Saber

King of Knights
My first question would be - how does Saber know my scum tell? He couldn't scum hunt if scum were right in front of him. He certainly hasn't got the first clue about any tells of mine. The case in point, apparently this guy spent a week studying my game, and then the very next game we play, he spends all of day 2 tunneling. He ends up voting me with scum in LyLo but because the setup was weird he ends up getting lynched and we win somehow anyway. The point being, even then he was claiming that I was on "scum meta" when I was town.

If you've spent a week studying someone and the best you can do is wrongfully tunnel them the game after, I'd expect some revision on how you approach the slot next time. Here, he just uses it as an excuse to vote and then dips again.

I cannot guarantee he's scum. I've never seen him as scum. He could just be terrible and town. He would certainly fit right in! But if I'm looking at my wagon, well that certainly fits the profile of scum looking to secure mislynches.
either you're scum or the most insufferable dipshit with a stick up your ass to ever exist, honestly, from what i've seen and heard about you, you're probably both
your scum tell is when you try to fake emotions, like "getting mad" at other players, and the vote on yourself. and since, ratchet, you come off like a skinwalker who didn’t know what emotions were until you realized AtE was a viable strategy for mafia games, it's hard not to find it scummy
when you're town, you at least try to keep things logical, was i scum reading you in that other game until, from my pov, it was almost impossible for you to be town? no, and not once in that game did i use the weebs game as an example to read you as scum because it was different
i didn’t use meta in that game to vote you out for a second, i’m doing it now because you're playing like weebs game blue mafia ratchet again
 
either you're scum or the most insufferable dipshit with a stick up your ass to ever exist, honestly, from what i've seen and heard about you, you're probably both
your scum tell is when you try to fake emotions, like "getting mad" at other players, and the vote on yourself. and since, ratchet, you come off like a skinwalker who didn’t know what emotions were until you realized AtE was a viable strategy for mafia games, it's hard not to find it scummy
when you're town, you at least try to keep things logical, was i scum reading you in that other game until, from my pov, it was almost impossible for you to be town? no, and not once in that game did i use the weebs game as an example to read you as scum because it was different
i didn’t use meta in that game to vote you out for a second, i’m doing it now because you're playing like weebs game blue mafia ratchet again
 

Ratchet

The End and the Beginning
either you're scum or the most insufferable dipshit with a stick up your ass to ever exist, honestly, from what i've seen and heard about you, you're probably both
your scum tell is when you try to fake emotions, like "getting mad" at other players, and the vote on yourself. and since, ratchet, you come off like a skinwalker who didn’t know what emotions were until you realized AtE was a viable strategy for mafia games, it's hard not to find it scummy
when you're town, you at least try to keep things logical, was i scum reading you in that other game until, from my pov, it was almost impossible for you to be town? no, and not once in that game did i use the weebs game as an example to read you as scum because it was different
i didn’t use meta in that game to vote you out for a second, i’m doing it now because you're playing like weebs game blue mafia ratchet again
Ad hominem. I mocked your Mafia ability, you've insulted me as a person, twice in this paragraph. Bolded both of them. Do you think that's acceptable? Like seriously. Do you think that this is an acceptable thing to say to someone?

On topic. This game has not been fun, Saber. It's true. From my position, the nest thing I could do is press. I vote myself to create a situation where scum have to make a decision. Yes, I was heated. That's why, when I cooled off, I waited until I got something and then unvoted myself. I wouldn't be sorry if I got mislynched at all. But I didn't want to be accused of gamethrowing, because I'm not trying to gamethrow.

In the game I referenced, no, absolutely not, from your POV it was not impossible to see me as anything but scum. You hard defended scum, Day 2, and voted for me because of these non-existent scum tells you think you have. I only became convinced you were scum after Poyser didn't vote, because from my POV, there were 2 Mafia, not 1. Of course, there was only 1 in the end, it was a weird setup.

I could bring up quotes where you referenced Weebs because you were misreading my posts. That's fine, I don't particularly care if you misread me lol. But it's very much true that if you have spent a week trying to find tells, and then follow up next game misreading the player, then that would suggest you didn't find tells.

If you think I'm scum, whatever. You can can me bad, you can say I'm incapable, inept, incompetent, pick whatever you please. I don't care how much you flame me in Mafia terms. But you don't get to escalate into personal insults because you're upset. Now I'm going to leave this there, because even though making disparaging remarks about my person is grounds for removal, I'm going to hope that it's simply said in response to what I said about your ability. But if you ever insult me in this way again, we're going to have problems. Am I clear.

You don't have to like me. After seeing this, I can't say I care for you either. But there are lines that you don't cross, I'm okay with being called an idiot, I'm not okay with being called a sociopath. I'll be hoping for an apology in due course too, though I can't say I expect one.
 

Saber

King of Knights
Ad hominem. I mocked your Mafia ability, you've insulted me as a person, twice in this paragraph. Bolded both of them. Do you think that's acceptable? Like seriously. Do you think that this is an acceptable thing to say to someone?

On topic. This game has not been fun, Saber. It's true. From my position, the nest thing I could do is press. I vote myself to create a situation where scum have to make a decision. Yes, I was heated. That's why, when I cooled off, I waited until I got something and then unvoted myself. I wouldn't be sorry if I got mislynched at all. But I didn't want to be accused of gamethrowing, because I'm not trying to gamethrow.

In the game I referenced, no, absolutely not, from your POV it was not impossible to see me as anything but scum. You hard defended scum, Day 2, and voted for me because of these non-existent scum tells you think you have. I only became convinced you were scum after Poyser didn't vote, because from my POV, there were 2 Mafia, not 1. Of course, there was only 1 in the end, it was a weird setup.

I could bring up quotes where you referenced Weebs because you were misreading my posts. That's fine, I don't particularly care if you misread me lol. But it's very much true that if you have spent a week trying to find tells, and then follow up next game misreading the player, then that would suggest you didn't find tells.

If you think I'm scum, whatever. You can can me bad, you can say I'm incapable, inept, incompetent, pick whatever you please. I don't care how much you flame me in Mafia terms. But you don't get to escalate into personal insults because you're upset. Now I'm going to leave this there, because even though making disparaging remarks about my person is grounds for removal, I'm going to hope that it's simply said in response to what I said about your ability. But if you ever insult me in this way again, we're going to have problems. Am I clear.

You don't have to like me. After seeing this, I can't say I care for you either. But there are lines that you don't cross, I'm okay with being called an idiot, I'm not okay with being called a sociopath. I'll be hoping for an apology in due course too, though I can't say I expect one.
i didn't call you a sociopath bro i said you sound weird and ungenuine when you try to pull AtE, it wasn't that deep, so sorry
 

Ratchet

The End and the Beginning
i didn't call you a sociopath bro i said you sound weird and ungenuine when you try to pull AtE, it wasn't that deep, so sorry
No you know what you said, alright, one thing I have no tolerance for is sugercoating things once you've said it. I appreciate that it was said in anger, and not necessarily reflective of deeper personal animosity (whether it was or not is up to you). Charitably, maybe it sounded better/less vitriolic in your head. Whatever the case may be, you know exactly where the line you don't cross is now, and I don't expect to be having this conversation again.
 
Maybe Alexis is just scum fake claiming survivor. I mean that claim at face value is a complete joke, not even fuji would make the tail bitch an indi would he? What depths does his degeneracy descend to to make the worst character in this flavor (and that's saying something) one of his precious indies?
 

Ratchet

The End and the Beginning
Maybe Alexis is just scum fake claiming survivor. I mean that claim at face value is a complete joke, not even fuji would make the tail bitch an indi would he? What depths does his degeneracy descend to to make the worst character in this flavor (and that's saying something) one of his precious indies?
I'm in agreement with this to be honest. Again, I cannot reconcile his vote on me whatsoever from his mindset. I mean he knows to claim it and he knows what it does. So he claims it and then randomly votes for the player who has been defending his claim, probably the most in the game? My feeling is, it's a perspective slip. I'm okay with lynching him today as well.
 

Saber

King of Knights
Maybe Alexis is just scum fake claiming survivor. I mean that claim at face value is a complete joke, not even fuji would make the tail bitch an indi would he? What depths does his degeneracy descend to to make the worst character in this flavor (and that's saying something) one of his precious indies?
could be a fake claim, they exist because luka fake claimed endeavor
 
Luka was gut feel maybe but got real suspect with the duel claim and then really really suspect when he dulled reloaded

Reloaded claimed block which we already had someone flip I believe and it felt like it was scum Luka va scum reloaded

Ratchet, no idea, did I flip my read of him?
Not a fan of this response because this sentiment wasn't present in anything I can find from you Day 2:

Vote Mr Reloaded To Win The Duel
he woke up at the right time to hammer Reloaded

and yet chose to duel instead of hammering lol
Thats my rhought too. @York wouldn't as such he just hammer reloaded and then duel someone else tomorrow

I could actually see a scum vs scum scenario but not really scum vs town
if it's scum v town, I think he'd be better off dueling today as opposed to hammering, because then he'd have to deal with being sussed for hammering a townie tomorrow, making his duel less of a sure thing. It's also possible he could be mates with, say, Yoho, who is experiencing some pressure today, and could be forced into dueling him tomorrow if he waited.

Personally I would put my money on Scum V Scum though. It certainly doesn't feel like town v town.
So why let the scum blocker live?
I don't get the impression that you got real suspect at all here of Luka, in fact you're basically defending him minus the admission that it could be scum/scum instead of scum/town. Which really serves more to lynch Reloaded than it does to suspect Luka.
 
In fact it makes less sense that you agree with indigo's take there, because Indigo was reading Reloaded as town. You on the other hand, presuming Reloaded is scum, basically said Luka was town for refusing to hammer him, which makes no sense.
 
So why let the scum blocker live?
I was kinda confused by what he meant here but I think I understand now - he sees York saying Luka/Relo are S/S, and Polar is saying of the two why not kill off the "scum blocker" first. He doesn't really question or explore Luka being scum here in spite of his town read on him, and instead keeps bringing up Reloaded. Getting scum Aurelian vibes from this
 

Ratchet

The End and the Beginning
1- Saber
4- The Orca
5- Polar Bear
6- Alexis2282AE
7- Gadonkadonk
8- York
9- Charlie
14- Random Asshole/Ultra
15- Ratchet
16- Apollo

There are a couple of reaches here. I can still see Saber as possible scum, based on general involvement, but it's not the foremost consideration I have there now. Reading Gad is a prayer at the best of times lately, but in my interaction with him he felt reasonably genuine. I think Charlie has been off for a while now. Ultra, I still think his early arguments in particular leave room for desire but I can't think of a good reason why he doesn't just take the lynch there. So all in all, I think I'm okay with this.
 
1- Saber
4- The Orca
5- Polar Bear
6- Alexis2282AE
7- Gadonkadonk
8- York
9- Charlie
14- Random Asshole/Ultra
15- Ratchet
16- Apollo

There are a couple of reaches here. I can still see Saber as possible scum, based on general involvement, but it's not the foremost consideration I have there now. Reading Gad is a prayer at the best of times lately, but in my interaction with him he felt reasonably genuine. I think Charlie has been off for a while now. Ultra, I still think his early arguments in particular leave room for desire but I can't think of a good reason why he doesn't just take the lynch there. So all in all, I think I'm okay with this.
Damn you're town huh. Cringe
 
I also feel like if I assume Polar is town his treatment of his partner Luka probably reflects how he's treating a partner in Charles here - which is mostly to not acknowledge their existence and start pummeling into something else to distract from them
 
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