Powers & Abilities We already know a lunarians worst fear through Ryokugyu

[ShadowStyle369]

Zoro figuring out how kings lunarian gimmick works and his taming of enma needed 2 separate revelations. It just so happened Zoro figured both out at the same time

Enma was testing zoro to make him stronger. Conquerors is not a necessity to beat some fodder lunarian
I don’t understand how many times zoro, king, and everyone else has to say that lunarians are invulnerable to damage while their flame is burning for people to actually listen


Did zoro have to get stronger in order to defeat king especially within his time limit? Yeah
But pretending conquerors haki is required to defeat a lunarian and can hurt them while their flame burns is straight up illiterate ignorance fueled by weird agenda

And in the end lunarian king body meant absolutely nothing because he was afraid of zoro even with the flame on

 

[Gol D. Roger]

Kings techniques and movements were boosted by Speed Mode.

We only saw King overpowering UTH with a technique of his own. That doesnt mean anything regarding how he would handle Roof Zoro's stronger attacks in speed mode. There is no reason to believe he's walking off a clean Shishi Sonson in flame off, f.ex.

It isn't just that. We also saw King overpower Zoro in a direct confrontation:

Spoiler

I did not say, he'll tank attacks in speed mode. What I am saying is if King is this^ good outside speed mode, then he's much better while using it, which makes it that much harder to fight him off even if he doesn't have invulnerability. So there's little reason to act like not having an impeccable defense automatically results in a defeat when Zoro's more vulnerable to incoming attacks than King will ever be.

Zoro himself said in 1035 that attacking Flame On is useless and he reiterated it in Egghead. It's pretty clear that Flame On is Invincibility to damage & Flame Off is speed.

The same Zoro said King is scared of what he could do after gaining CoC, and King was indeed scared of a direct confrontation wtih Zoro. King wasn't confident in taking on Zoro in CQC post COC, period. Whether CoC attacks work on King or not is a different story altogether as it has never been tested.

Post automatically merged: Sep 4, 2024

Meh, King has nothing that Zoro can't handle defensively. Zoro blocks him every step of the way, shreds his flames every step of the way, the only issue is exhaustion. Given a timelimit (mink medicine, and enma) Zoro never stood a chance.

You give Zoro all the time in the world, intel, and it's a completely different fight. King's problems don't magically get solved because Zoro now does less damage, he still does a lot of damage even without CoC. Zoro tagged speed mode King in his first try when he found out. King didn't tag Zoro clean the entire fight, he can definitely bully him but that's not enough to put Zoro down for good when there's no strict timelimit involved. Perhaps he can outlast Zoro, tire him out if he fights smart...

I didn't say that's enough to take down Zoro. All I am saying is just taking out the Lunarian defense doesn't warrant a victory against King. It's not like he's a fodder outside his defense or something. He was as good if not better than Zoro in combat although his attacks aren't quite as powerful, and effective.

 

[Ryuarashi]

Even if that were true, my point still stands though. He couldn't confirm it until he gained COC because he couldn't do anything to King until he gained COC to confirm his theory.

No it doesn't stand, based on Zoro's dialogue that is the first time he tested the theory, which in he would not have been able to do before due enma activating on its own.

Previously he was spamming attacks while King had his Flames on.

ACOC did nothing other than increasing the amount of damage Zoro dealt, with or without ACOC Zoro still beats King who was unable to react to attacks like Shishi sonson.

 

[Gol D. Roger]

No it doesn't stand, based on Zoro's dialogue that is the first time he tested the theory, which in he would not have been able to do before due enma activating on its own.

Previously he was spamming attacks while King had his Flames on.

ACOC did nothing other than increasing the amount of damage Zoro dealt, with or without ACOC Zoro still beats King who was unable to react to attacks like Shishi sonson.

They've been fighting for a long time before Enma started acting up. So yeah, it still stands.

 

[Ryuarashi]

They've been fighting for a long time before Enma started acting up. So yeah, it still stands.

It cant stand, even if we were to pretend you're right the basis of your argument contradicts what Zoro said in Egghead about the Serpahim.

The entire fight Zoro's primary focus was to figure out King's race/gimmick and nothing else.

He never said he lacked power or speed or is outmatched.

 

[ConquistadoR]

The same Zoro said King is scared of what he could do after gaining CoC, and King was indeed scared of a direct confrontation wtih Zoro. King wasn't confident in taking on Zoro in CQC post COC, period. Whether CoC attacks work on King or not is a different story altogether as it has never been tested

It is not post CoC, it is post Zoro figuring out when he cut King.

King asks him "So you've figured out the rules of my body" and then Zoro taunts him for blocking.

Post automatically merged: Sep 4, 2024

It cant stand, even if we were to pretend you're right the basis of your argument contradicts what Zoro said in Egghead about the Serpahim.

The entire fight Zoro's primary focus was to figure out King's race/gimmick and nothing else.

He never said he lacked power or speed or is outmatched.

Exactly.

 

[Gol D. Roger]

It cant stand, even if we were to pretend you're right the basis of your argument contradicts what Zoro said in Egghead about the Serpahim.

The entire fight Zoro's primary focus was to figure out King's race/gimmick and nothing else.

He never said he lacked power or speed or is outmatched.

It's not a matter of opinion though. Zoro literally did not manage to confirm his theory until he's got his hands on CoC, period, so there's little room to pretend. None of what I said contradicts what Zoro said. We do not know if CoC based attacks work on King because Zoro never tested it, but even if Zoro is right, that doesn't change the fact that King was legit scared of approaching Zoro post CoC, which Zoro himself pointed out. You can't really pick and chose dialogues that only suits your arguments while completely disregarding other evidence from the same source, and pretend you're making a point.

Post automatically merged: Sep 4, 2024

It is not post CoC, it is post Zoro figuring out when he cut King.

King asks him "So you've figured out the rules of my body" and then Zoro taunts him for blocking.

Why would he be suddenly scarred of what Zoro can do to himself in flame on mode when he legit took a 1000 attacks from the same Zoro? At least make it make sense.

 

[trav]

You're a clown

bro called him a clown

 

[HA001]

bro called him a clown

How you been ? Been a while

 

[Ryuarashi]

It's not a matter of opinion though. Zoro literally did not manage to confirm his theory until he's got his hands on CoC, period, so there's little room to pretend

It is an opinion, borderline headcannon at that. We have confirmation via dialogue that King's weakness is something he theorized about before unlocking COC.

You're implying that Zoro has been attacking both Flame On and Flame OFF the entire time but ACOC made it magically possible for him to hurt Flame Off when there's 0 indication of that he was unable to do that prior.

We do not know if CoC based attacks work on King because Zoro never tested it, but even if Zoro is right, that doesn't change the fact that King was legit scared of approaching Zoro post CoC, which Zoro himself pointed ouconformed.

Assumptions and no solid confirmation. We can use the same argument and say King is not a swordsman because of Zoro's statement

You're arguing ambiguity which falls falt infront of actual confirmed info which is King/Lunarians are invulnerable while their Flames are active.

You can't really pick and chose dialogues that only suits your arguments while completely disregarding other evidence from the same source, and pretend you're making a point.

I dont pick and choose, but your entire argument is based on opinions, and assumptions while ignoring direct statements (Zoro in Egghead)

 

[ConquistadoR]

Why would he be suddenly scarred of what Zoro can do to himself in flame on mode when he legit took a 1000 attacks from the same Zoro? At least make it make sense.

Once again, it isnt about what Zoro will do to flame on which is zilch.

It is about what Zoro would to King if he went flame off since both of them know now that Zoro understands the rules of King's body.

 

[ShadowStyle369]

Once again, it isnt about what Zoro will do to flame on which is zilch.

It is about what Zoro would to King if he went flame off since both of them know now that Zoro understands the rules of King's body.

But to say that is to ignore that king is blocking with the flame on ??? You say zoro will do zilch but freaking king doesn’t think that anymore

Zoro:shishisonson

king: lets it connect and uses it to his advantage (flame on) not fazed at all.



king: drops guard and lets Zoro get a free hit (flame on)

Zoro: stabs him triggering jackpot.

Yes understanding kings body did matter but at the end of the fight.

Zoro:clashing with king not using king of hell because the flame is on he thinks king is invincible.

king:actively blocking Zoro even with the flame on.

Zoro:ohhh notices the flame on and says to king why bother block my attacks. I thought they did nothing to you!!! Unless you are scared of what I can do.

King quite literally thinks his flame on defend will not hold up to zoro using adv coc how can this be interpreted any other way