Future Events Can Luffy become pirate king without being Top 1 in the verse?
- Thread starter ImmaIvanoM
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comparable lmao
you literally saw the difference in power between the two when roger swiped him away.
roger had died when he made this statement.
rayleigh is based on story portrayal and how strong he is even at old age
and wb was on par with roger. honestly looks like that statement made by oden in context of the people in wano because he didnt want to have to ask his former crewmates for help. putting his hopes in toki's prophecy to come true. at that time
kaido is getting washed by wb.
lmao going to kill
or going to hit kaido again
two different things ha001
you literally saw the difference in power between the two when roger swiped him away.
roger had died when he made this statement.
rayleigh is based on story portrayal and how strong he is even at old age
and wb was on par with roger. honestly looks like that statement made by oden in context of the people in wano because he didnt want to have to ask his former crewmates for help. putting his hopes in toki's prophecy to come true. at that time
kaido is getting washed by wb.
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lmao going to kill
or going to hit kaido again
two different things ha001
oden blocked the attack and still got bodied
then proceeded to stand by in amazement while roger went on to someone more his speed.
you wouldnt see someone comparable to roger portrayed in such manner.
Whitebeard, who was Roger's equal, wasnt dead
so you believe kaido 20 yrs ago was already the strongest in the verse?
lmao
to avoid this line of thought
oda literally had to come up with the bullshit that wb and his crew never knew oden died or what happened in wano cause if they did , he would be done in. you value titles yeah? I think so .
at this timeframe we are talking about
wb was the strongest in the verse
stated again by another one of roger's rivals shiki.
if not this is where I will end. dont care too much to go on and on about this , plus its off topic.
oden is stronger than garp too I bet
shanks too
and bigmom who had a skirmish with him
kinemon and oden are stronger cause they actually damaged him.what a joke, you can get defeated and not get scarred(luffy only retained a scar from akainu btw). oden scarred kaido, doesnt mean the only person to damage him cause he lost 7 times. 7 people might have handed him a good ass whooping. roger and wb considered could be one of those.
then proceeded to stand by in amazement while roger went on to someone more his speed.
you wouldnt see someone comparable to roger portrayed in such manner.
Whitebeard, who was Roger's equal, wasnt dead
so you believe kaido 20 yrs ago was already the strongest in the verse?
lmao
to avoid this line of thought
oda literally had to come up with the bullshit that wb and his crew never knew oden died or what happened in wano cause if they did , he would be done in. you value titles yeah? I think so .
at this timeframe we are talking about
wb was the strongest in the verse
stated again by another one of roger's rivals shiki.
if not this is where I will end. dont care too much to go on and on about this , plus its off topic.
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Oden got "several times stronger" since when he left Wano.
If Roger and Whitebeard were that strong, Oden wouldn't be the only one to have ever scared Kaido. Roger/WB couldn't do it when he was a teenager.
If Roger and Whitebeard were that strong, Oden wouldn't be the only one to have ever scared Kaido. Roger/WB couldn't do it when he was a teenager.
shanks too
and bigmom who had a skirmish with him
kinemon and oden are stronger cause they actually damaged him.what a joke, you can get defeated and not get scarred(luffy only retained a scar from akainu btw). oden scarred kaido, doesnt mean the only person to damage him cause he lost 7 times. 7 people might have handed him a good ass whooping. roger and wb considered could be one of those.
What "defeat"? Oden was about to send Kaido's ass to the afterlife. The legend is no one can kill Kaido, and Oden was to about to do it.
And Kinemon never left a scar on Kaido. That's not what Hiyori is talking about. Oden SCARRED him. Not "made him bleed slightly". Kaido was shitting his pants at the thought of Oden.
And Kinemon never left a scar on Kaido. That's not what Hiyori is talking about. Oden SCARRED him. Not "made him bleed slightly". Kaido was shitting his pants at the thought of Oden.
He was barely affected... At worst he was surprised by the attack, it looked like he never saw a flying slash before, judging by his reaction.
My point is that we didnt see much, Roger was the only one who did something in that scene, Oden didnt do anything.
There is no real comparison between them while we previously saw Oden clashing with Whitebeard.
Oden at his best is the one who fought Kaido and even earlier Oden was comparable to WB and Roger.
That's not what I believe, that's what manga has said. Why is it a surprise that Kaido from 20 years ago was the strongest?
Yes, Whitebeard pirates would probably crush Beast Pirates 20 years ago and that has nothing to do with Kaido being stronger than WB.
The world of OP isnt happening in 1vs1 terms, the numbers are important, it has been bolded out in the manga several times.
Since Kaido is a younger generation than WB and Roger, we dont exactly know when he peaked or when he surpassed them but it is what it is, manga said that 20 years ago nobody would beat Kaido and that may apply to the entire WB pirates too since Wano is a natural fortress which favors Kaido's forces. Maybe it wasnt meant in 1vs1 terms but referring to overthrowing BPs in general which is not an easy task for outside forces due to natural defenses which Wano has. Shiki confirming WB as the strongest pirate not necessarily refers to 1vs1.
My point is that we didnt see much, Roger was the only one who did something in that scene, Oden didnt do anything.
There is no real comparison between them while we previously saw Oden clashing with Whitebeard.
Oden at his best is the one who fought Kaido and even earlier Oden was comparable to WB and Roger.
That's not what I believe, that's what manga has said. Why is it a surprise that Kaido from 20 years ago was the strongest?
Yes, Whitebeard pirates would probably crush Beast Pirates 20 years ago and that has nothing to do with Kaido being stronger than WB.
The world of OP isnt happening in 1vs1 terms, the numbers are important, it has been bolded out in the manga several times.
Since Kaido is a younger generation than WB and Roger, we dont exactly know when he peaked or when he surpassed them but it is what it is, manga said that 20 years ago nobody would beat Kaido and that may apply to the entire WB pirates too since Wano is a natural fortress which favors Kaido's forces. Maybe it wasnt meant in 1vs1 terms but referring to overthrowing BPs in general which is not an easy task for outside forces due to natural defenses which Wano has. Shiki confirming WB as the strongest pirate not necessarily refers to 1vs1.
Luffy won’t surpass the 4 Yonkos in power level before the end of the manga, but he will become Pirate King through story alone. Luffy all of a sudden having greater power than Kaido, Shanks, BM, Akainu or Blackbeard would be the biggest asspull garbage in manga history. He can still get his huge feats and moments but to surpass all of them and become #1 WITHOUT a major 10 year time skip to adult Luffy would piss me off and would make no sense. He couldn’t beat Cracker alone and he lost to Katakuri (yes he lost even though he won) and now without further training or another time skip he’s gonna be #1 after Wano and the Final War? Fuck that. I don’t mind him leveling up and reaching Raftel and becoming PK but Oda shouldn’t write Luffy to be at a level where he can defeat a Yonko 1v1 as it stands without Luffy growing up first.
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Simple Answer: Yes and it is not an assumption, it is a fact.
Because to become a Pirate King all you have to do is go to Raftel, it has nothing to do with how strong you are though being respectably strong helps.
What does individual strength have to do with becoming Pirate King?
If someone defeated Roger after he came back from Raftel, would they automatically become Pirate King without going to One Piece?
You understand in the lore of One Piece, title of PK is just a front, in reality it is just a means for reincarnation of Joy Boy to go to Raftel and learn the truth about void century right?
But even the generic definition of One Piece that the world of One Piece subscribes to, you have to go to Raftel and get Roger's treasure, not to be individually strongest.
If Luffy came back from Raftel and someone defeated him in 1v1 fight, they still won't become PK. Its not a Worlds strongest title lmao.
Because to become a Pirate King all you have to do is go to Raftel, it has nothing to do with how strong you are though being respectably strong helps.
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And how exactly is he supposed to hold onto that title if he isn't the strongest in the verse? If you're dubbed the "King of the Pirates" and someone comes to challenge your right to be called that, and they beat you in a fight, then who is going to acknowledge you as such after you've lost? To be King of the Pirates means you stand at the pinnacle of the Pirate World. I don't know where people get the impression that you can be anything less than the Strongest and still be Pirate King.
If someone defeated Roger after he came back from Raftel, would they automatically become Pirate King without going to One Piece?
You understand in the lore of One Piece, title of PK is just a front, in reality it is just a means for reincarnation of Joy Boy to go to Raftel and learn the truth about void century right?
But even the generic definition of One Piece that the world of One Piece subscribes to, you have to go to Raftel and get Roger's treasure, not to be individually strongest.
If Luffy came back from Raftel and someone defeated him in 1v1 fight, they still won't become PK. Its not a Worlds strongest title lmao.
You're joking right? I know you know what it means to be king of something. Do you honestly think that just because Luffy finds the One Piece, that all the Pirates in the World will simply just bow down to him?
All the Top pirates in the World are aiming for the summit, and want to hold that title. They are not going to acknowledge someone they view as beneath them as the King of them all.
Luffy had the same exact mindset pre-skip that all he had to do to become Pirate King was to find One Piece, and that is all that it would take. Never once did he ever mention beating admirals and yonko's to achieve this. So do you really think it's a mere coincidence that after training with Rayleigh (The right hand of the Pirate King) that his mindset shifted to needing to be capable of defeating all these opponents?
If someone like Buggy accidentally found the One Piece, do you honestly see the likes of Kaido, Shanks, Mihawk, Big Mom, Blackbeard, Luffy, and the list goes on and on, acknowledging him as the Pirate King?
And then what after that? One Piece is found, and its purpose in the World will be fulfilled. So there will never be able to be another Pirate King as long as anyone lives because there isn't some treasure for everyone to race to find? The title disappears forever?
And to even further drive how nonsensical the argument is, was there some kind of World meeting held amongst everyone to decide that Roger finding the One Piece, would make him the Pirate King? You know, the treasure that nobody ever knew about. So people just got together and decided that one day someone would find some hypothetical treasure that may or may not exist, and when they do, that will be the day they announce a Pirate King?
And let me guess, all this stuff Oda has been throwing at us to showcase that in order to be the Pirate King, you have to stand at the pinnacle of the Pirate World is just fluff, right?
Kaido and Big Mom deciding they would find the One Piece together, and then fight each other to the death means nothing? In truth, if they reach Laugh Tale together, the one who touches the One Piece first is the REAL Pirate King.
All the Top pirates in the World are aiming for the summit, and want to hold that title. They are not going to acknowledge someone they view as beneath them as the King of them all.
Luffy had the same exact mindset pre-skip that all he had to do to become Pirate King was to find One Piece, and that is all that it would take. Never once did he ever mention beating admirals and yonko's to achieve this. So do you really think it's a mere coincidence that after training with Rayleigh (The right hand of the Pirate King) that his mindset shifted to needing to be capable of defeating all these opponents?
If someone like Buggy accidentally found the One Piece, do you honestly see the likes of Kaido, Shanks, Mihawk, Big Mom, Blackbeard, Luffy, and the list goes on and on, acknowledging him as the Pirate King?
And then what after that? One Piece is found, and its purpose in the World will be fulfilled. So there will never be able to be another Pirate King as long as anyone lives because there isn't some treasure for everyone to race to find? The title disappears forever?
And to even further drive how nonsensical the argument is, was there some kind of World meeting held amongst everyone to decide that Roger finding the One Piece, would make him the Pirate King? You know, the treasure that nobody ever knew about. So people just got together and decided that one day someone would find some hypothetical treasure that may or may not exist, and when they do, that will be the day they announce a Pirate King?
And let me guess, all this stuff Oda has been throwing at us to showcase that in order to be the Pirate King, you have to stand at the pinnacle of the Pirate World is just fluff, right?
Kaido and Big Mom deciding they would find the One Piece together, and then fight each other to the death means nothing? In truth, if they reach Laugh Tale together, the one who touches the One Piece first is the REAL Pirate King.
You're joking right? I know you know what it means to be king of something. Do you honestly think that just because Luffy finds the One Piece, that all the Pirates in the World will simply just bow down to him?
All the Top pirates in the World are aiming for the summit, and want to hold that title. They are not going to acknowledge someone they view as beneath them as the King of them all.
Luffy had the same exact mindset pre-skip that all he had to do to become Pirate King was to find One Piece, and that is all that it would take. Never once did he ever mention beating admirals and yonko's to achieve this. So do you really think it's a mere coincidence that after training with Rayleigh (The right hand of the Pirate King) that his mindset shifted to needing to be capable of defeating all these opponents?
If someone like Buggy accidentally found the One Piece, do you honestly see the likes of Kaido, Shanks, Mihawk, Big Mom, Blackbeard, Luffy, and the list goes on and on, acknowledging him as the Pirate King?
And then what after that? One Piece is found, and its purpose in the World will be fulfilled. So there will never be able to be another Pirate King as long as anyone lives because there isn't some treasure for everyone to race to find? The title disappears forever?
And to even further drive how nonsensical the argument is, was there some kind of World meeting held amongst everyone to decide that Roger finding the One Piece, would make him the Pirate King? You know, the treasure that nobody ever knew about. So people just got together and decided that one day someone would find some hypothetical treasure that may or may not exist, and when they do, that will be the day they announce a Pirate King?
And let me guess, all this stuff Oda has been throwing at us to showcase that in order to be the Pirate King, you have to stand at the pinnacle of the Pirate World is just fluff, right?
Kaido and Big Mom deciding they would find the One Piece together, and then fight each other to the death means nothing? In truth, if they reach Laugh Tale together, the one who touches the One Piece first is the REAL Pirate King.
All the Top pirates in the World are aiming for the summit, and want to hold that title. They are not going to acknowledge someone they view as beneath them as the King of them all.
Luffy had the same exact mindset pre-skip that all he had to do to become Pirate King was to find One Piece, and that is all that it would take. Never once did he ever mention beating admirals and yonko's to achieve this. So do you really think it's a mere coincidence that after training with Rayleigh (The right hand of the Pirate King) that his mindset shifted to needing to be capable of defeating all these opponents?
If someone like Buggy accidentally found the One Piece, do you honestly see the likes of Kaido, Shanks, Mihawk, Big Mom, Blackbeard, Luffy, and the list goes on and on, acknowledging him as the Pirate King?
And then what after that? One Piece is found, and its purpose in the World will be fulfilled. So there will never be able to be another Pirate King as long as anyone lives because there isn't some treasure for everyone to race to find? The title disappears forever?
And to even further drive how nonsensical the argument is, was there some kind of World meeting held amongst everyone to decide that Roger finding the One Piece, would make him the Pirate King? You know, the treasure that nobody ever knew about. So people just got together and decided that one day someone would find some hypothetical treasure that may or may not exist, and when they do, that will be the day they announce a Pirate King?
And let me guess, all this stuff Oda has been throwing at us to showcase that in order to be the Pirate King, you have to stand at the pinnacle of the Pirate World is just fluff, right?
Kaido and Big Mom deciding they would find the One Piece together, and then fight each other to the death means nothing? In truth, if they reach Laugh Tale together, the one who touches the One Piece first is the REAL Pirate King.
Do you even know what King of Pirates means to Luffy? How many times does Luffy himself have to reiterate he isn't trying to become King of anything, PK title is a statement of freedom for him.
And what about Roger? Did the whole world bow down to Roger when he became PK?
Luffy just wants to become PK and to become PK he just has to go to Raftel, that is literally it.
He never claimed he wants to be strong enough to maintain his reign has a PK because such reign doesn't exist.
Its not the same title as Emperor of the sea lmao, neither does a PK particularly needs territories though I guess Oda will end up giving Luffy Territories anyways.
All you need to do to become PK is make it to Raftel that is literally it.
Idk how you failed to understand something so fundamental in years of reading One Piece.
What kinda imaginary world are you imagining post Raftel?
Do you think entire world would become his territory? Does he become emperor of the whole world?
That's farthest from PK.
These are the set definitions of Pirate King given to us
-Roger become King of Pirates by journeying the whole Grand Line and reaching final Island Raftel
-Roger told the world they can become PK by getting his treasure
-Luffy wants to become Pirate King by making it to Raftel
Roger was not recognized as strongest man in the world in his entire life. Garp and WB are canonical rivals of his. Even Shiki, Sengoku and Rayleigh are more or less considered same level as him.
Like for real lmao, wtf do you think PK title is?
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And YES IF BUGGY LANDED IN RAFTEL, HE WOULD BECOME PK.
What is aacknowledgement of PK? Roger sneaked into Big Moms territory? What kinda acknowledgement do you think Big Mom gave her?
Do you think WB acknowledged him as his superior?
Lmaoo for real, this is ridiculous argument
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No
Imu/Controller of Ancient Weapons/Sea Devil-Strongest in the verse
Luffy and Zoro - Co Second Strongest in the world
HUMONGOUS GAP
Blackbeard/Roger/WB
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