Spoiler One Piece Chapter Spoiler 1196 Spoilers Discussion

Luffy sacrifices himself for randos every arc. and he would die of not for plot armor. Strawhats constantly do for eachother.
Bellmere sacrifice herself, Whitebeard did, Ace did, etc.
But only gets portrayed as a negative when Sanji does it? Nami would've died from the Drum avalanche, or El Thor, and Oda certainly didn't portray his sacrifice as a bad thing back then.
Luffy self hates! Strip him of conqueror!
 
@Devilbat
Imagine a backstory for Stussy where she's born right there in MADS's laboratory, growing up with them, and she ends up traumatized because of scumbags like Caesar Clown telling her when she was a kid that she wasn't human.

And then she's bartered off to the World Government to become one of the kids trained to be a Cipher Poll agent. Because of all that, she never saw herself as human, and Vegapunk could never manage to be a father figure either, due to his own flaws.

That would be so good
 
The difference between the examples you're citing and Sanji, is that Sanji did it because he doesn't think his life is as valuable as the lives of the people he wants to save.

Ace is very much like Sanji, and also what you could call an imperfect Conqueror. Only, Ace never got to learn the lesson Sanji just did.
I don't recall Sanji thinking Usopp is more important than himself when he saved him.
Is Sanji now going to stop valuing Nami over himself and let her get hurt going forward?
 
I don't recall Sanji thinking Usopp is more important than himself when he saved him.
Is Sanji now going to stop valuing Nami over himself and let her get hurt going forward?
No because nami is a woman and that is his other character flaw that oda decided isn't.
So every instance of chivalry from sanji was both self hate and zeff teachings. Can't really say which
 
Stella Vegapunk still died, which could've been avoided apparently, or maybe not?
Until we see what sanji with self love can do I guess.
Oda just hit character reset on sanji until we get his feats.
Good writing btw. He put so many things on this character, three backstories, 5 character conflict, he just had him as a mental patient and called it a day.
As much as Brook died 50 years ago but is still alive today.
 
Bro what a nothing chapter. This man need sto be imprisoned for padding at this point.
Three chapters communicating the same information without advancing the plot is actually a serious problem.

It makes me think that Oda isn’t actually a good author, he has great ideas and characters but storytelling isn’t one of his strong points; which is why editors exist to guide these authors and put them on the leash.
 
He did. When Sanji was willing to die in TB he saw all the straw hats as irreplaceable, but he they could always get another cook.

That’s what he said after all
Did the crew think themselves replaceable when they took Kuma's ursus shock after they refused to hand Luffy over?

Did Nami view herself as replaceable when she was going to throw her life away rather than tell Ulti Luffy won't be PK? Is her moment in Wano now a bad thing?
 
Different, vegapunk is gonna get reuploaded from backup apparently, which IDK how oda is gonna handle. Same memories (?) I don't think he can "upload" his soul lmao, Different body. Brook literally came back to life in his same body through his soul.
It’s the same. It’ll be an exact replica of Stella’s body with Stella’s mind and soul. All punk did was use his body as a trigger to piss off the world government
 
Did the crew think themselves replaceable when they took Kuma's ursus shock after they refused to hand Luffy over?

Did Nami view herself as replaceable when she was going to throw her life away rather than tell Ulti Luffy won't be PK? Is her moment in Wano now a bad thing?
Completely different. None of them outright said “you guys can find another _____” like Sanji did.
 
That's pure horseshit, Zoro was fully ready for dying here. In fact he literally offered his death instead of luffy's.
Him actually surviving a death sentence that would kill 5 luffys in a row was not expected at all. Not even by Kuma himself.
Zoro didn't simply wanna die

He doesn't see glory at simply dying, he is doing that because he thinks his ambition means nothing if he can't protect his captain, who he states that is gonna be the pirate king.

Meanwhile, thats Sanji


He thinks that it's cool dying for the sake of it, the reasons he gave to sacrifice himself don't feel real or meaningful to what he actually is and his position in the crew. He complains about Zoro putting his life on test but then does the same, not out of self worth and self praise. He tries to mimic Zoro there but completely fails when he says "start looking for a new cook". Even Zoro values Sanji more than he does in that scene and thats why it makes sense that Zoro hit him after that

While Zoro is stating how great his ambition is that he must be able to back up his captain for that reason, Sanji is there acting like he is merely replaceble for Luffy and the crew. Later Sanji also says "I just made a fool of myself" when Brook was praising both of them for what they did
 
Did the crew think themselves replaceable when they took Kuma's ursus shock after they refused to hand Luffy over?

Did Nami view herself as replaceable when she was going to throw her life away rather than tell Ulti Luffy won't be PK? Is her moment in Wano now a bad thing?
They don't understand the crew literally risk their lives for each other constantly. They are always on death situation. Oda just stated "w sanji it's different" and we're supposed to take it unquestionably.
Robin had the same character arc as sanji in WCI during water 7. Literally identical.
Apparently Sanji is even more traumatized for reason.
Sanji the mental patient.
 
I think you don't know how strong Orochimaru now is ?
Hopefully we'll get to see. Kishi is probably going to do fanservice stuff for the old cast, or else it'll sell as badly as Boruto.

Didn’t one of the novels claim that Kakashi somehow got way stronger after losing his Sharingan? That’s retarded if true, but it is what it is
yeah but the likelyhood that Kishi has actually read any of the novels and remembers them years later is pretty low. Kakashi is the hokage, but he obviously isn't the strongest in the village. We could still see Kabuto and Orochimaru being stronger than him, since they're not orthodox citizens really
 
Top