Worstgen
Sentinel
@Den_Den_Mushi Of course, hyping and dehyping certain characters on this flashback is pure nonsense; and that's what I'm trying to say here. They're hyping up Zoro based on Roger using a sword during a clash whereas we have the confirmation on the Roger pirates and WBP fighting on equal footing. Those things do not mean much.
Finalbeta
We are still talking about the characters behind the sword when mentioning 'swordsman' the segment man says all. It's about how strong the character is, not his CoA.
comrade
@Dark Hound I actually believe Mihawk is the strongest swordsman of all eras we witnessed. Because I believe Zoro's goal will be more valuable if he becomes the strongest ever. Rather than the strongest of all that happen to live in his lifetime.
Bogard
No one is dehyping anyone. I kept saying that i do think Mihawk is on par with Shanks. It's just that thinking Oda really think that Roger is counted in the WSS title when Zoro never emphasized on it is a faulty logic. Oda will want for Zoro's goal to establish him as the strongest swordsman in one piece. Roger will not fill that requirement
Sentinel
@Dark Hound
Nothing which I disagree about. However, there is still not a single statement of Roger being the greatest swordsman on the previous era, let alone him being a swordsman in sense like Zoro or Mihawk.
Once again, I'm not a sword hater, I am just against baseless headcanon. It annoys me.
Nothing which I disagree about. However, there is still not a single statement of Roger being the greatest swordsman on the previous era, let alone him being a swordsman in sense like Zoro or Mihawk.
Once again, I'm not a sword hater, I am just against baseless headcanon. It annoys me.
comrade
What Bogard said. Zoro will be the strongest known swordsman to us. And Mihawk is his final mile stone. Otherwise that WSS title would be bitter. Because Zoro was just lucky Roger got executed.
Finalbeta
You guys underestimate Oda's genius. EoS Zoro won't end up far from Luffy power wise and Teach will comfortably pass any legend of the past.
Sentinel
@Finalbeta
I don't exclude this outcome either but come on, you're basing this outcome on a single possibility that Zoro surpasses Roger cause he is a swordsman, that's absurd. Other than that, I do consider EOS characters having the potential to surpass the old era.
I don't exclude this outcome either but come on, you're basing this outcome on a single possibility that Zoro surpasses Roger cause he is a swordsman, that's absurd. Other than that, I do consider EOS characters having the potential to surpass the old era.
comrade
EOS BB will be PK+ for DF users. Because his Yami fruit is a nightmare for DF users. But for Roger, BB is just like WB with inferior Haki and more pain intolerance. So in order to surpass Roger, BB would have to mid diff Shanks (against whom Yami is also useless)
Den_Den_Mushi
Zoro's goal isn't to be the strongest swordsman that ever lived though, all he wants is to attain the WSS title and become so famous that his name will reach heaven. I'd say being on the pirate king's crew that toppled the WG and revealed the true history would help him achieve that goal. Oda has never connected Zoro and Roger, it's an entirely fanmade comparison based on a faulty understanding of the characters.
comrade
But the narrative suggests that Zoro will be the strongest WSS that is known to us. Otherwise the WSS title would have a bitter taste. Mihawk is the WSS because he was lucky Roger got executed. Everyone aims for the throne of a dead Roger. So why wouldn't Zoro aim to surpass the strongest swordsman the world had heard about by beating the current WSS which dethroned the previous one fair and square
Den_Den_Mushi
I think the narrative suggests the exact opposite tbh. Instead of emphasising strength, Oda (through Luffy) values freedom. Luffy doesn't want to be the strongest of all time, he wants to be the freest man. Similarly, Zoro (unlike Mihawk) doesn't want to be the strongest that ever lived, he wants his name to reach heaven and he places Luffy's life above his own goals.
comrade
What does Mihawk value though? Strength and conviction. Mocking Zoro with a knife and only unleashing his blade once seeing Zoro is ready to throw his life away for his ambition. How did Mihawk become the WSS? By being lucky Roger died or by legitimately beating every worthy swordsman? Imagine you are only considered strongest because the other ones died by another event.
Den_Den_Mushi
That's exactly the point though. Mihawk values individual strength and conviction, sitting on a lonely throne and feeling unfulfilled. Zoro places others before himself, which is why he will achieve his dream (which is not being #1 of all time in individual strength but his name reaching heaven).
Finalbeta
Mihawk simply wouldn't be WSS if Roger was still alive. What's so scandalous about it.
comrade
But he will surpass Mihawk. Right? Just that helping Luffy to become the PK is an even greater feat than beating Mihawk.
Den_Den_Mushi
I don't get the point about Roger tbh. It's like saying Banksy is only great because Van Gogh died. Perhaps there was an Ancient Kingdom swordsman even stronger than Roger. Why does any of that matter? Mihawk is the best swordsman of the Great Era of Piracy and that's all he needs to be. It doesn't affect Zoro's dream at all.
Finalbeta
You are still tremendously great if the only reason why you rank as second is because of a nature's freak called Gol D. Roger.
A lot of time has passed since that man died, Mihawk was still fighting to be recognized as WSS.
A lot of time has passed since that man died, Mihawk was still fighting to be recognized as WSS.
Monkey D. Luffy
I only care about Mihawk defeating Prime Rayleigh in a duel.
comrade
WB is a swordsman too though. Because a Bisento is by definition a sword :kappa: (wanted to stop the debate cuz u are so polite, but my inner demon wanted to throw this in)