General & Others Sanji is a contradiction.

#63
...Pretty sure I was saying the opposite, that trauma ISN’T easy to get over and often causes people to experience debilitating effects for some time thereafter. Sanji immediately reverted the second they made landfall in Wano, which would seem to prove the thread’s title correct.
The thing is, Sanji's pervertedness isn't something that was addressed in WCI. He was serious on WCI the whole time because of the circumstances, and even outside of WCI, when the situation gets serious, so does Sanji.

Look at Sanji vs Kalifa. What aspect of his character was prevalent in the fight? The perverted Sanji, or the Chivalrous one?
 
#65
You don't think that if his fandom over in Japan started rallying behind how much they dislike Sanji's character because of the perverted nature, that word wouldn't reach Oda's ears? Like Oda lives in a panic room, with no interaction to the outside world.
How could I know what his living style is like? But assumption and knowing are different things.
 
#67
How could I know what his living style is like? But assumption and knowing are different things.
The last popularity poll, Sanji was ranked number 3. That's where he's always been with the exception of the 1st and 5th poll. That shows you where his popularity sits within the Japanese fandom. Now don't you think if his core audience in Japan had started to dislike Sanji, and his character started dropping on the polls, that wouldn't be cause for alarm on the Author's behalf? Of course it would, but there is no cause for alarm, because Sanji is still sitting in the same spot of popularity he sits at the majority of the polls.
 

Jew D. Boy

I Can Go Lower
#68
The thing is, Sanji's pervertedness isn't something that was addressed in WCI. He was serious on WCI the whole time because of the circumstances, and even outside of WCI, when the situation gets serious, so does Sanji.

Look at Sanji vs Kalifa. What aspect of his character was prevalent in the fight? The perverted Sanji, or the Chivalrous one?
You can cherry pick examples all day where his chivalry outstripped his desire to get his dick wet, that doesn’t excuse all the moments when the latter took precedence. How many times did he almost die in Fishman Island because he couldn’t control his nose bleeding around the mermaids? Why is he running around Onigashima right now looking for hookers? Why do we need a panel of him with heart eyes every time a female character exists in his field of vision? By your own admission, the chivalry allows him to take things seriously...so why not emphasize that instead of showing the same old gag every time for seemingly no reason?
 
#69
The last popularity poll, Sanji was ranked number 3. That's where he's always been with the exception of the 1st and 5th poll. That shows you where his popularity sits within the Japanese fandom. Now don't you think if his core audience in Japan had started to dislike Sanji, and his character started dropping on the polls, that wouldn't be cause for alarm on the Author's behalf? Of course it would, but there is no cause for alarm, because Sanji is still sitting in the same spot of popularity he sits at the majority of the polls.
You can still like a character and not like one of their attributes... herp derp.
 
#70
You can cherry pick examples all day where his chivalry outstripped his desire to get his dick wet, that doesn’t excuse all the moments when the latter took precedence. How many times did he almost die in Fishman Island because he couldn’t control his nose bleeding around the mermaids? Why is he running around Onigashima right now looking for hookers? Why do we need a panel of him with heart eyes every time a female character exists in his field of vision? By your own admission, the chivalry allows him to take things seriously...so why not emphasize that instead of showing the same old gag every time for seemingly no reason?
Yes, he's running around Wano looking for hookers. And which Sanji did we get in the flashback scene from Nami? The serious on or the perverted one? Nami didn't seemed bothered at all by the fact that Sanji decided to save the prostitutes. You think that would be her mindset if she felt he had some kind of lude objective behind it?

Fishman Island, is a different story. He had JUST come off living on an Island with Okama's for almost two years, and seeing Mermaids had been a dream of Sanji's for a long time. He even called it his "All Blue" Towards the end of the arc, those nosebleeds died down.
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You can still like a character and not like one of their attributes... herp derp.
Yet here we are, and every Sanji thread starts off with "I use to like his character, but not anymore." But maybe that's just the entire rest of the world, and Japan is the only Country that can start out loving a character, and slowly start to only hate one aspect of that character, but still love the rest.
 

Jew D. Boy

I Can Go Lower
#71
Yes, he's running around Wano looking for hookers. And which Sanji did we get in the flashback scene from Nami? The serious on or the perverted one? Nami didn't seemed bothered at all by the fact that Sanji decided to save the prostitutes. You think that would be her mindset if she felt he had some kind of lude objective behind it?

Fishman Island, is a different story. He had JUST come off living on an Island with Okama's for almost two years, and seeing Mermaids had been a dream of Sanji's for a long time. He even called it his "All Blue" Towards the end of the arc, those nosebleeds died down.
This the panel you’re talking about? You read this and thought that Nami WASN’T bothered? I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt on the Fishman Island part, but come on, man...even his best friends are sick of this shit.

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By the way, I still like Sanji as a character and think he’s crucial to Luffy’s mission. It’s precisely BECAUSE of these things that I’d like to see him develop even a single iota. The same is true for all SHP who have become one-note jokers instead of fleshed out characters.
 
#72
The thing is, Sanji's pervertedness isn't something that was addressed in WCI. He was serious on WCI the whole time because of the circumstances, and even outside of WCI, when the situation gets serious, so does Sanji.

Look at Sanji vs Kalifa. What aspect of his character was prevalent in the fight? The perverted Sanji, or the Chivalrous one?
Serious on WCI the whole time?

 

Jew D. Boy

I Can Go Lower
#77
Sanji is naturally born pervert , that was emphasized in his flashback , if it wasn't for Zeff's intervention Sanji would have not developed his code of not hitting women and sympathizing with them in 99% of the situations , in other words he would have been just like Roshi if not even worse lol

You may dislike Zeff's teachings and codes but he definitely had very very positive effect on Sanji .
I never said his chivalry was bad, bro :kaidowhat: If anything, it’s a saving grace against his natural perversion, and his entire personality is a choice by the author, which is the point I was originally making.
 
#79
First of all, This is in general, having contradiction does not mean his character is bad. Human are contradictory. One day you act one way, the other day, you do something completely goes against what you did the other day.

Now, after saying that. I'll get into Sanji. Regarding being perverted, that does not mean he's degrading women. That's simply his "sexual drive" being very wild compared to other males.

In today's society, some people look at that as being disrespectful. However, what you need to count is "which culture" are you talking about. Meaning, my culture about the way of treating women is different from your culture, which is different from Japanese culture. And Japanese culture has also TWO sides, there are the modern society, and there is the old society and their ideals.

What some people in one area can be considered as "degrading/disrespectful" can be seen as something "normal" in different culture, or even in the same culture but from different times.

I'll give you an example which happens in other anime to explain more:

If you have seen Bleech, I want you to watch this scene, and then LOOK at what the woman with glasses say (her name is Lisa)


We have the guy being flustered about being called "pervert"

While, the woman in a moment of silent says "it's natural to be interested in woman's body" and act like that.

So, in that scene, you can see the mentality of that woman itself is DIFFERENT from how you view "degrading or disrespectful".

Where, she considers it "normal". And it's only degrading if you actually look at women as "sexual tool". But this is not what Sanji is all about. Sanji simply is a pervert, but he also believes in women, forgives their lies, he is gentle with them, never hits them, sees every smart move Nami does and cheer for her navigation skills. He's someone way beyond a guy who just looks at women as sexual tools for his own desires.

And that's simply my answer.

Also, just to note, in the same society, in the same era, you can find individual women who appreciates a man who lust for them. And at the same time, in this same society, same era, you can find women who hate it and despise it.
Life is never black and white, Life is always grey, it is never totally clear.

And with that being said, Sanji lived all his life loving everything about women as well as being so damn interested in them sexually. That's just who he is. It doesn't mean he degrades them, he is simply a "hyper sexual guy" who's got a boner most of the time LOL

So, yeah. You can live your life thinking that your own way is the ONLY right thing, and the way you are raised is the ONLY way to live life righteously. Or simply, you can accept diverse ideologies, and diverse way of life, and stop being in one single bubble. Women are different, they have individuality. In fact, if I was like you, I can accuse you of being someone who "disrespect women" by giving them one single identity where they ALL HATE what Sanji does. But that's not the case, there are tons of women who hate his actions, just like there are tons who like to have a man who's always lusting for them. To each, they have their own personality, ad way of life. Sanji is no different, he's his own character
This is the poorest way to defend Sanji’s perversion I’ve ever seen.

Nami and the other women clearly don’t sit well with Sanji’s perversion
 
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