his shit over Raido was hypocritical and his opinion of the world is basically "the world sucks, so I'm going to make it even shittier".
If this shit gets addressed and called out on, fine but if it doesn't then Kanki is this weird, overrated man child whose motivation is basically the "we live in a society" meme.
Eh, the backstory was fine but it didn't endear me to Kanki more.
I can see where Kid Kanki's (damn, sounds like a rapper) twisted logic originated from but it is still twisted, nihilistic drivel.
To be fair, Kanki is meant to be a villain that is on the protagonists' side by coincidence. He is meant to be a completely despicable character that no sane person would actually like to get to know personally.
It is just Kanki's convoluted, almost contrived method of warfare gets tedious along with absolutely nothing and nobody calling him out on any of his stupidity. I mean, he nearly got 2/3 of Qin's new gen Generals in Ouhon and Shin killed with his wasteful shenanigans ffs. Lol.
So yeah, I don't like Kanki, I find the bloke's presence increasingly tedious and while I have peddled the scenario of him fleeing to somewhere like Yan to be defeated by a more experienced General Shin, I honestly wouldn't care at this point if Kanki's head was removed by Kohaku Kou in the next chapter.
First of all, whenever Kanki is the focus of an arc, somebody else looks underwhelming. Zhao Hills, Keisha gets jobbered so Kanki can succeed. Battle of the Great Dumpling, Kochou doesn't even get to do anything cool on-screen and Sei somehow gets talked down to by an uneducated, emo bandit after having dealt with great intellects like Ryofui, King Ouken and Riboku.
I guess you could also include Riboku in this arc. Personally I don't think he has actually looked bad but folk are ripping into him so include him if you want. Lol.
Secondly, Kanki and his "method" of warfare get grossly over wanked by Hara. Kanki won Zhao Hills as effectively as he did because Shin killed Keisha. Kanki succeeds against Kochou because Shin arrived 1/2 a fucking day earlier than expected. Does any of this get acknowledged by anybody? No. Lol.
Not to mention Kanki's high risk/high reward methods border on insanity and are only considered genius because the high reward aspect payed off while the high risk aspect doesn't get acknowledged as nearly as much as it should. There is a reason as to why we can see other Generals like Riboku get to lose. It is because Generals like Riboku can take an L to their Plan A and move on to Plans B and C. If Kanki's Plan A didn't work, he would typically be completely fucked.
Rumble hit the nail on the head when he said that what makes Kanki truly dangerous isn't his tactics, it is his complete lack of restraint. Most Generals are loyal to King and/or country and so must wage war sustainably so that their war efforts don't drain their own nation and their own own troops.
Kanki holds no loyalty to anyone nor anything, not even his to his own troops. Kanki would happily grind down his own army for shits and giggles if it meant scalping the enemy boss. Pyrrhic victories mean nothing to Kanki because it doesn't affect him personally so he doesn't care if he loses an entire army.
Which makes it even weirder that he loses his shit over Raido dying. Like, Kanki man, you revel in high risk/high reward strategies and tear opponents limb from limb for laughs but get pissed when someone force feeds you your own medicine? Lol.
Which brings me to the last reason I don't like Kanki's character even if I do think it is probably an intentional part of it that will hopefully be addressed in the future.
Kanki is a feckin man child. Lel.
Like I said, him losing his shit over Raido was hypocritical and his opinion of the world is basically "the world sucks, so I'm going to make it even shittier".
If this shit gets addressed and called out on, fine but if it doesn't then Kanki is this weird, overrated man child whose motivation is basically the "we live in a society" meme.
Eh, the backstory was fine but it didn't endear me to Kanki more.
I can see where Kid Kanki's (damn, sounds like a rapper) twisted logic originated from but it is still twisted, nihilistic drivel.
To be fair, Kanki is meant to be a villain that is on the protagonists' side by coincidence. He is meant to be a completely despicable character that no sane person would actually like to get to know personally.
It is just Kanki's convoluted, almost contrived method of warfare gets tedious along with absolutely nothing and nobody calling him out on any of his stupidity. I mean, he nearly got 2/3 of Qin's new gen Generals in Ouhon and Shin killed with his wasteful shenanigans ffs. Lol.
So yeah, I don't like Kanki, I find the bloke's presence increasingly tedious and while I have peddled the scenario of him fleeing to somewhere like Yan to be defeated by a more experienced General Shin, I honestly wouldn't care at this point if Kanki's head was removed by Kohaku Kou in the next chapter.
I didn’t think Hara could possibly make me sympathize with someone who butchers (fictional) women and children, but damn, that speech he gave about how those in the middle could stop those on top from harming those on the bottom but don’t, and therefore they deserve all of the violence he wants to inflict on them…I can’t lie, I jumped on the Kanki train at that point.
He is definitely a petulant child, an emo, and a maniac, but that backstory for me was the perfect rationalization for the more heinous actions of the Saki clan imo.
He is definitely a petulant child, an emo, and a maniac, but that backstory for me was the perfect rationalization for the more heinous actions of the Saki clan imo.
I mean, is it really that great a rationalisation though?
Can't say I can get on board with Kanki's point when he is just so much worse than the vague "those guys" he bitched about.
"Why ignore the problem when you can be an even bigger problem!"
-Kanki, some arsehole, 3 digit number B.C.
K=Kanki.
SG=Saki Guy.
K: "So anyway, our true enemy are those in the middle!"
SG: "So like are we going to aim to do a lower class revolution against the bourgeoisie?"
K: "No."
SG: "So are we going to do a Yellow Turban Rebellion and claim the Mandate of Heaven?"
K: "Nope."
SG: ".... So what are we going to do?"
K: "Rape, pillage, plunder and torture!"
SG: "..... To the middle and upper classes only?"
K: "Nope, to everybody."
SG: "Won't that make us undeniably worse than the middle class you just bitched about?"
K: "Probably."
SG: "......"
K: "I'll let you skin babies alive and place their defiled corpses on pointy sticks."
SG: "Somehow, this is convincing."
SG=Saki Guy.
K: "So anyway, our true enemy are those in the middle!"
SG: "So like are we going to aim to do a lower class revolution against the bourgeoisie?"
K: "No."
SG: "So are we going to do a Yellow Turban Rebellion and claim the Mandate of Heaven?"
K: "Nope."
SG: ".... So what are we going to do?"
K: "Rape, pillage, plunder and torture!"
SG: "..... To the middle and upper classes only?"
K: "Nope, to everybody."
SG: "Won't that make us undeniably worse than the middle class you just bitched about?"
K: "Probably."
SG: "......"
K: "I'll let you skin babies alive and place their defiled corpses on pointy sticks."
SG: "Somehow, this is convincing."
"Why ignore the problem when you can be an even bigger problem!"
-Kanki, some arsehole, 3 digit number B.C.
Well which lower class individuals is Kanki victimizing? He said his target was those in the “middle”, and the ones on top, which is what he has targeted so far. Those in society’s “middle”, IE everyone who is not some form of nobility or lives exiled lives like Kanki and his clansmen do (did). Kanki has exclusively targeted the peasants and civilians with his rage, those middle-dwelling folk, while of course not sparing any generals, military officers, or noblemen that he comes across.
It’s a childish and simply ideology for sure, and one that has no end point or goal and is just causing pain for pain’s sake, but I think Kanki has stayed faithfully to the ideology he expressed when he was a young rapper. Lol
It’s a childish and simply ideology for sure, and one that has no end point or goal and is just causing pain for pain’s sake, but I think Kanki has stayed faithfully to the ideology he expressed when he was a young rapper. Lol
I would have thought in this setting that peasants and most civilians in general would be considered lower class?
Middle class would be more like merchants, doctors, bureaucrats etc. Think Ryofui's origins.
Like, I'm pretty sure most of those villagers in those Zhao Hills that Kanki had slaughtered and defiled would be considered lower class. I'm also pretty sure Kanki didn't go around asking background questions about class or privilege level. He spared nobody. Never has done, never will.
Kanki wants to burn the world down. He doesn't care who gets caught in the flames of his unhinged temper tantrum against the planet.
Middle class would be more like merchants, doctors, bureaucrats etc. Think Ryofui's origins.
Like, I'm pretty sure most of those villagers in those Zhao Hills that Kanki had slaughtered and defiled would be considered lower class. I'm also pretty sure Kanki didn't go around asking background questions about class or privilege level. He spared nobody. Never has done, never will.
Kanki wants to burn the world down. He doesn't care who gets caught in the flames of his unhinged temper tantrum against the planet.
Nah I don’t think Kanki views class in relation to wealth, I think Kanki views class in relation to power structure and who is targeted.
For example people such as bandits would be low class because they are targeted by power structures. Peasants would be “in the middle” since they are not targeted by states and soldiers and such, and the “top” would be the state itself (generals, nobility, politicians, statesmen, etc).
The Saki clan would’ve been the absolute lowest of the low in Kanki’s eyes, as they are bandits who are targeted and oppressed even by other bandits. Those in the middle like peasants are not actively targeted by the state like bandits are.
This is why Kanki says “those in the middle greatly outnumber those at the top, they could stop the top from targeting those on the bottom but they don’t.” It’s not about wealth, it’s about who those on top target and who they don’t.
Yeah by Kanki’s own definition of class I would agree that peasants are “in the middle”.
For example people such as bandits would be low class because they are targeted by power structures. Peasants would be “in the middle” since they are not targeted by states and soldiers and such, and the “top” would be the state itself (generals, nobility, politicians, statesmen, etc).
The Saki clan would’ve been the absolute lowest of the low in Kanki’s eyes, as they are bandits who are targeted and oppressed even by other bandits. Those in the middle like peasants are not actively targeted by the state like bandits are.
This is why Kanki says “those in the middle greatly outnumber those at the top, they could stop the top from targeting those on the bottom but they don’t.” It’s not about wealth, it’s about who those on top target and who they don’t.
Yeah by Kanki’s own definition of class I would agree that peasants are “in the middle”.
....... Alright, I get this is supposed to be from Kanki's point of view but why the feck wouldn't anybody target bandits? They are stealing, pillaging, murderous degenerate rapists. Lol.
Kanki himself didn't tolerate other bandit clans causing trouble for his clan, so why would any society tolerate bandits at all?
If that is their definition of oppression then I'm pretty sure those bandits wouldn't be oppressed if they had been peasants instead of rapists.
This just sounds like an extremely strange attempt at justification but hey, Kanki is a completely mentally unhinged man child so I guess it doesn't have to make sense to somebody that isn't Kanki.
Sure as hell doesn't make him sympathetic though. Lol.
Kanki himself didn't tolerate other bandit clans causing trouble for his clan, so why would any society tolerate bandits at all?
If that is their definition of oppression then I'm pretty sure those bandits wouldn't be oppressed if they had been peasants instead of rapists.
This just sounds like an extremely strange attempt at justification but hey, Kanki is a completely mentally unhinged man child so I guess it doesn't have to make sense to somebody that isn't Kanki.
Sure as hell doesn't make him sympathetic though. Lol.
Bingo. Kanki hates nothing more than the oppressors, and the neutral party. What Ei Sei saw in his eyes was not hopelessness, but someone who strived to lift the oppressed from the clutches of society to become greater.
Kanki doesn't give two shits about Shin, but I think deep down he respects his lowly background as a slave who still managed to climb the ranks of the military through sheer force of will. I think the same could be said for Mougou.
Kanki is the perfect foil to Shin, which is why I'm hoping he survives this campaign for a potential showdown between the two down the line. A true conflict of ideology.
Kanki doesn't give two shits about Shin, but I think deep down he respects his lowly background as a slave who still managed to climb the ranks of the military through sheer force of will. I think the same could be said for Mougou.
Kanki is the perfect foil to Shin, which is why I'm hoping he survives this campaign for a potential showdown between the two down the line. A true conflict of ideology.
Well this ain’t Kanki’s words, this is just my interpretation lol, but look at the Saki clan: they were all just orphaned little kids with no place to go. It’s not like they could’ve just wandered off and joined peasant households, most peasants aren’t going to spend the money or time to take in charity children who aren’t their own blood. And it’s not like the state of Qin gives any shits about orphans (maybe someone like Sei would but Sei is an exception among Kings), so the state probably doesn’t have enough orphanages set up to support every single orphan. There’s going to be some kids who get left behind.
So these kids wind up in a place where they have to be bandits and steal to survive. Either that or die in the wilderness which isn’t exactly a choice.
That said, the Saki clan were still ostracized and victimized by society and the nobles alike, even though they were not murderers, degenerates, and rapists, and were literally just helpless children trying to survive. You had that one noble who would even kidnap and torture helpless children for his own amusement.
You have to respect how Kanki took such a group and turned them into probably the most heinous terror clan in China. If I had grown up in the Saki clan, I would be diehard loyal to Kanki for this. Lol
Idk, I have serious respect for how hard he empowered the Saki clan. Like I said, he turned a bunch of helpless children into a complete shock and awe slaughter clan, and he did so just so nobody would victimize them anymore. (And because he is also a rage filled psycho, lol)
Like I said, we still need Kanki’s backstory from before he joined the Saki clan, and I am 100% betting that Kanki was an ex-slave just like Shin, except that Shin had a relatively kind childhood for a slave. I’m betting Kanki had a true slave’s upbringing, beatings and violence and all.
So these kids wind up in a place where they have to be bandits and steal to survive. Either that or die in the wilderness which isn’t exactly a choice.
That said, the Saki clan were still ostracized and victimized by society and the nobles alike, even though they were not murderers, degenerates, and rapists, and were literally just helpless children trying to survive. You had that one noble who would even kidnap and torture helpless children for his own amusement.
You have to respect how Kanki took such a group and turned them into probably the most heinous terror clan in China. If I had grown up in the Saki clan, I would be diehard loyal to Kanki for this. Lol
Idk, I have serious respect for how hard he empowered the Saki clan. Like I said, he turned a bunch of helpless children into a complete shock and awe slaughter clan, and he did so just so nobody would victimize them anymore. (And because he is also a rage filled psycho, lol)
Like I said, we still need Kanki’s backstory from before he joined the Saki clan, and I am 100% betting that Kanki was an ex-slave just like Shin, except that Shin had a relatively kind childhood for a slave. I’m betting Kanki had a true slave’s upbringing, beatings and violence and all.
