Spoiler One Piece Chapter 1175 Spoilers Discussion

[sanjikun]

Lolda made powerscaling boring af with all the powercreep going on in this arc tbh.

Number 1 Rule of OP: Never take powerscaling hype at the beginning of an arc seriously.

Remember how insane Jack looked at the start of Zou? In reality he was a scrub.

 

[pg13]

I haven’t waited this long for raws since the Oden Flashback days , back when they got Jaminis Box outta here. They were crack in down on scans back then.

 

[Shiroyru]

I don't think Kisame was retconned necessarily. He remains like, tiers below Itachi, and keeps up that rivalry with Gai. Let's not forget that matchups play a role. Samehada can absorb chakra against Killer B, who replies on tailed beasts and is constantly... emiting it? Idk what to call it

Orochimaru was nerfed against 4 tails Naruto lol. Plus, did he even really lose or get overpowered? He was mostly messing around, until he realized it was too much of a threat to be a joke. It doesn't mean he'd lose necessarily.

That doesn’t change the fact that Kisame could still keep up with V2 Bee. 7th Gate Gai is beating most Kage, no shame in losing to him, especially when Kisame was nerfed and at a matchup disadvantage. Aoba described Kisame as “the man strong enough to be paired with Itachi,” which implies some degree of relativity.

Orochimaru failed to even pierce 4T Naruto with his Kusanagi sword and was running out of chakra. 4T Naruto could have kept going if Yamato didn’t suppress him.

 

[Shiroyru]

Number 1 Rule of OP: Never take powerscaling hype at the beginning of an arc seriously.

Remember how insane Jack looked at the start of Zou? In reality he was a scrub.

Remember how insane Doflamingo looked at Marineford? In reality he was a scrub.

 

[Mr. Reloaded]

.

 

[nik87]

Lolda made powerscaling boring af with all the powercreep going on in this arc tbh.

Where do you see the power creep?
Loki the DF merchant?
The same DF merchant that Shanks clapped?

 

[Shiroyru]

Idk about some direct attack, but It was pretty much told, not even hinted, that BB was about to so something.

Devon, Augur, and Caribou left Egghead at the same time time as the SHs to rendezvous with Teach at Hachinosu. It’ll have only been a day or two since they arrived. That’s not nearly enough time for the BBPs to sail all the way to Mariejois and launch an attack. Besides, BB’s next move after meeting Caribou would logically be to go after one of the Ancient Weapons

 

[Mr. Reloaded]

I haven’t waited this long for raws since the Oden Flashback days , back when they got Jaminis Box outta here. They were crack in down on scans back then.

Jamininis Box and Mangastream

 

[John Akainu]

Aren't you a Shiryu fan? Not sure why you're jumping on me even if you generally dislike me.

Never said i was a Shiryu fan but i consider him pretty strong, and no, i don't dislike you, your takes and predictions are just too unhinged

 

[Redboy776]

Shiryu and Kuzan >>>>>>>Law

Shiryu >>>>>>

 

[soupongo]

That doesn’t change the fact that Kisame could still keep up with V2 Bee. 7th Gate Gai is beating most Kage, no shame in losing to him, especially when Kisame was nerfed and at a matchup disadvantage. Aoba described Kisame as “the man strong enough to be paired with Itachi,” which implies some degree of relativity.

.

I don't think it's fundamentally changing anything on Kishi's part. He's still incredibly powerful, but do you think when he wrote part 1... he didn't plan on Akatsuki members to hunt tailed beasts lol? Kisame did exactly that, I don't think it changes anything in how Kishi views Kisame over time, besides a general powercreep series wide(in part 1 characters couldn't do big explosions and stuff, yk what I mean)

I'm not downplaying him for losing to Gai, I'm just pointing out that their rivalry was established in part 1, and continued until the second part. I'm just pointing out that I think his portrayal is pretty consistent.

I'm also not going to take that partnered with Itachi comment too seriously. Sure, among all the Ninja in the world, Kisame is closer to Itachi then most....but are they even on the same tier? I don't think so.

Orochimaru failed to even pierce 4T Naruto with his Kusanagi sword and was running out of chakra. 4T Naruto could have kept going if Yamato didn’t suppress him.

Fair enough, but tbf, is he supposed to fight a tailed beast with base swordsmanship alone? This is an Orochimaru who didn't:
Have his arms(spiritually, I guess)
was in base
his body was rejecting him

I think you'd have to be like Madara tier to still take a win in that situation lol. But you do have a point, by 4 tails he did start struggling. Non nerfed Orochimaru should still be like a tier above that, given his whole thing was knowing all sorts of Jutsu.

 

[Shiroyru]

I don't think it's fundamentally changing anything on Kishi's part. He's still incredibly powerful, but do you think when he wrote part 1... he didn't plan on Akatsuki members to hunt tailed beasts lol? Kisame did exactly that, I don't think it changes anything in how Kishi views Kisame over time, besides a general powercreep series wide(in part 1 characters couldn't do big explosions and stuff, yk what I mean)

I'm not downplaying him for losing to Gai, I'm just pointing out that their rivalry was established in part 1, and continued until the second part. I'm just pointing out that I think his portrayal is pretty consistent.


Fair enough, but tbf, is he supposed to fight a tailed beast with base swordsmanship alone? This is an Orochimaru who didn't:
Have his arms(spiritually, I guess)
was in base
his body was rejecting him

I think you'd have to be like Madara tier to still take a win in that situation lol. But you do have a point, by 4 tails he did start struggling. Non nerfed Orochimaru should still be like a tier above that, given his whole thing was knowing all sorts of Jutsu.

Tailed Beasts didn’t exist until Shippuden. There’s a reason why no one ever called Shukaku the One-Tail in the Chunin Exams arc

 

[Dragon777]

Devon, Augur, and Caribou left Egghead at the same time time as the SHs to rendezvous with Teach at Hachinosu. It’ll have only been a day or two since they arrived. That’s not nearly enough time for the BBPs to sail all the way to Mariejois and launch an attack. Besides, BB’s next move after meeting Caribou would logically be to go after one of the Ancient Weapons

There Is also this:

"Get to preparing"

--> Just before this

That's pretty hinting.

Also, even though I don't think time Is an issue and I am not a fan of It, but there Is still this thing:

Time might not be an issue at all.

 

[soupongo]

Tailed Beasts didn’t exist until Shippuden. There’s a reason why no one ever called Shukaku the One-Tail in the Chunin Exams arc

They didn't exist as a classification probably, but it's pretty clear that there were evil spirits, and the Akatsuki were the strong ninjas who could hunt them down.

Plus, what story purpose of retconning Kisame? With someone like Hashirama, I can at least agree that Kishi changed his mind on his PL because of the introduction of new plotlines in part 2, but I kind of disagree with the inherent skepticism towards anything from the first half of the manga...

 

[soupongo]

Number 1 Rule of OP: Never take powerscaling hype at the beginning of an arc seriously.

Remember how insane Jack looked at the start of Zou? In reality he was a scrub.

You're just making an argument for powercreep Sanjikun. Jack was presented as a monster worth 1 billion (unprecedented at the time), through an entire arc. But in a different arc, he wasn't as relevant when you had characters who could casually one shot g4 Luffy.

Imu isn't any different. It's bad writing that he can neg diff Xebec level characters

 

[Shiroyru]

They didn't exist as a classification probably, but it's pretty clear that there were evil spirits, and the Akatsuki were the strong ninjas who could hunt them down.

Plus, what story purpose of retconning Kisame? With someone like Hashirama, I can at least agree that Kishi changed his mind on his PL because of the introduction of new plotlines in part 2, but I kind of disagree with the inherent skepticism towards anything from the first half of the manga...

Doesn’t the sheer scale of Kisame’s Jutsu in Part 1 vs Shippuden prove he got retconned? Jiraiya’s Toad Stomach Jutsu would have been no problem at all for Shippuden Kisame because he can just casually create enough water to fill the entire stomach

 

[Zemlya]

Yo kill these leakers

 

[sanjikun]

You're just making an argument for powercreep Sanjikun. Jack was presented as a monster worth 1 billion (unprecedented at the time), through an entire arc. But in a different arc, he wasn't as relevant when you had characters who could casually one shot g4 Luffy.

Imu isn't any different. It's bad writing that he can neg diff Xebec level characters

Jack was made to seem a scrub at the end of the very arc he was introduced.

Same with Cracker. He seemed invincible. 3 chapters later Luffy is dicking around and he beats him with a glorified Fuusen.

 

[soupongo]

Doesn’t the sheer scale of Kisame’s Jutsu in Part 1 vs Shippuden prove he got retconned? Jiraiya’s Toad Stomach Jutsu would have been no problem at all for Shippuden Kisame because he can just casually create enough water to fill the entire stomach

Agreed, but that's generic and applies to pretty much any top level Naruto characters. The scale greatly increased, but I don't think that makes the portrayal of comparison to other characters void.

Sanin>Kisame is pretty clear, though you could argue he wins against their base forms.

 

[Dragon777]

Jack was made to seem a scrub at the end of the very arc he was introduced.

Jack was made into a total idiot, but not weak.