Spoiler One Piece Chapter 1143 Spoilers Discussion

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By Oda's own words, Doffy was supposed to fight alongside Kaido in Wano. That's why he was called Joker. K/Q were not fighting beside him.

It's clear originally Oda had something like:

Luffy v. Kaido
Kid v. BM
Law v. Joker

Zoro/Sanji v. King/Queen

But he said he was surprised by how far Law had come. So he got rid of Doffy early, and downgraded Kid/upgraded Law to take down BM.



Luffy grabbed Kaido. Not sure why we keep having this convo. He's grabbed even Kizaru multiple times.
Yes that's a draft/retcon. Just like Shanks originally being the leader of the Holy Knights in an early draft. It's not reliable for powerscaling because it never actually happened.
 
Yes that's a draft/retcon. Just like Shanks originally being the leader of the Holy Knights in an early draft. It's not reliable for powerscaling because it never actually happened.
The thing is "Joker" made it into the story, so it's quite clear it was a last minute change.

I doubt Oda planned PH + DR to be 150 chapters. DR was set up for an escape arc and Doffy to be dealt with in Wano, but Luffy/Law + Colosseum fighters did the job.
 

Elder Lee Hung

Conqueror of the Stars
Luffy grabbed Kaido. Not sure why we keep having this convo. He's grabbed even Kizaru multiple times.
Kaido burned his hand off of him. Kaido didn’t have to take that attack, Kaido just has the IQ of the average One Piss fan. Lol

Regardless you keep dodging the point because you are wrong and are trying to save face. You have no idea of Kuzan’s ceiling, but you assume his ceiling is the same as Larp because of one clash. Despite Kuzan not even using his fruit during that clash and Oda already showing us that Aokiji reached Prime Garp’s level with just his fists.
 
:DanySquint:
that isn’t the point , our main argument was that fujitora is the main swordsman among admirals and it was visibly shown in DR , meanwhile gb has shown absolute nothing abt swordsmanship in his intro arc .

u tried to debunk that by showing Fuji’s intro panels where he crushes people with his gravity and summons meteors from space but it’s very visibl that he also used his sword to do those .

Then u chose to highlight his sword as a walking STICK ? that isn’t even close to what I am trying to say , Fuji can summon meteors or crush people without his sword BUT he still uses his sword as the catalyst to do that stuff so he is highlighted as a swordsman .
He has had like, 4 chapters of screentime, max. Unlike Fujitora, he didn't have an entire intro arc. Also, I have no idea what you mean by "fujitora is using his sword to do those". Do you believe his sword is connected to his DF in some way?
 
By Oda's own words, Doffy was supposed to fight alongside Kaido in Wano. That's why he was called Joker. K/Q were not fighting beside him.

It's clear originally Oda had something like:

Luffy v. Kaido
Kid v. BM
Law v. Joker

Zoro/Sanji v. King/Queen

But he said he was surprised by how far Law had come. So he got rid of Doffy early, and downgraded Kid/upgraded Law to take down BM.



Luffy grabbed Kaido. Not sure why we keep having this convo. He's grabbed even Kizaru multiple times.
Kid was supposed to be yonkou lvl
 
The thing is "Joker" made it into the story, so it's quite clear it was a last minute change.

I doubt Oda planned PH + DR to be 150 chapters. DR was set up for an escape arc and Doffy to be dealt with in Wano, but Luffy/Law + Colosseum fighters did the job.
I wonder how One piece would be like if Doflamingo fell in Wano and Katakuri never happened

The yonko Saga would probably feel less awkward as Oda modified everything by his last minute changes
 
Kaido burned his hand off of him. Kaido didn’t have to take that attack, Kaido just has the IQ of the average One Piss fan. Lol

Regardless you keep dodging the point because you are wrong and are trying to save face. You have no idea of Kuzan’s ceiling, but you assume his ceiling is the same as Larp because of one clash. Despite Kuzan not even using his fruit during that clash and Oda already showing us that Aokiji reached Prime Garp’s level with just his fists.
I think current Kuzan can beat Garp 1 on 1, so not sure what you're going on about.

I'm just saying in terms of physical strength, Kuzan is strong, but there's nothing there that proves he's "Garp level". Garp trained him to a strong level, but in an all out clash fist-to-fist Garp would win.
 
The thing is "Joker" made it into the story, so it's quite clear it was a last minute change.

I doubt Oda planned PH + DR to be 150 chapters. DR was set up for an escape arc and Doffy to be dealt with in Wano, but Luffy/Law + Colosseum fighters did the job.
We basically know for a fact that Dressrosa was basically a last minute addition that Oda didn't plan, but I don't see how that changes Doffys scaling
 
Tbh I think the problem is that people are too focused on a top tier having one specific thing they're really good at and they start to believe that if even just ONE character is as skilled at it, they're worthless.
Like Aramaki having a black blade suddenly making Mihawk's feat of forging one obsolete.
I think at the end of the day that doesn't even matter. I mean, honestly, who cares if Kuzan has Prime Garp's physical strength? He doesn't have his level of Haki or skill with punching and that's what matters.
Aramaki isn't as skilled as Mihawk and his blade is highly likely to be inferior to Mihawk's especially since it's said multiple times that Yoru is the finest/best sword in the world.
Also wanna mention that Shanks was said to have Haki near Joyboy's, yet it's obvious that Joyboy > Shanks, because Joyboy has a busted fruit and Shanks doesn't (among other things).
 
Because he was supposed to fight alongside Kaido and be defeated by Wano Law?
But in this alternative scenario, Law doesn't get any stronger after almost being killed. Law would most likely be the one who takes out Doffy while Luffy fights Kaido...
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As opposed to what happened in the actual manga, where Luffy and Law together took down Doffy
 
Because he was supposed to fight alongside Kaido and be defeated by Wano Law?
Again.. Just look at King.
He was obviously supposed to be a Marco opponent, and he was even capable of being hurt by both Marco and Zoro while his flame was on.
Then, just a mere few chapters later, he's suddenly a god who can tank some of Zoro's strongest attacks and ragdoll the fuck out of him even though he was being matched, damaged and overwhelmed by Marco a little while ago.
Just like Oda made King to be stronger than he originally planned, he made Doffy weaker than he originally planned.
 
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