Hello everyone,
So we were having an incredibly civil and productive discussion with zero insults being thrown around, and we got into the topic of fascism, and just who is and is not a fascist in One Piece. And the discussion got pretty poppin so I figured this deserved its own thread. Politics on a weeb forum, this will be fun right?
So there seems to be some misconceptions about what fascism is, so we’re going to clear this up today and I’m going to explain to you why Akainu is not a fascist, and anyone who thinks Akainu is a fascist is wrong.
So let’s start by explaining what fascism is not:
Fascism =/= all evil. You see, what Akainu haters do is they look at Akainu and they say “oh he’s so evil, he’s clearly a fascist.” And, that’s not even remotely close to the definition of fascism. So let’s talk about fascism itself.
The first major tenant of fascism is deluded patriotism: a fierce pride in your nation not as it exists in actuality, but as you’ve deluded yourself into believing it exists. How does Ryokugyu fit this definition?
Ryokugyu is very proud of the Celestial Dragons who he describes as gods. Now of course the Celestial Dragons are not actual gods, they are gods in the propaganda sense. IE, they tell everyone they are gods to legitimize their rule.
But look at how fervently Ryokugyu believes that the Celestial Dragons are gods. He literally screams it into the face of the Wano natives, he is that confident and proud of this idea.
Ryokugyu is deluded, and he is very patriotic about his delusion. This is textbook fascism. What does Akainu think of the Celestial Dragons and his superiors in the World Government?
This is pretty clearly not how someone like Ryokugyu would address beings who he believes to be gods, by questioning their decision making to their faces. So again, we don’t see the same level of deluded patriotism from Akainu as we see from Ryokugyu. He is very aware that the Gorosei and the World Government has its flaws.
Ryokugyu also seems to have a pretty deluded patriotism toward the Marines:
The first time I read this comment, I remember finding it very weird that Ryokugyu would so readily associate himself with the Navy like this, because not only did Ryokugyu only just join the Navy two years ago, but the fact that Ryokugyu would do this at all suggests pride in the fact that he is a Marine. This pride must necessarily stem from the fact that Ryokugyu believes the Marines to be a more extreme and thus more effective military under Sakazuki as opposed to Sengoku (or else he would’ve joined the Marines before the draft). Which again to me is just a really deluded belief…Sakazuki’s Navy really doesn’t operate any differently from the way Sengoku’s did, but again Ryokugyu has a deluded level of patriotism for the Navy just because “his guy” is in charge now. Again we see a deluded patriotism in action.
Another major tenant of fascism is a hierarchical worldview: the belief that your race/culture/state is inherently superior to all others and thus deserves to rule over them. How does Ryokugyu fit this tenant?
By literally stating that human hierarchy exists and it is a good thing that hierarchy exists. This is crucially different from those who believe there is a human hierarchy but that all humans should be legislated/treated equal anyway. Ryokugyu explicitly believes in the merits of discrimination. This is fascism.
So what does Akainu think about hierarchy? Well, it’s sort of unclear but there’s no indication that he believes this shit lol. Akainu’s only worldview is that “all criminals = evil,” which is probably something that most fascists would agree with but isn’t itself a fascist belief. Communists and fascists probably agree that the sky is blue, but that doesn’t make a blue sky a fascist or communist belief (not saying Akainu is a communist lmfao).
No, if anything, Akainu’s words to the Gorosei, “why does the whole world have to be played for fools for Doflamingo” suggests not only that he does not have an unfailing faith in his government, but also that his worldview is nowhere near as hierarchical as Ryokugyu’s (Ryokugyu probably gives no shits about the vast majority of the world or even the world government nations being played for fools).
Now there are of course more tenants to fascism such as conservative autocracy, self-sacrifice for the benefit of the race or state, a strongly regimented society, etc but we won’t be discussing that here. Let’s instead look at what beliefs Akainu and Ryokugyu have in common:
The only beliefs that Akainu and Ryokugyu seem to share that can be associated with fascism is the use of force to suppress opposition. Which is not even close to an exclusively fascist belief, any authoritarian government believes in this principle. This in and of itself is not exclusive to fascism while the tenants I listed above are definitionally fascist.
I always said the introduction of Ryokugyu was a huge moment for Akainu’s character, because Ryokugyu really is the deluded maniac that haters thought Akainu was. Akainu’s fans of course know better, but this is Oda’s way of reinforcing how dangerous Akainu’s ideology of “all criminals = evil” is, because it attracts the true maniacs like Ryokugyu.
Anyway I’ll start to really ramble if this continues. Share your thoughts.
@SakazOuki @MarineHQ @Kurozumi Wiwi @The White Crane @Wuuuke @silverfire @scoobie3 @AkainuTheGrimReaper @Apollo @Admiral Mou Bu @ZenZu @Extravlad @kurwa @haxxor @EmperorKinyagi @Blackbeard @Owl Ki @TheKnightOfTheSea @God Buggy @Sentinel @Playa4321 @Veku @Le Fishe D. Tomdou @GoldDiamond @Dragon777 @Weeman @Cadis Etrama Di Urek @Dark Admiral @Rumble @Mathias @Gaimon The Pirate
So we were having an incredibly civil and productive discussion with zero insults being thrown around, and we got into the topic of fascism, and just who is and is not a fascist in One Piece. And the discussion got pretty poppin so I figured this deserved its own thread. Politics on a weeb forum, this will be fun right?
So there seems to be some misconceptions about what fascism is, so we’re going to clear this up today and I’m going to explain to you why Akainu is not a fascist, and anyone who thinks Akainu is a fascist is wrong.
So let’s start by explaining what fascism is not:
Fascism =/= all evil. You see, what Akainu haters do is they look at Akainu and they say “oh he’s so evil, he’s clearly a fascist.” And, that’s not even remotely close to the definition of fascism. So let’s talk about fascism itself.
The first major tenant of fascism is deluded patriotism: a fierce pride in your nation not as it exists in actuality, but as you’ve deluded yourself into believing it exists. How does Ryokugyu fit this definition?
Ryokugyu is very proud of the Celestial Dragons who he describes as gods. Now of course the Celestial Dragons are not actual gods, they are gods in the propaganda sense. IE, they tell everyone they are gods to legitimize their rule.
But look at how fervently Ryokugyu believes that the Celestial Dragons are gods. He literally screams it into the face of the Wano natives, he is that confident and proud of this idea.
Ryokugyu is deluded, and he is very patriotic about his delusion. This is textbook fascism. What does Akainu think of the Celestial Dragons and his superiors in the World Government?
This is pretty clearly not how someone like Ryokugyu would address beings who he believes to be gods, by questioning their decision making to their faces. So again, we don’t see the same level of deluded patriotism from Akainu as we see from Ryokugyu. He is very aware that the Gorosei and the World Government has its flaws.
Ryokugyu also seems to have a pretty deluded patriotism toward the Marines:
The first time I read this comment, I remember finding it very weird that Ryokugyu would so readily associate himself with the Navy like this, because not only did Ryokugyu only just join the Navy two years ago, but the fact that Ryokugyu would do this at all suggests pride in the fact that he is a Marine. This pride must necessarily stem from the fact that Ryokugyu believes the Marines to be a more extreme and thus more effective military under Sakazuki as opposed to Sengoku (or else he would’ve joined the Marines before the draft). Which again to me is just a really deluded belief…Sakazuki’s Navy really doesn’t operate any differently from the way Sengoku’s did, but again Ryokugyu has a deluded level of patriotism for the Navy just because “his guy” is in charge now. Again we see a deluded patriotism in action.
Another major tenant of fascism is a hierarchical worldview: the belief that your race/culture/state is inherently superior to all others and thus deserves to rule over them. How does Ryokugyu fit this tenant?
By literally stating that human hierarchy exists and it is a good thing that hierarchy exists. This is crucially different from those who believe there is a human hierarchy but that all humans should be legislated/treated equal anyway. Ryokugyu explicitly believes in the merits of discrimination. This is fascism.
So what does Akainu think about hierarchy? Well, it’s sort of unclear but there’s no indication that he believes this shit lol. Akainu’s only worldview is that “all criminals = evil,” which is probably something that most fascists would agree with but isn’t itself a fascist belief. Communists and fascists probably agree that the sky is blue, but that doesn’t make a blue sky a fascist or communist belief (not saying Akainu is a communist lmfao).
No, if anything, Akainu’s words to the Gorosei, “why does the whole world have to be played for fools for Doflamingo” suggests not only that he does not have an unfailing faith in his government, but also that his worldview is nowhere near as hierarchical as Ryokugyu’s (Ryokugyu probably gives no shits about the vast majority of the world or even the world government nations being played for fools).
Now there are of course more tenants to fascism such as conservative autocracy, self-sacrifice for the benefit of the race or state, a strongly regimented society, etc but we won’t be discussing that here. Let’s instead look at what beliefs Akainu and Ryokugyu have in common:
The only beliefs that Akainu and Ryokugyu seem to share that can be associated with fascism is the use of force to suppress opposition. Which is not even close to an exclusively fascist belief, any authoritarian government believes in this principle. This in and of itself is not exclusive to fascism while the tenants I listed above are definitionally fascist.
I always said the introduction of Ryokugyu was a huge moment for Akainu’s character, because Ryokugyu really is the deluded maniac that haters thought Akainu was. Akainu’s fans of course know better, but this is Oda’s way of reinforcing how dangerous Akainu’s ideology of “all criminals = evil” is, because it attracts the true maniacs like Ryokugyu.
Anyway I’ll start to really ramble if this continues. Share your thoughts.
@SakazOuki @MarineHQ @Kurozumi Wiwi @The White Crane @Wuuuke @silverfire @scoobie3 @AkainuTheGrimReaper @Apollo @Admiral Mou Bu @ZenZu @Extravlad @kurwa @haxxor @EmperorKinyagi @Blackbeard @Owl Ki @TheKnightOfTheSea @God Buggy @Sentinel @Playa4321 @Veku @Le Fishe D. Tomdou @GoldDiamond @Dragon777 @Weeman @Cadis Etrama Di Urek @Dark Admiral @Rumble @Mathias @Gaimon The Pirate
