Chapter Discussion does the meaningless title of "pirate king" fit rocks more than roger?

[Saber]

so let's get to the point, every time oda includes rocks in a chapter, it's a wank fest, this man is basically everything you usually associate with an actual pirate, literally the only thing he is missing is the eyepatch but that's because oda saved it for someone else and at the very least he has that eye scar
last time roger was hyped by the story was during that squardo flashback, like 15 years ago
when you see the big picture, you notice this man has been shown to be a fraud and not worthy of his title over and over
rocks always come off as more powerful, a better captain, cooler, literally whatever you could think the king of pirates should represent, besides reaching some island where joyboy left the one piece manga or whatever (rocks was aiming higher than that: king of the world, of course)

roger's "feats"
-> cucked by his first mate (sure, this is not what actually happened, but lmao)
-> had to sneak his way through big mom, arguably the shittiest yonko, with the shittiest ycs
-> had to cry to garp for help to fight against rocks (and it wasn't even the only time that garp had to help his sorry ass lol, can you imagine luffy needing help from coby/smoker), while rocks neg diffed admiral fodder
-> found the one piece: "i better get my laughing ass out of here and let someone in the future handle it", man folded at the finish line... rocks made the final villain of OP shit herself just because
-> in the end he was taken down by anime cancer and two randoms with spears, while even his random ass civilian wife could defy human biological limitations through sheer will

the only goat in roger's crew was rayleigh, and maybe shanks, then you have genderbend nami, a literal clown and that egg from the movies
meanwhile every character who rocks was ever seen interacting with gets elevated to top tier or at least very important to the plot just by the association with him, and that includes even their offsprings for some reason
actually, roger's fuckboy son eventually got defeated by rocks jr. and if thats not proof of roger being inferior i don't know what it is

 

[MonsterKaido]

Yes

 

[Reborn]

Only title which fits Rocks and Blackbeard is "The King of the World"

 

[Saber]

Only title which fits Rocks and Blackbeard is "The King of the World"

not sure about that, rocks was most likely the WSS and died before he could become king of the world, and rocks jr has been tryharding ever since he was a kid to become specifically PK

 

[RYNO]

God there are so many idiots one this site.

 

[Saber]

God there are so many idiots one this site.

cope, roger being called pirate king is dumb and the only reason it even means something is because he farmed aura during his execution
that treasure’s not even really his, lol, it’s joyboy shit

 

[Vanlax]

Yes in general and more realistic sense, but not in Oda's "Pirate King" meaning.

As it is more about freedom like what Luffy understands about being a Pirate King.

Also, how is Rocks closer to "Pirate King" than Roger if he can't even make his own crew loyal to him?

 

[Saber]

Yes in general and more realistic sense, but not in Oda's "Pirate King" meaning.

As it is more about freedom like what Luffy understands about being a Pirate King.

Also, how is Rocks closer to "Pirate King" than Roger if he can't even make his own crew loyal to him?

he made his crew through power, taking whoever he wanted from other crews, and didn't give a shit about loyalty or stuff like that, pretty sure you can count that as being "free" somehow

 

[Vanlax]

he made his crew through power, taking whoever he wanted from other crews, and didn't give a shit about loyalty or stuff like that, pretty sure you can count that as being "free" somehow

Yeah, Rocks was “free” in a brute force kind of way.
He did whatever he wanted, took whoever he wanted, didn’t care about loyalty.

But as I said, that’s not the kind of freedom Oda defines as Pirate King.
Oda’s version of freedom(Pirate King) isn’t about dominance.
Hence, Roger didn't even bother to defeat the Big Mom Pirates.

Rocks giving choice to his crew was for self-serving power, leading his crew to self-implode despite their immense strength.

In contrast, Roger's and Luffy's freedom is inspirational and liberating, founded on shared discovery over domination, which cultivated genuine loyalty and crew cohesion. This is embodied further by Luffy through Nika's symbolism. This is what Oda's "Pirate King" means.

 

[AER15]

Losing with Whitebeard, Big Mom, Kaido and Shiki on your crew might be the most embarrassing achievement in One Piece

 

[Jinjoo]

Losing with Whitebeard, Big Mom, Kaido and Shiki on your crew might be the most embarrassing achievement in One Piece

Not if they betray you in the middle of your 2 on 1 clash

Or not if IMU pulls over either by taking over garling or just comes to God valley personally.

Lol do you actually believe he straight up lost and there wasn't any fuckery

 

[Salah WG]

First you must understand what is a Pirate,
If Someone lives on an Island & starts committing Crimes, He won't be called a Pirate, He is just a Criminal or Bandit or Mafia or Terrorist or even Rebel ... etc

Someone is labeled a Pirate when They arrive from Outside (The Sea) with Intentions to commit Crimes (Generally Robbery), and They are not representing any other Kingdom or Non-Criminal Faction, They are basically "Ocean Raiders" or "Sea Criminals/Thieves",

So, based on this, how does Someone prove himself to be a Superior Pirate? Obviously with a Higher Score,
A Pirate who manages to rob Fishing Boats isn't the same as Someone who can Raid entire Ports, and isn't same as Someone who can Raid Marine Ships or Marine Base or entire Islands or Major Kingdoms ... etc

Pirate King technically means Someone who can take anything if He sets his Eyes on, meaning there is almost No Place that He cannot Raid, or at least He is better than Everyone else, He is Ultimate Sea Thief/Raider,

This is why Oda isn't showing who Roger Defeated to become Pirate King or what Crazy Feats He had or gave him an All Star Crew ... etc
Instead, He is telling you the Places that this guy Successfully entered & made profit from,

SHs went to Skypiea & then learned that Roger did too,
They went to Totto Land & then learned that Roger also Successfully stole from that Place,
We also learned that their Trip to God's Valley was a Success, (Where Rocks Failed)
We also learned He went to Lodestar Island & much more,
Finally, He also went to Laugh Tale which was what sealed the deal,

Xebec was trying to make Pirates rule the World, and if that happens, then you can't really call them Pirates anymore,
But Roger on the other hand, He didn't try to change the way Pirates live or how They are perceived, He just played the Game & finished with Highest Score, earning him Title of Pirate King, as Simple as that,

 

[Halyup]

Yes in general and more realistic sense, but not in Oda's "Pirate King" meaning.

As it is more about freedom like what Luffy understands about being a Pirate King.

Also, how is Rocks closer to "Pirate King" than Roger if he can't even make his own crew loyal to him?

By this definition of freedom
shanks is the closest to Pirate King
he have the most freedom

Post automatically merged: Yesterday at 8:27 AM

First you must understand what is a Pirate,
If Someone lives on an Island & starts committing Crimes, He won't be called a Pirate, He is just a Criminal or Bandit or Mafia or Terrorist or even Rebel ... etc

Someone is labeled a Pirate when They arrive from Outside (The Sea) with Intentions to commit Crimes (Generally Robbery), and They are not representing any other Kingdom or Non-Criminal Faction, They are basically "Ocean Raiders" or "Sea Criminals/Thieves",

So, based on this, how does Someone prove himself to be a Superior Pirate? Obviously with a Higher Score,
A Pirate who manages to rob Fishing Boats isn't the same as Someone who can Raid entire Ports, and isn't same as Someone who can Raid Marine Ships or Marine Base or entire Islands or Major Kingdoms ... etc

Pirate King technically means Someone who can take anything if He sets his Eyes on, meaning there is almost No Place that He cannot Raid, or at least He is better than Everyone else, He is Ultimate Sea Thief/Raider,

This is why Oda isn't showing who Roger Defeated to become Pirate King or what Crazy Feats He had or gave him an All Star Crew ... etc
Instead, He is telling you the Places that this guy Successfully entered & made profit from,

SHs went to Skypiea & then learned that Roger did too,
They went to Totto Land & then learned that Roger also Successfully stole from that Place,
We also learned that their Trip to God's Valley was a Success, (Where Rocks Failed)
We also learned He went to Lodestar Island & much more,
Finally, He also went to Laugh Tale which was what sealed the deal,

Xebec was trying to make Pirates rule the World, and if that happens, then you can't really call them Pirates anymore,
But Roger on the other hand, He didn't try to change the way Pirates live or how They are perceived, He just played the Game & finished with Highest Score, earning him Title of Pirate King, as Simple as that,

Xebec is the only person in 800 years to go deep in the flower room in Mariejoa
Roger never been close to this

 

[a_fan]

Problem is the fandom keep equating Pirate King as strength based. It is an achievement, NOT strength.

Remember Roger kneel and begged Whitebeard to lend him Oden so he could achieve his dream. Whitebeard never cared about the One Piece. He also stole Big Mom's poneglyph without facing her.

He was also Garb's equal. Compared to Rocks who killed an admiral and clashed evenly with a Yonko level at the same day and in the day of the heavily guarded Reverie.

Let that sink in.

 

[Halyup]

Problem is the fandom keep equating Pirate King as strength based. It is an achievement, NOT strength.

Remember Roger had to kneel to beg Whitebeard to lend him Oden so he could achieve his dream. Whitebeard never cared about the One Piece. He also stole Big Mom's poneglyph without facing her.

He was also Garb's equal. Compared to Rocks who killed an admiral in the day of the heavily guarded Reverie.

Let that sink in.

PK isnt strength title
its a group achievement
a collective effort

 

[Jinjoo]

Sure. He does tick all the boxes of being a more worthier pirate king while roger is more of an adventure king.

But WG erased him from history and propagandised roger with the mantle.

 

[Halyup]

Sure. He does tick all the boxes of being a more worthier pirate king while roger is more of an adventure king.

But WG erased him from history and propagandised roger with the mantle.

Coz Xebec is more dangerous
he directly challenge the WG and broke all the taboos

 

[Luffy is the mc]

I understand questioning his character that suffered a downgrade since Oden's flashback but questioning his strength, not so much.

From what we know of the story, only WB was his equal in strength. The other were weaker than him during his prime era.

Maybe Xebec was stronger but at that time there is no doubt that he was top 3 with WB and Xebec with Garp being an extreme diff fight for them.

 

[Vanlax]

By this definition of freedom
shanks is the closest to Pirate King
he have the most freedom

Well isn't he? After WB died.

He stopped Kaido.
He stopped the MF war, with Sengoku taking responsibility because it's "him".
He met with the Gorosei and they let him because it's "him".

He's closest yes, but not enough to be the PK and we all know it, including him.
That's why his hopes are in Luffy.

 

[TheD.]

i think Rocks knew about the one peice and prob thought of it as some side quest not knowing it was his missing link Rocks goals where higher than Roger’s yes but what Roger succeeded at achieving his dreams Rocks came to short of it.Roger died at the hands of wg by choice while Rocks died to the hands of the wg by unagreed death and possible treachery Rocks was never truly free.