Current Events Ace and the Wano tyrant - Luffy following his will

[Bogard]

I already made a thread in the previous version of the forum talking about Ace and the Wano tyrant, but since it was a bit outdated, i didn't really reposted it here, at least until i found a reason to complete that speculation, so now is the time to go more into details about it

> We already knew before that Ace was in Wano for several weeks, a place where he learnt how to make Strawhats

Spoiler

But at the time, we didn't really know what he really accomplished there outside of befriending with Amigasa villagers and mainly Tama, who he promised to, to come back

Spoiler

Note however at the time the importance of Oda through Ace's wordings, talking about Ace coming back with a bigger crew. It implied imo that there was a task he had to accomplish there when he and his crew would grow and expand enough, a task imo related to the Wano tyrant i brought up before(Kaido / Orochi)

> A further proof of that is the mini-flashback Tama got reminiscing Ace's final words

Spoiler

The next time we'd come back to this country, it'll be a place where you can eat as much as you want

Which could only be possible if Ace aimed at overthrowing Kaido / Orochi and liberate Wano from their tyrany

Now this in itself only allowed us to view things from Ace / Tama's perspective, but in the latest chapter, we now noticed that Ace also encountered Kaido's daughter(Yamato), fought with her, with her seeing Ace through her battle with Luffy, pointing out the fact she had been waiting for Luffy, outright showing him a journal she had been hiding from Kaido and his entire crew, and wanting to fight on Luffy's side

Spoiler

Now why i bring this up ? It's because it's implied that Yamato and Ace's first meeting was similar to Yamato's and Luffy's first meeting, and which says similar implies that Yamato may have viewed him as someone she wanted to help to defeat her father, someone she probably shared the journal with, shared Oden's will and wordings to open the borders of Wano.

And thus if Ace also knew about all this, it could further explain Ace's final words to Tama, related to liberating the Wano country, it could also further explain Ace's wordings about coming back while taking into consideration the 20years prophecy happening 4years after Ace's first visit in Wano.

During his visit with Yamato though, it's likely that Ace also talked about his younger brother(Luffy) with ultimately then, Luffy ending up following Ace's will and liberating Wano in his stead

Spoiler

Leave your thoughts on the comments below

Spoiler: Some Tags

@Ace @Luffy is the mc @Sunita @Kiwipom @Admiral Lee Hung

 

[Celestial D. Dragon]

Luffy always has a tendency of fulfilling the wishes of those who can't do so, or can no longer do so, so I agree with this 100 percent. I'm sure we'll find out that Ace had planned to come back when the time was right, and rid the Country of Kaido. Whitebeard actually called it during Marineford, when he made the proclamation that just as there are those who took on Rogers will, one day someone will take up Ace's. Ace was never interested in being the Pirate King, so this could be that one thing he wanted to accomplish in life, that he never got the chance to, and Luffy will fulfill it.

 

[Seth]

That was a nice read. I just hope Oda won't turn Ace's mini FB into clown fiesta. A lot of people like the idea of finding out more about Ace on Wano thing but it can also damage his image a little.

ps.
How old is Tama?
It is possible that Ace ended up on Wano twice and his meeting with Tama is the result of the 1st time on Wano?

 

[MarineHQ]

Nice thread. Honestly, i hope that Oda doesn't go on multiple FB's about Ace with Tama or Yamato now when the anticipated battle is about to start.

Yamato and Tama should be present when Kaidou receives the final blow or cut and then would be a good time to reminisce about Ace without dragging the current plot.

 

[Sunita]

Good analysis brother @Bogard.

Ace looked like Luffy because they're both the type of people who cannot sit still if they see that other weak people are suffering because of some tyrant. So I have always thought that Ace tried to do something at first, although later he realized that at that time his efforts would not be enough. Yamato probably asked him for time to gather allies, power or something more, because Yamato was confident that he could help. Also, someone must also have commented on the subject of Toki's prophecy. Those two things would be the main factors holding Ace back from trying to do more at the time. That is why I agree with the postulate on this thread. Anyway Oda could come up with something unexpected, adding some fact or another character, who knows.

Luffy always has a tendency of fulfilling the wishes of those who can't do so, or can no longer do so, so I agree with this 100 percent. I'm sure we'll find out that Ace had planned to come back when the time was right, and rid the Country of Kaido. Whitebeard actually called it during Marineford, when he made the proclamation that just as there are those who took on Rogers will, one day someone will take up Ace's. Ace was never interested in being the Pirate King, so this could be that one thing he wanted to accomplish in life, that he never got the chance to, and Luffy will fulfill it.

I agree with Luffy and the inherited will issue. I also think Ace was thinking of going back, because it's hard for me to think that he has easily forgotten about Wano's situation. And probably he still had the goal of returning to Wano, but unfortunately he died before being able to do something....I agree that Luffy will fulfill Ace's will, which does not make Ace a loser as I have read in various places.. On the contrary, I find it wonderful that Luffy fulfills a wish of his brother, because it is a goal that is finally fulfilled.

That was a nice read. I just hope Oda won't turn Ace's mini FB into clown fiesta. A lot of people like the idea of finding out more about Ace on Wano thing but it can also damage his image a little.

ps.
How old is Tama?
It is possible that Ace ended up on Wano twice and his meeting with Tama is the result of the 1st time on Wano?

I don't think Oda is going to make a bad flashback.

Tama is 8 years old. And according to what the manga has hinted, Ace went to Wano for the first and only time.

Nice thread. Honestly, i hope that Oda doesn't go on multiple FB's about Ace with Tama or Yamato now when the anticipated battle is about to start.

Yamato and Tama should be present when Kaidou receives the final blow or cut and then would be a good time to reminisce about Ace without dragging the current plot.

I don't think Oda is going to show a long flashback now. I think at the moment it will only show some little panel with Ace and Yamato, but later it will show longer flashback as you suggest.

 

[Seth]

I don't think Oda is going to make a bad flashback.

Tama is 8 years old. And according to what the manga has hinted, Ace went to Wano for the first and only time.

Rip Tama theory

I don't know if the FB will be good or bad but I just fucking hate the idea of FB right after the break.

We need the war to pick up the pace.

 

[Sunita]

Rip Tama theory

I don't know if the FB will be good or bad but I just fucking hate the idea of FB right after the break.

We need the war to pick up the pace.

Sorry :(

I would say don't worry, I don't think we have a long flashback now. I think that while Oda will only show a couple of panels where Yamato remembers Ace and later we will see a longer flashback.

 

[Seth]

Sorry :(

I would say don't worry, I don't think we have a long flashback now. I think that while Oda will only show a couple of panels where Yamato remembers Ace and later we will see a longer flashback.

That's fair as long as she will not wank Oden for the rest of the chapter and we will go to yet another break.

 

[Sunita]

That's fair as long as she will not wank Oden for the rest of the chapter and we will go to yet another break.

Well, about Yamato's memories about Oden I can't guarantee anything xD. Knowing what Oda is like will probably continue to show that Yamato thinks of Oden xD. But I think we will continue to see more panels of the other characters.

(I confess that I like flashbacks, and I want to see the flashbacks of Ace and Zoro xD, but ofc I know that now isn't the time)

 

[Lampyris]

It's a fascinating mystery as to what could have made Ace leave Tama behind and promise to come back to Wano in the future. It's not something I could imagine Luffy doing. Luffy leaving Nami in Cocoyashi and saying he'll come back for her and the village? Luffy leaving Alabasta after he gets defeated by Crocodile and telling Vivi he'll return with a stronger crew? Luffy telling Robin he'll break her out of Impel Down after he gets thrashed by Rob Lucci and she gets away? How would Ace act in these situations?

Ace has been seen as the more mature, responsible older brother compared to Luffy.

In theory, we could speculate he might be looking at the bigger picture and consider the entire frame of reference. Ace could see there was no sort of deadline in Wano, the situation wasn't changing anytime soon and Tama's life was not particularly in danger. Much different from the scenarios I listed above. In practice, Ace is nearly as impulsive and reckless as Luffy. Sabo was the mature one. Ace chased Blackbeard into the other half of the Grand Line by himself when his crew tried to stop him, Ace picked a fight with Akainu at everyone's behest, Ace was chasing the head of the Strongest Man in the World the moment he entered the New World.

So why would Ace leave a lesser threat like Kaido and the Beast Pirates to rule over Tama and chase a bigger fish like Whitebeard? Taking an L, putting Ace in Udon wouldn't have stopped him like it didn't stop Luffy. At least I assume the man who tried to assasinate Whitebeard on his own ship multiple times every day would not have given up. I can think of some reasons:

1). Yamato told Ace about Toki's prophecy. Kaido and Orochi will be taken down by the 9 shadows in 4 years time. That will be the best time to launch an attack on Kaido while leaving behind the least amount of casualties in Wano, and Ace agreed. It's not just a simple fight between Ace and the Beast Pirates, the innocents in their Wano territory could easily get wrapped up in a pirate battle and that includes Tama.

2.) The Beast Pirates have something over Ace. Kaido of the 100 hostages. Ace was forced into an Oden situation. Perhaps he joined Kaido's crew as the Ace and then Yamato's intervention allowed him to flee. Either way, it's not a situation Ace could beat up someone to get out of. He left Wano for the moment. With a bigger crew, Ace could return with the right special personel who could prevent Kaido's dirty tricks while Ace is finally free to focus on the fighting.

3.) Yamato personally requested that Ace backs off. Ace doesn't know about the prophecy or when he should come back, but he just backed off to honor his friend Yamato's request. It's not going to stop Ace from liberating Wano when he feels it's okay to come back. For now, he sets his eyes back on Whitebeard.

4.) Ace wanted Tama to grow up first. This is a bit of a stretch. Ace wanted to recruit teenage or adult Tama the next time he stops by Wano. Which means Tama has to toughen up and survive on her own, sort like Ace/Luffy/Sabo in the jungle tossed in there by Garp. It's not really a good enough reason to leave Wano, but it does tell you when he intended to come back.

Lucikly, this is one mystery we won't have to think about too long. I could see Ace's Wano journey and the reason he left all answered as soon as next chapter.

 

[Drachenblut]

Good one. The only point which I don't like with ace and wanl is, ace said in marineford, that he doesn't have any regret in life...
So Tama? Wano? What's with them?


As I see it, at that time oda didn't plan the wano plot this much ahead and so he added the plot with ace "just recently".

Somehow, this is a contradiction.

 

[Natalija]

Good one. The only point which I don't like with ace and wanl is, ace said in marineford, that he doesn't have any regret in life...
So Tama? Wano? What's with them?


As I see it, at that time oda didn't plan the wano plot this much ahead and so he added the plot with ace "just recently".

Somehow, this is a contradiction.

I agree, that is why it mostly annoys me. I don't understand why he had to be dragged through this plot.

The biggest purpose I can think of is exactly that; making Luffy feel better over doing something his brother wanted but was unable to do. This bothers me because Luffy had already decided he's going to help Tama even before she even mentioned Ace.

Another confusing thing was him not telling her that Ace is his brother, he just turned serious.

@Bogard are you happy with his new story involvement?

 

[Geo]

But at the time, we didn't really know what he really accomplished there outside of befriending with Amigasa villagers and mainly Tama, who he promised to, to come back

Spoiler

Note however at the time the importance of Oda through Ace's wordings, talking about Ace coming back with a bigger crew. It implied imo that there was a task he had to accomplish there when he and his crew would grow and expand enough, a task imo related to the Wano tyrant i brought up before(Kaido / Orochi)

The statement could've also more likely implied that Ace was going back to inform WB and the whole crew would come to Wano

 

[Sword God Ryuma]

It's a fascinating mystery as to what could have made Ace leave Tama behind and promise to come back to Wano in the future. It's not something I could imagine Luffy doing. Luffy leaving Nami in Cocoyashi and saying he'll come back for her and the village? Luffy leaving Alabasta after he gets defeated by Crocodile and telling Vivi he'll return with a stronger crew? Luffy telling Robin he'll break her out of Impel Down after he gets thrashed by Rob Lucci and she gets away? How would Ace act in these situations?

Ace has been seen as the more mature, responsible older brother compared to Luffy.

In theory, we could speculate he might be looking at the bigger picture and consider the entire frame of reference. Ace could see there was no sort of deadline in Wano, the situation wasn't changing anytime soon and Tama's life was not particularly in danger. Much different from the scenarios I listed above. In practice, Ace is nearly as impulsive and reckless as Luffy. Sabo was the mature one. Ace chased Blackbeard into the other half of the Grand Line by himself when his crew tried to stop him, Ace picked a fight with Akainu at everyone's behest, Ace was chasing the head of the Strongest Man in the World the moment he entered the New World.

So why would Ace leave a lesser threat like Kaido and the Beast Pirates to rule over Tama and chase a bigger fish like Whitebeard? Taking an L, putting Ace in Udon wouldn't have stopped him like it didn't stop Luffy. At least I assume the man who tried to assasinate Whitebeard on his own ship multiple times every day would not have given up. I can think of some reasons:

1). Yamato told Ace about Toki's prophecy. Kaido and Orochi will be taken down by the 9 shadows in 4 years time. That will be the best time to launch an attack on Kaido while leaving behind the least amount of casualties in Wano, and Ace agreed. It's not just a simple fight between Ace and the Beast Pirates, the innocents in their Wano territory could easily get wrapped up in a pirate battle and that includes Tama.

2.) The Beast Pirates have something over Ace. Kaido of the 100 hostages. Ace was forced into an Oden situation. Perhaps he joined Kaido's crew as the Ace and then Yamato's intervention allowed him to flee. Either way, it's not a situation Ace could beat up someone to get out of. He left Wano for the moment. With a bigger crew, Ace could return with the right special personel who could prevent Kaido's dirty tricks while Ace is finally free to focus on the fighting.

3.) Yamato personally requested that Ace backs off. Ace doesn't know about the prophecy or when he should come back, but he just backed off to honor his friend Yamato's request. It's not going to stop Ace from liberating Wano when he feels it's okay to come back. For now, he sets his eyes back on Whitebeard.

4.) Ace wanted Tama to grow up first. This is a bit of a stretch. Ace wanted to recruit teenage or adult Tama the next time he stops by Wano. Which means Tama has to toughen up and survive on her own, sort like Ace/Luffy/Sabo in the jungle tossed in there by Garp. It's not really a good enough reason to leave Wano, but it does tell you when he intended to come back.

Lucikly, this is one mystery we won't have to think about too long. I could see Ace's Wano journey and the reason he left all answered as soon as next chapter.

Or Ace was a rookie with like 5 crew members and Kaido had 40,000 people 3 commanders.

 

[Drachenblut]

Another regret of ace which was never mentioned by him.

 

[Orojackson Refugee]

thing is, we know ace had the chance to come back to wano with WB crew.
Ace was just weirdly obsessed with blackbeard. I mean, you could still pursue blackbeard after saving wano.
i am a fan of one piece, but let's just be honest. The writing here is a mess. This is why one piece loses to kimetsu no yaiba as the best selling manga in this year

 

[Bogard]

Nailed it.

 

[Steven]

Ace suxs

 

[BangOO🍅]

He cant even broke the whole statue
but props to Ace for showing up the real will of D

 

[Jo_Ndule]

I will end up hating Ace on how Oda cant even just let the dude die