General & Others Next Straw Hat Crew Members and the Grand Fleet

[Logiko]

You want people to argue based on your arbitary rules whilst you can't even agree on basic principles.

Like what if i reject your premisse of your twelve pillars or whatever it is? What then? Again arguments are based on the axioms and their logical conclusions, if you just sit there like a redditor and make up rules that are heavely based on your personal opinion and reject any coutner argument then what?

Anyone can just say they find your pillars not suficiently reasoned out, it doesn't have to be a complex argument.

I hear you so lets take that to the beginning and tell me.

What makes a strawhat, a strawhat ?

 

[Sigran101]

My arguments are not necessarally right, but I wasn't proved otherwise.
I asked multiple time for people to come up with a set of rules and see if I was wrong or not in my own set to predict a new strawhat, without success, the reply is always "we can't discuss with you".

I'm always open to the discussion. In fact I've added the twelveth pillar following a discussion with one of you (can't remember who).

No one tries anymore because we've done it a thousand times and it's always the same result. "You just don't understand the subtext" or some other nonsense. It's just not worth writing an essay to point out where you're wrong when everyone in the thread already agrees with us and you're just going to make up some psuedo-intellectual babble to defend yourself.

 

[Logiko]

No one tries anymore because we've done it a thousand times and it's always the same result. "You just don't understand the subtext" or some other nonsense. It's just not worth writing an essay to point out where you're wrong when everyone in the thread already agrees with us and you're just going to make up some psuedo-intellectual babble to defend yourself.

Same question, I'll try a different approach. For you..

What makes a strawhat, a strawhat ?

 

[Warback]

I hear you so lets take that to the beginning and tell me.

What makes a strawhat, a strawhat ?

Just tell me what your 12 pillars thing is, because there's is no way you have some objective way of measuring strawhat candidates with 12 non-redudant, non-irrelevant "pillars".

 

[Logiko]

Just tell me what your 12 pillars thing is, because there's is no way you have some objective way of measuring strawhat candidates with 12 non-redudant, non-irrelevant "pillars".

The 12 Pillars are the second part of my theory consisting in searching for the most probable crewmate.

The first part (the Seven rules) are what every character ABSOLUTELY needs to become a worthy candidate and the 12 Pillars are the principle that creates a strawhat deeper. The first seven rules must absolutely all be fit while the 12 pillars are based on a set of points attributed on each categories. I attributed a number of point in fonction on how important I felt the principle was to be sure that a strawhat was going to appear.

The first seven rules are:

1. Be alive
2. Be relevant to the story
3. Be unique and have a unique ability
4. Be free from faction duty or independant
5. Be a friend or a false adversary
6. Looking and acting toward adventure
7. Have a Inherited will character/Pillar

And the twelves Pillars are:

1. The quirk. 1 point because it's quite common in One Piece. Even amongst non mugiwara
2. The fighting skill 2 Points, because it's also quite common.
3. The antagonistic introduction. 2 Points because it impact the narration interestingly.
4. The multi layered characterization. 3 Points, Interesting but quite common.
5. The symbolic reach. 4 Points because it impacts the storytelling in an interesting way.
6. The Strong character arc. 4 Points because strong character arc are in fact quite rare.
7. The hint of a recrutment. 4 Points. I'll explain in detail what this parameter is about.
8. The hint of 3 driving forces. 5 Points, its very important for a strong character arc and a mugiwara
9. The post. 5 Points, this is one of the most important parameter
10. The Shining Nakama Action. 6 Points, this is the icing on top of the wedding cake
11. The Rescue. 10 Points, this is a major part of the creation of a strawhat.
12. The refusal of the call to adventure. 15 Points because it's THE deal breaker. And the clue that a character is about to make a choice.
    
    

 

[Sigran101]

Same question, I'll try a different approach. For you..

What makes a strawhat, a strawhat ?

Basic principles are a dream, a role on the crew, Luffy defeats their personal villain, and a flashback to a traumatic past involving a mentor figure or otherwise influencial person in their life. Everything else is just a pattern, and most of them have exceptions. But these four are always there in the exact same form. That's why I couldn't get behind Carrot since Luffy never defeated Perospero.

 

[Warback]

The 12 Pillars are the second part of my theory consisting in searching for the most probable crewmate.

The first part (the Seven rules) are what every character ABSOLUTELY needs to become a worthy candidate and the 12 Pillars are the principle that creates a strawhat deeper. The first seven rules must absolutely all be fit while the 12 pillars are based on a set of points attributed on each categories. I attributed a number of point in fonction on how important I felt the principle was to be sure that a strawhat was going to appear.

The first seven rules are:

1. Be alive
2. Be relevant to the story
3. Be unique and have a unique ability
4. Be free from faction duty or independant
5. Be a friend or a false adversary
6. Looking and acting toward adventure
7. Have a Inherited will character/Pillar

And the twelves Pillars are:

1. The quirk. 1 point because it's quite common in One Piece. Even amongst non mugiwara
2. The fighting skill 2 Points, because it's also quite common.
3. The antagonistic introduction. 2 Points because it impact the narration interestingly.
4. The multi layered characterization. 3 Points, Interesting but quite common.
5. The symbolic reach. 4 Points because it impacts the storytelling in an interesting way.
6. The Strong character arc. 4 Points because strong character arc are in fact quite rare.
7. The hint of a recrutment. 4 Points. I'll explain in detail what this parameter is about.
8. The hint of 3 driving forces. 5 Points, its very important for a strong character arc and a mugiwara
9. The post. 5 Points, this is one of the most important parameter
10. The Shining Nakama Action. 6 Points, this is the icing on top of the wedding cake
11. The Rescue. 10 Points, this is a major part of the creation of a strawhat.
12. The refusal of the call to adventure. 15 Points because it's THE deal breaker. And the clue that a character is about to make a choice.

Ok half of them are weird vague words that i'm sure youll shoehorn in whatever you want, but you understand that for instance, your giving some point system to this, is completly arbitary?

You acept your point thing is here, is complety subjective?

 

[HurricaneBilly]

Basic principles are a dream, a role on the crew, Luffy defeats their personal villain, and a flashback to a traumatic past involving a mentor figure or otherwise influencial person in their life. Everything else is just a pattern, and most of them have exceptions. But these four are always there in the exact same form. That's why I couldn't get behind Carrot since Luffy never defeated Perospero.

So in the case of Bonney...

1. Dream of meeting Sun God Nika and being a hero like him who liberates others
2. There's several possible positions out there, but Lookout seems to be the one most commonly suggested
3. Luffy vs Saturn seems VERY likely to be happening soon and Luffy beating him could very well be the infamous "Egghead Incident"
4. Currently in the middle of the Kuma flashback arc, which will eventually go into Bonney's relationship with her father and the discovery of what exactly led to his current state

So we'll probably have a better idea of Bonney's chances in the chapters to come.

 

[Logiko]

Basic principles are a dream, a role on the crew, Luffy defeats their personal villain, and a flashback to a traumatic past involving a mentor figure or otherwise influencial person in their life. Everything else is just a pattern, and most of them have exceptions. But these four are always there in the exact same form. That's why I couldn't get behind Carrot since Luffy never defeated Perospero.

So, this is the first step. You do agree that there is a set of "rules" that the strawhats fit in.

Now. We have more than 1000 characters, so how do you create a first batch.

My proposition is to first reduce what a strawhat needs to be to the minimum at first. Hence why I came up with the seven rule. And I was surprised because I didn't expect Marco at the time to be in the classment. So it was proven effective.

is completly arbitary?

You accept your point thing is here, is complety subjective?

Its indeed subjective and I'm open to the discussion concerning the point system. But for that we must first accept the legitimacy of this theory and understand the process behind it. Something that we have failed to do in two years of discussion..

So tell me, how would you distribute the point more fairly here ?

 

[Warback]

I wouldn't atribute points because it's a ridicoulus notion, if you don't have a role and dream you don't get to be a SH ( and even that's arguable).

I can't give 5 points to role or 10 to dream, because it's an "A and B" situation, if you have a role scoring a 100000 points it doesn't matter if you don't have a dream. It's all 0, if you assume dream and role are both absolute requirements.

So when you add uncertain subjective, unclear "pillars" it becomes even more pointless.


See what i mean? I reject the notion of a point system for SH candidate traits, now we can't argue on those grounds anymore.

 

[ShiShiShi]

I hear you so lets take that to the beginning and tell me.

What makes a strawhat, a strawhat ?

A friend with a dream

 

[Logiko]

I wouldn't atribute points because it's a ridicoulus notion, if you don't have a role and dream you don't get to be a SH ( and even that's arguable).

I can't give 5 points to role or 10 to dream, because it's an "A and B" situation, if you have a role scoring a 100000 points it doesn't matter if you don't have a dream. It's all 0.

If you assume dream and role are both absolute requirements. So when you add uncertain subjective, unclear "pillars" it becomes even more pointless.


See what i mean? I reject the notion of a point system for SH candidate traits, now we can't argue on those grounds anymore.

The problem of not adding point means that something like a quirk and a dream are on the same level. It means that something like a strong character arc and a post are on the same level. It means that a dream and a shining nakama action are on the same level.

On the paper its cool, in practice its not. Those different concept have completely different range of importance.

A friend with a dream

So Momo will be a strawhat then ?

Don't you think we can be a little bit more precise ? The point is not to have 20 candidate, but one.

 

[ShiShiShi]

The problem of not adding point means that something like a quirk and a dream are on the same level. It means that something like a strong character arc and a post are on the same level. It means that a dream and a shining nakama action are on the same level.

On the paper its cool, in practice its not. Those different concept have completely different range of importance.



So Momo will be a strawhat then ?

Don't you think we can be a little bit more precise ? The point is not to have 20 candidate, but one.

You’re annoying.

 

[Logiko]

You’re annoying.

 

[Warback]

The problem of not adding point means that something like a quirk and a dream are on the same level. It means that something like a strong character arc and a post are on the same level. It means that a dream and a shining nakama action are on the same level.

On the paper its cool, in practice its not. Those different concept have completely different range of importance.



So Momo will be a strawhat then ?

Don't you think we can be a little bit more precise ? The point is not to have 20 candidate, but one.

See and it's a failure already, i just told you some people might think you need A+B so your point system doesn't serve any purpose, because it's like asking do you want to give more points to your lungs or your heart?

 

[Logiko]

See and it's a failure already, i just told you some people might think you need A+B so your point system doesn't serve any purpose, because it's like asking do you want to give more points to your lungs or your heart?

Let's take an example shall we ?

A shining nakama action and a strong character arc.

Why those are not on the same level for me ? Well.. A shining Nakama action first means that a post has been established for the protagonist as it it linked to the character's skill and post. In the story. Only 11 character performed a shining Nakama action. ALL of them beside one were mugiwara, meaning that this is a foundamental parameter. On the contrary a strong character arc is a lot more common and a LOT of character have done this.

We can therefore see that a shining nakama action is a lot more relevant that a strong character arc to predict a new strawhat hence why the system of point is important.

i've forgot, but the system of point is also important because it allows a leeway for the characters. For example Yamato and Carrot don't have all three driving force but they have 2 or 1 so they can have a certain number of point. In case were there were no point, it would be unfair.

 

[Warback]

Yeah you just ignored what I said, this is pointless.

I was trying to use a small example to establish some basic common ground, but you already dipped out and you're going off on your headcanon.

 

[Logiko]

Yeah you just ignored what I said, this is pointless.

I was trying to use a small example to establish some basic common ground, but you already dipped out and you're going off on your headcanon.

Okkkkkk.. I just understood what you meant by "need both". You mean that a strawhat absolutely need both lets say A+B. I agree. But a strawhat that has both is already confirmed.

Here we are trying to PREDICT a potential strawhat meaning, that for now, characters don't have both. For example Bonney has no post but has a strong character arc.

That's why a point system is inevitable because we must be fair with all the character and give a chance to all of them.

 

[Sigran101]

The 12 Pillars are the second part of my theory consisting in searching for the most probable crewmate.

The first part (the Seven rules) are what every character ABSOLUTELY needs to become a worthy candidate and the 12 Pillars are the principle that creates a strawhat deeper. The first seven rules must absolutely all be fit while the 12 pillars are based on a set of points attributed on each categories. I attributed a number of point in fonction on how important I felt the principle was to be sure that a strawhat was going to appear.

The first seven rules are:

1. Be alive
2. Be relevant to the story
3. Be unique and have a unique ability
4. Be free from faction duty or independant
5. Be a friend or a false adversary
6. Looking and acting toward adventure
7. Have a Inherited will character/Pillar

And the twelves Pillars are:

1. The quirk. 1 point because it's quite common in One Piece. Even amongst non mugiwara
2. The fighting skill 2 Points, because it's also quite common.
3. The antagonistic introduction. 2 Points because it impact the narration interestingly.
4. The multi layered characterization. 3 Points, Interesting but quite common.
5. The symbolic reach. 4 Points because it impacts the storytelling in an interesting way.
6. The Strong character arc. 4 Points because strong character arc are in fact quite rare.
7. The hint of a recrutment. 4 Points. I'll explain in detail what this parameter is about.
8. The hint of 3 driving forces. 5 Poaints, its very important for a strong character arc and a mugiwara
9. The post. 5 Points, this is one of the most important parameter
10. The Shining Nakama Action. 6 Points, this is the icing on top of the wedding cake
11. The Rescue. 10 Points, this is a major part of the creation of a strawhat.
12. The refusal of the call to adventure. 15 Points because it's THE deal breaker. And the clue that a character is about to make a choice.
    

Although I agree with @Warback that a points system is incredibly stupid, let me pick this apart anyway because it's a ridiculous list even if we accept the concept.

For the rules
1. Be alive. This is a dumb rule. Might as well say "has to be a one piece character". This just makes the list longer and adds nothing of value.
2. Be relevant to the story. This is reasonable, but clearly way too subjective to be a rule since you still considered Carrot to fit your rules after being missing for 200 chapters.
3. Be unique and have a unique ability. This is poorly thought out because this is two things. Nami was unique but didn't have a unique ability when she joined. Also it's entirely subjective.
4. Free from faction duty or independent. Looks like someone forgot about Franky and Jinbei.
5. Be a friend or false adversary. Franky was a real adversary when they met, he just changed sides later.
6. Looking and acting toward adventure. Brook, Franky, Robin, and Chopper all don't fit this unless you're being extremely lenient with the definition, in which case it's too subjective.
7. Have an inherited will. Okay, one rule we can agree on.

I notice 6 of your 7 rules are extremely subjective and/or don't actually fit all the strawhats, and it's missing all but one of the things all the strawhats actually have in common.

As for the "pillars" (name is a bit much but whatever).

1. The quirk. Zoro, Robin, and Jinbei had no quirk, also subjective.
2. Fighting skill. Nami again.
3. Antagonistic introduction. Sanji and Jinbei didn't have this.
4. Multilayered charactorization. Sure I guess, but pretty weak as main criteria. You're basically saying "has to be a good character".
5. The symbolic reach. Very vague, and I don't trust whatever your definition of this is without hearing it first.
6. The strong character arc. Just as arbitrary as number four, but also subjective
7. The hint of recruitment. Robin. And if you say "there was subtext saying she'll join" without explaining said subtext, I'm going to reach through my screen and smack you.
8. The hint of three driving forces. So one of your made up rules is that each strawhat must meet another 3 of your made up rules. No thanks.
9. The post. Yes, but this should be in the rules section. The fact that having a quirk, fighting skill, and an antagonistic introduction is the same number of points as this shows how inane the point system is.
10. The shining nakama action. Pretty much all of worstgen considers this extremely dumb. It's abitrary, it's subjective, and the name is so cringey. And the fact that it's worth more points than the post makes it hard to take you seriously.
11. The rescue. I assume this means Luffy defeats their villain or otherwise rescues them from their trauma or something along those lines, which should be a rule, but considering you gave Carrot a perfect score, you clearly lack judgement when applying this one.
12. Refusal of the call to adventure. The fact that you call this the dealbreaker and rate it as highly as the rescue and the post COMBINED is probably the dumbest thing I've ever heard from you. It doesn't even fit all of the strawhats, namely Ussop. This actually bars you from participating in nakama debates imo.

A lot of these you're going to say "but the strawhat who broke the rule fits this later on". But remember this is a list to rate potential strawhats BEFORE they join, so by definition you can't include criteria that ANY of the strawhats didn't meet BEFORE they joined, or the same list would have excluded those strawhats from joining.

In conclusion, almost all of these are nonsense, and even the few that aren't nonesense in theory are nonsense in this list because of the arbitrary points system. You can't possibly expect anyone to use this list. Also, stop making up new words and phrases. I don't care if you think the words fit, it just makes things more confusing when you use made up language.

God, I can't believe I spent almost an hour on this when I could have been practicing Portugues.

 

[Logiko]

1. Be alive. This is a dumb rule. Might as well say "has to be a one piece character". This just makes the list longer and adds nothing of value.

Well yeah. That's the point. Be has absolute as possible. Therefore you can't say "Ace will join" (I'm sure some crazy fan are thinking about this and the fact that he might ressussitate.)

2. Be relevant to the story. This is reasonable, but clearly way too subjective to be a rule since you still considered Carrot to fit your rules after being missing for 200 chapters.

Being relevant means being IN the story and be able to impact its future. So Carrot fits that. And the rule is important as we need to sort a lot of character. Again. At first I had only the 11 Pillars. The seven rules came after when I decided to be actually fair and take 1000 character into account (yes, it took me hours but I checked 1000 characters for the 7 rules)

3. Be unique and have a unique ability. This is poorly thought out because this is two things. Nami was unique but didn't have a unique ability when she joined. Also it's entirely subjective.

This is wrong. Nami had a unique ability at the beginning, her quasi magical skill for the weither prediction. Something that is - btw - still unexplained.
A unique ability is something that can be mesured objectively so this rules applies to all strawhats too, sorry.

4. Free from faction duty or independent. Looks like someone forgot about Franky and Jinbei.

Now this is a good point. You are right, Franky wasn't free. I don't know how I missed that. I think I took the case of Franky after the strawhats and not before. Good job, you debunked one point. Which makes my life actually easier.

I need to remember to change this at the end.

5. Be a friend or false adversary. Franky was a real adversary when they met, he just changed sides later.

No. Franky is what we call a false antagonist. He was meant to join the crew. So this rules still applies. I've explained in detail this rule on my blog.

6. Looking and acting toward adventure. Brook, Franky, Robin, and Chopper all don't fit this unless you're being extremely lenient with the definition, in which case it's too subjective.

This is a good point. In my mind I take into account a strawhat that is on the edge of confirmation but yes, if we take a strawhat that is yet to be formed this rule doesn't apply anymore. I will delete it as well.

That's actually good, now we are moving.

I notice 6 of your 7 rules are extremely subjective and/or don't actually fit all the strawhats, and it's missing all but one of the things all the strawhats actually have in common.

I think this was due to a bias for Carrot and Yamato. But now that we are looking to less precise strawhat the rule needs indeed to be adjusted I'll do that right now.

1. The quirk. Zoro, Robin, and Jinbei had no quirk, also subjective.

Now, we need to understand that this section is not about the past of the recrutment but all the things that mugiwara have in common. Zoro, Robin and Jinbei all have a quirk therefore if a character happens to have a quirk they will get more points than a character that has none logically (hence why the point system is important)

2. Fighting skill. Nami again.

Same things its about the thing they have in common. We are trying to distinguishes the chances between character here. If a character can't fight its logical that they get less point that a character that can.

3. Antagonistic introduction. Sanji and Jinbei didn't have this.

You have to read my definition of antagonistic introduction. It means that the characters appears as menacing to the readers in any way shape or form. The first thing Sanji does he put down two guys and Jinbe is depicted in shading, both are menacing. Its important for the characterization of the character. For example a character that appears all gently will get less points that a character like Carrot that went straight for the head of Zoro. Logically. Again its about fairness.

Sure I guess, but pretty weak as main criteria. You're basically saying "has to be a good character".

No, just be more than one dimensional. But yes, its pretty basic. That's why it gets less points. As funny as it is, a character like Mihawk is very one dimensional compared to a character like Carrot or even Yamato.
This point is to get rid of the potential character that shouldn't have made it this far.

. The symbolic reach. Very vague, and I don't trust whatever your definition of this is without hearing it first.

So for this one. I'll give you the definition of my blog:


All the strawhats seems to have a symbolic reach that can be broken down into several categories:

- A negative reputation which anchors the character in a marginal position while creating a contrast with his personnality and his actions
- A thematic incarnation that adds weight to the character's desires and is a reminder serving the main character: Luffy. This incarnation is highlighted thanks to the actions and the character's personnality traits. Example: Luffy incarnates the importance of Freedom. BTW my blog needs a rework on that portion for the strawhats I'm not very contempt with all the thematic incarnation of the strawhats.
- An animal alter-Ego which allows to better characterize the character. They are most often shown in the color pages. They can also vary from time to time.
- A cultural inspiration that makes the character resonate beyond his narrative barriers and gives the story a legendary echo. This was probably done by Oda in order to twist the expectation concerning the characters or to make their respective arc even more impactfull.

I gave it 4 point for each categories.

7. The hint of recruitment. Robin. And if you say "there was subtext saying she'll join" without explaining said subtext, I'm going to reach through my screen and smack you.

Actually. I think I will get rid of that Pillar. Its the same problem as before. now that I think about it once there is a hint, there is automatically a recrutment so it doesn't count for a strawhat that is unprecise. Forget it.

8. The hint of three driving forces. So one of your made up rules is that each strawhat must meet another 3 of your made up rules. No thanks.

Okay so this one is VERY important and I can't forget it.

I don't know if you read my blog but this rule is basically an application of Truby's method for creating a good character arc:

Need + Desire (those two are very important, you can also call the desire the "dream" in One Piece) and there is a twist in One Piece there is a third need that is the loyalty to Luffy. If a character as those three they are very well placed to become a strawhat. Hence wy it has a lot of points.

I hope you understand now why I call this the THREE driving force (Need + Desire + Loyalty)

9. The post. Yes, but this should be in the rules section. The fact that having a quirk, fighting skill, and an antagonistic introduction is the same number of points as this shows how inane the point system is.

I'm trying to be fair. If I take that pillar into the rule section Carrot will be the only one with a post.

The fact that having a quirk, fighting skill, and an antagonistic introduction is the same number of points as this shows how inane the point system is.

Well, maybe we can discuss on that.

10. The shining nakama action. Pretty much all of worstgen considers this extremely dumb. It's abitrary, it's subjective, and the name is so cringey. And the fact that it's worth more points than the post makes it hard to take you seriously.

Okay, this needs its own thread. Did you read the post on my blog here ?

https://carrotfornakama.wixsite.com/anyonefornakama/post/tenth-pillar-the-shining-nakama-action

11. The rescue. I assume this means Luffy defeats their villain or otherwise rescues them from their trauma or something along those lines, which should be a rule, but considering you gave Carrot a perfect score, you clearly lack judgement when applying this one

Nope, Carrot has 0 here.

12. Refusal of the call to adventure. The fact that you call this the dealbreaker and rate it as highly as the rescue and the post COMBINED is probably the dumbest thing I've ever heard from you. It doesn't even fit all of the strawhats, namely Ussop. This actually bars you from participating in nakama debates imo.

Now that interesting. One thing you should know is that I actually didn't like that Pillar but add it anyway AFTER all of them. And indeed, the refusal of the call of adventure of Usopp is debatable. I'm actually on the fence on this one. Meaning that I'm on the fence on this pillar as a whole. But this would advantage Carrot too much so I kept it.
If you want, I can get rid of this pillar too.

A lot of these you're going to say "but the strawhat who broke the rule fits this later on".

For the refusal, Robin and Nami actually broke the rule. I'm not sure for Usopp tho. I'm on the fence about his journey as it is quite special.

A lot of these you're going to say "but the strawhat who broke the rule fits this later on". But remember this is a list to rate potential strawhats BEFORE they join, so by definition you can't include criteria that ANY of the strawhats didn't meet BEFORE they joined, or the same list would have excluded those strawhats from joining.

In conclusion, almost all of these are nonsense, and even the few that aren't nonesense in theory are nonsense in this list because of the arbitrary points system. You can't possibly expect anyone to use this list. Also, stop making up new words and phrases. I don't care if you think the words fit, it just makes things more confusing when you use made up language.

God, I can't believe I spent almost an hour on this when I could have been practicing Portugues.

Look at this. In one post, by actually taking the time to take the theory legitimatly, you made me rethink a lot of it. Isn't that beautiful ?

Let's recap shall we:

I will keep the first rules but I will cut them short:

1 - To be alive, basic.
2 - To be relevant in the story, also basic
3 - To be unique or have a unique ability
4 - To be a friend or a false adversary
5 - To have a inherited will protagonist pillar.

We end up therefore with 5 basic rule instead of 7.

We can now integrate character such as:
- Carrot
- Yamato
- Momo
- Marco
- Bonney
- Law

(add more if you want)

As for the Pillar they are also reduced: (remember its not about what they are before the recrutment its about what they have in common with the strawhats)

1 - Quirk
2 - Fighting skill (one fighting still + Combo)
3 - Antagonistic Introduction
4 - Multi layered characterization
5 - Symbolic reach (4 layers)
6 - Strong character arc
7 - Three driving forces (hint?) (Needs / Dream or Desire / Loyalty)
8 - Post
9 - Shining nakama action
10 - The rescue

We end up with 5 basic rule and 10 pillars. I actually like that. Its easier.

Now if you have read everything, we should be in agreement. What is left to do is the distribution of points. So, looking at those 10 pillars, how would you do it ?