Questions & Mysteries Did the hammer eat the fruit or did the squirel eat the fruit?
- Thread starter Tai long
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How would you even know what an Elbaf squirrel’s lifespan is? It could be a godlike squirrel to begin with, like Ratatoskr. And their owl is centuries old af too so your entire rant is moot.
Plus, why would it willingly transform into one after getting bonked? It’s clear that Loki knocked him out of his Zoan form. It’s no different from Luffy deflating after taking enough damage or Kaido reverting to his base form.
Plus, why would it willingly transform into one after getting bonked? It’s clear that Loki knocked him out of his Zoan form. It’s no different from Luffy deflating after taking enough damage or Kaido reverting to his base form.
Why would the squirrel be constantly in its Zoan form, though? The squirrel form rarely ever appears, which is weird if it's supposed to be its regular form. It should turrn into a hammer only when needed in combat.
You're saying it willingly turned into a squirrel after getting bonked, but you don't know that. Zoan users can lose control of their power in stressful situations.
You're saying it willingly turned into a squirrel after getting bonked, but you don't know that. Zoan users can lose control of their power in stressful situations.
We don’t know how long it stays as a hammer, and I doubt Oda even thinks about that. Ragnir will also automatically be combat-ready when someone enters the treasure vault. It appearing as a squirrel as it accepted Loki could be a sign that it was at ease. This actually helps my argument, why would it hold back, and not use its stronger form when protecting the df? The stronger form or zoan form is the hammer.
My argument is that it lost control and reverted to its base form after Loki hit it hard.
My argument is that it lost control and reverted to its base form after Loki hit it hard.
I mean I'm not sure a mere squirrel would give a shit about protecting the DF. In Norse mythology, Mjolnir is just a hammer choosing a wielder considered worthy, so there's a good chance the hammer has a will of its own because it was enchanted like Mjolnir or something.
If Ragnir stayed with Loki for such a long time while he was imprisoned, it means nobody could move it, which means it was a hammer most of the time. Maybe that's a detail Oda overlooked, but as things stand now, it's just an odd thing to do for a squirrel. It doesn't disprove your take, but it has to be taken into consideration.
Zoan DFs work in an unpredictable way. Look at Chopper, his base form is Walk Point, but the form that tends to be treated like his natural one is Brain Point. Even though it's a Zoan transformation, he always reverts to that form when he's weakened or out of commission. So a form that's technically a Zoan transformation can work like a base forrm if it's actually a regressive form that weakens the user.
If Ragnir stayed with Loki for such a long time while he was imprisoned, it means nobody could move it, which means it was a hammer most of the time. Maybe that's a detail Oda overlooked, but as things stand now, it's just an odd thing to do for a squirrel. It doesn't disprove your take, but it has to be taken into consideration.
Zoan DFs work in an unpredictable way. Look at Chopper, his base form is Walk Point, but the form that tends to be treated like his natural one is Brain Point. Even though it's a Zoan transformation, he always reverts to that form when he's weakened or out of commission. So a form that's technically a Zoan transformation can work like a base forrm if it's actually a regressive form that weakens the user.
Hammer "Eat" the Zoan DF Fruit since only Zoan capable of that, but Interesting part is we knew Vegapunk is the one who did it first on Current One Piece Era, Ancient Civilizations on Void Era Gotta had those Knowledge and a forbidden one like how Teach able to eat 2 DF. Lore Piece gonna go crazy especially the Moon Part
Cuz its not an ordinary Squirrel Its Ratatoskr, who in myth and few depictions in games like God of War considered as Immortal being
Cuz its not an ordinary Squirrel Its Ratatoskr, who in myth and few depictions in games like God of War considered as Immortal being
I'm leaning towards "Hammer that ate a Squirrel Fruit" rather than "Squirrel that ate a Hammer Fruit", myself.
If Ragnir has outlasted several Elbaph Kings, that means it's OLD. Giants can live more than 400 years, if Jorul and Jarul are any indication.. So, it's pretty likely this Hammer-Squirrel is over a 1000 years old. Either coming from the Void Century or even before that. Possibly coming from the First World.
That would be PRETTY long for a squirrel to live. Even a Elbaph squirrel with a longer than normal lifespan. Elbpah Giants live about 3 times longer than normal Humans. The average squirrel can live around 10 to 20 years in the real world. So, even at the high end of that, Ragnir should have died at age 60, if he was "just a normal squirrel". That kind of makes me think Ragnir could just be a Hammer that ate a Squirrel Fruit. Because then...Hammers don't really age. If Ragnir was a Hammer, he'd be functionally immortal. And again, it's possible this is a object that ate a Devil Fruit, because it's probably old enough to have been around since the Void Century or maybe even the First World. The technology would have been there, supposedly
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squirrel
I can't really disprove the idea that Ragnir could just be a "legendary" Squirrel that ate a Hammer Fruit, though. And we have seen some curiously long-lived animals. The Sea Kings seem to have been living since the Void Century, given their comments about "those two meeting again". As has Zunesha, since he was friends with Joyboy. Ragnir could be like them. Possibly with some tie to the Ancient Weapons or...something else. Possibly having curiously long lives just by absorbing bits of Joyboy or Nika's powers? Or just from Advanced Ancient Technology? So, if Ragnir turns out to have some connection to Uranos, then that could mean he's just a VERY long lived Squirrel, just like how Zunesha is a very long lived elephant.
Although, there is the possibility that Ragnir could just be...something else. Something we haven't quite seen before. Could Ragnir be similar to whatever the Gorosei are? Possibly not using a "Devil Fruit" per se, but some other power? If the Gorosei really aren't using Devil Fruits, and are instead "Yokai", then maybe Ragnir is something similar, just using Nika's power instead of Imu's?
Random thought time!
Could Ragnir actually be one of the original Nika's "weapons"? We already know from various depictions that Nika wielded a Sword, a Spear, and a Shield. Those could all be different "incarnations" of Nika, or they could all just be the same guy. Could Nika also have had a hammer? Could ALL of Nika's weapons actually be animal companions? Kind of like the legend of Momotaro? Or something like Tarzan or the Jungle Book? Could Nika have had a bunch of weapons that had various Zoan Fruits (or animals that had weapon Paramecia Fruits), literally making himself a small army of "friends" he could use as weapons? What little we've seen of Nika does kind of give me a "jungle boy" vibe.
So, I don't know. We really don't know enough to guess. I'm leaning towards "Hammer". But, there are various ways to make "Squirrel" happen. This is probably going to end up being a SBS question. Hopefully, Oda doesn't just sidestep the question with a joke. Or just say that "Ragnir thinks this is too personal of a question!".
If Ragnir has outlasted several Elbaph Kings, that means it's OLD. Giants can live more than 400 years, if Jorul and Jarul are any indication.. So, it's pretty likely this Hammer-Squirrel is over a 1000 years old. Either coming from the Void Century or even before that. Possibly coming from the First World.
That would be PRETTY long for a squirrel to live. Even a Elbaph squirrel with a longer than normal lifespan. Elbpah Giants live about 3 times longer than normal Humans. The average squirrel can live around 10 to 20 years in the real world. So, even at the high end of that, Ragnir should have died at age 60, if he was "just a normal squirrel". That kind of makes me think Ragnir could just be a Hammer that ate a Squirrel Fruit. Because then...Hammers don't really age. If Ragnir was a Hammer, he'd be functionally immortal. And again, it's possible this is a object that ate a Devil Fruit, because it's probably old enough to have been around since the Void Century or maybe even the First World. The technology would have been there, supposedly
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squirrel
I can't really disprove the idea that Ragnir could just be a "legendary" Squirrel that ate a Hammer Fruit, though. And we have seen some curiously long-lived animals. The Sea Kings seem to have been living since the Void Century, given their comments about "those two meeting again". As has Zunesha, since he was friends with Joyboy. Ragnir could be like them. Possibly with some tie to the Ancient Weapons or...something else. Possibly having curiously long lives just by absorbing bits of Joyboy or Nika's powers? Or just from Advanced Ancient Technology? So, if Ragnir turns out to have some connection to Uranos, then that could mean he's just a VERY long lived Squirrel, just like how Zunesha is a very long lived elephant.
Although, there is the possibility that Ragnir could just be...something else. Something we haven't quite seen before. Could Ragnir be similar to whatever the Gorosei are? Possibly not using a "Devil Fruit" per se, but some other power? If the Gorosei really aren't using Devil Fruits, and are instead "Yokai", then maybe Ragnir is something similar, just using Nika's power instead of Imu's?
Random thought time!
Could Ragnir actually be one of the original Nika's "weapons"? We already know from various depictions that Nika wielded a Sword, a Spear, and a Shield. Those could all be different "incarnations" of Nika, or they could all just be the same guy. Could Nika also have had a hammer? Could ALL of Nika's weapons actually be animal companions? Kind of like the legend of Momotaro? Or something like Tarzan or the Jungle Book? Could Nika have had a bunch of weapons that had various Zoan Fruits (or animals that had weapon Paramecia Fruits), literally making himself a small army of "friends" he could use as weapons? What little we've seen of Nika does kind of give me a "jungle boy" vibe.
So, I don't know. We really don't know enough to guess. I'm leaning towards "Hammer". But, there are various ways to make "Squirrel" happen. This is probably going to end up being a SBS question. Hopefully, Oda doesn't just sidestep the question with a joke. Or just say that "Ragnir thinks this is too personal of a question!".
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Unless Ragnir is like this from Void Century time. Generations of Elbaf rulers couldn't tame it, and knowing the life span of giants there's been like 4 generations tops since the Void Century and Ancient Kingdom. And knowing that Vegapunk's inventions are "chasing" the level of the Ancient Kingdom there's reason to believe they already knew how to give weapons Devil Fruits
I don't, it's you who is asserting an Elbaph squirrel can outlive generations of giants, a species we know ages at 1/3 the rate of humans because the narrative explictely drew that connection.
We have no basis Elbaph squirrels age at an even slow rate.
Assumptions are fine if you have something to base them on. We have nothing to base this on.
We have even less context for the owl, but don't let that stop you.
Why do you think DF users introduced themselves the way they do? Consuming DF fundamentally changes what they are.
As others have pointed out, Chopper reverts to this little mascot design by default.
We have no basis Elbaph squirrels age at an even slow rate.
Assumptions are fine if you have something to base them on. We have nothing to base this on.
We have even less context for the owl, but don't let that stop you.
Why do you think DF users introduced themselves the way they do? Consuming DF fundamentally changes what they are.
As others have pointed out, Chopper reverts to this little mascot design by default.
I do have a basis. It’s called Norse mythology, and Ragnir’s name is a mix of Ratatoskr or Ragnarok and Mjolnir.
You’re the one insisting that this squirrel should age the way you expect. I already gave you the owl as a counterexample, and it completely undermines that narrative. The point is that we have a real, on-panel example of an Elbaf animal living for centuries.
You’re the one insisting that this squirrel should age the way you expect. I already gave you the owl as a counterexample, and it completely undermines that narrative. The point is that we have a real, on-panel example of an Elbaf animal living for centuries.
Clear this up for me, is your assertion the squirrel was a mythological creature based on Norse mythology before consuming a DF?
I'm not insisting anything. I'm making the reasonable assumption Elbaph animals don't live for centuries beyond the lifespan of giants.
That assumption is based on what the narrative tells us about giants and humans.
I addressed this. We know less about the owl than we do about Ragnir, it's not a counterexample of anything because we don't know anything.
I'm not insisting anything. I'm making the reasonable assumption Elbaph animals don't live for centuries beyond the lifespan of giants.
That assumption is based on what the narrative tells us about giants and humans.
I addressed this. We know less about the owl than we do about Ragnir, it's not a counterexample of anything because we don't know anything.
Yup, and it’s a reasonable assumption. The squirrel is clearly based on Ratatoskr, whether you think it has a Zoan fruit or is Ratatoskr itself.
The owl is a counterexample that shows you shouldn’t rule out the possibility of an Elbaf squirrel, especially one based on a Norse god, being able to live for centuries. The giants even speculated that the owl ate a size-alteration fruit, which has nothing to do with life expectancy. That owl is simply mystical and has natural longevity to begin with.
The owl is a counterexample that shows you shouldn’t rule out the possibility of an Elbaf squirrel, especially one based on a Norse god, being able to live for centuries. The giants even speculated that the owl ate a size-alteration fruit, which has nothing to do with life expectancy. That owl is simply mystical and has natural longevity to begin with.
