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- Thread starter Guan Yu
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- Tags cruzeiro > your fav team kaneki & mutin kouen > all ousen ousen>cruzeiro riboku>ousen shin > ouhon wingdom
Does this even deserve a response my man? Lol
Of course Moubu by himself cannot solo an entire army
All of Ousen’s commanders are irrelevant to Moubu, Akou is the only one who will give him some difficulty. The rest get destroyed.
And Ousen’s ability to read the flow of battle in a purely army vs army engagement is irrelevant when Ousen has nothing that can stop Moubu from plowing straight to his HQ in the long term. And if we take away Ousen’s ability to retreat or pull other strategic shenanigans then yeah, Moubu wins immediately. I think if Moubu was present at Shukai Plains, Riboku’s HQ itself would’ve been threatened on day literal one and Riboku would’ve ultimately been forced to retreat and engage the Qin in a different way.
Of course Moubu by himself cannot solo an entire army
All of Ousen’s commanders are irrelevant to Moubu, Akou is the only one who will give him some difficulty. The rest get destroyed.
And Ousen’s ability to read the flow of battle in a purely army vs army engagement is irrelevant when Ousen has nothing that can stop Moubu from plowing straight to his HQ in the long term. And if we take away Ousen’s ability to retreat or pull other strategic shenanigans then yeah, Moubu wins immediately. I think if Moubu was present at Shukai Plains, Riboku’s HQ itself would’ve been threatened on day literal one and Riboku would’ve ultimately been forced to retreat and engage the Qin in a different way.
That should be enough for SBS. Lol
Hara has alreaddy given him everything. Hyping statement through Riboku, showed caliber by defeating/pushing backOrdo with just 5k men (iirc) and great subordinate generals.
Now even if he's somewhere around Duke instictually than that would be perfect or if he's like Renpa or Ouki than that would be more than awesome. We need more generals like them.
In this arc, Hara just should not make another Pokémon for Riboku whose role is just to save Riboku's ass at crucial moment.
Hara has alreaddy given him everything. Hyping statement through Riboku, showed caliber by defeating/pushing backOrdo with just 5k men (iirc) and great subordinate generals.
Now even if he's somewhere around Duke instictually than that would be perfect or if he's like Renpa or Ouki than that would be more than awesome. We need more generals like them.
In this arc, Hara just should not make another Pokémon for Riboku whose role is just to save Riboku's ass at crucial moment.
With good reason
I see. I'd personally argue that Riboku and Shouheikun are above Ousen in that regard. Riboku's history is full of impressive feats luring his enemies in the exact location just where he wants them to be and his skill to shut down information is second to none. I think overall he's definitely a superior strategist.
Hmm then i did get it right. I'll have to disagree on that one tbh. Ousen especially impressed me with how he handled Riboku's centre army. Unfortunately we didn't get much more because both Riboku and Ousen stressed how the fate of the battle lies in the hands of the right wings battle outcome.
Well he was right. Nobody would've even come close. That battle was impossible to win via tactics.
I always got the impression that Ousen invented this technique and that it wasn't known before that battle. Otherwise Riboku wouldn't have needed so long to find out its weakness. I have a general problem with the tactics are useless against Moubu thing. This sounds far too crazy. This would basically mean any struggle against Moubu is pointless because he can always overcome them with sheer might.
@Shanks said it as well but there's a limit to how much an individual can do on their own.
Riboku said that Houken would've died if he didn't choose to retreat against YTW.
Stat wise Houken is even stronger than Moubu.
Can't wait. Bananji was clearly winning my guy.
I see. Well that speaks for Moubu's quality as a general to raise an armies strength.
No way lol. The Akou and Makou armies soldiers have had insane feats and portrayal.
- Akou's army stops three armies let by GG calibre guys.
- Makou's army is even stronger than Akou's in canon iirc.
Don't forget all this was done with the soldiers running out of food and energy.
He's absolutely broken. He's like all types of generals fused in one. Always struggled to see how Ouki is above him.
Having better portrayal does not really change the matchup and Ousen's strength has mostly been a mystery during that time. Sure, SHK knows what he's all about but i don't think he has seen how much he developed as a general.
Going by Tou's words. He very well could've implied that up until the coalition Tou>Moubu but as i said before these statements are very vague.
Lol i didn't know that. I did know that Ousen is wanked too death by the Kingdom community on reddit and that long before the Gyou campaign even started.
Stop it bro you can't hype me this much for SBS
Lol yea for sure.
Didn't age well. Did he underestimate Ousen lol?
They are all superb but in that regard I have got Ousen and Riboku above Shouheikun. Shouheikun and Riboku had quite the number of direct confrontations and Riboku was superior, overall.
Ousen and Riboku were absolute monsters in their Shukai battle. Manipulations to reach the scenario they wanted, precise predictions on how things were going to evolve, huge strategic vision all around, sick formations. Yeah I had already said it in my other comment. But in the plains they are not "good", not "pretty good", not "very very good"...they are deadly. Lol.
This is what I sent to the poor @Jailer - who is completely done with that sub😂 - some days ago.
I go on r/Kingdom just from time to time and I find Riboku downplay in seconds lol. Context goes brrrrrrr.
Ousen yeah, he's highly regarded.
Renpa's on screen presence in a war is something else, I can't fucking wait to see him fight again. Him and Ousen waging war are so good to watch for me.
Ouki is not above Renpa, they are portrayed evenly. The only member of the old Qin Six who is even stronger than Renpa is Hakuki. He was the hardest member of the Qin Six to face for Renpa.
When the revival of the Qin Six system was being discussed in other states, things turned into Hakuki wank pretty quickly
Think about the reputation Ouki had when he died and that Hakuki was even above that.
He will terrify the battlefield, like a wild tiger hunting in an area full of deers
Ousen and Riboku were absolute monsters in their Shukai battle. Manipulations to reach the scenario they wanted, precise predictions on how things were going to evolve, huge strategic vision all around, sick formations. Yeah I had already said it in my other comment. But in the plains they are not "good", not "pretty good", not "very very good"...they are deadly. Lol.
This is what I sent to the poor @Jailer - who is completely done with that sub😂 - some days ago.
I go on r/Kingdom just from time to time and I find Riboku downplay in seconds lol. Context goes brrrrrrr.
Ousen yeah, he's highly regarded.
Renpa's on screen presence in a war is something else, I can't fucking wait to see him fight again. Him and Ousen waging war are so good to watch for me.
Ouki is not above Renpa, they are portrayed evenly. The only member of the old Qin Six who is even stronger than Renpa is Hakuki. He was the hardest member of the Qin Six to face for Renpa.
When the revival of the Qin Six system was being discussed in other states, things turned into Hakuki wank pretty quickly
Think about the reputation Ouki had when he died and that Hakuki was even above that.
Stop it bro you can't hype me this much for SBS
Well there’s Aisen but yes there should be more commanders under Moubu even if he’s only about strenght, exceptional Generals all attract special commanders under them.. Maybe Moubu’s commanders are all about power too, still they should have their own persona..
Moubu should have a commander with 93 or 94 of strenght under him just how Rinbukun was a mini Kanmei..
Moubu should have a commander with 93 or 94 of strenght under him just how Rinbukun was a mini Kanmei..
Moubu will probably have the strongest martial commanders, I hate to break it to y’all lol. Not receiving focus yet =/= “they are weak”
Like I said, Moubu had a throwaway General in Aisen that by stats is stronger than Akou and as strong as Rokuomi lol. Just imagine how strong Raiki will be if Moubu is just giving away Akou+ level dudes lol.
Like I said, Moubu had a throwaway General in Aisen that by stats is stronger than Akou and as strong as Rokuomi lol. Just imagine how strong Raiki will be if Moubu is just giving away Akou+ level dudes lol.
I'm sure his army will get plenty of focus when the time comes.
Lets look at all the arcs where Moubu had tons of screentime.
Bayou - We saw a shit ton of the Ouki commanders like Tou, and Moubu himself was overshadowed in importance by Shin, Ouki, Riboku and Houken. Moubu's role in the arc was to get humbled, it wasn't the time or the place to show off his subordinates.
Coalition - There wasn't enough time for his army to get screentime. Coalition Arc had a stupid large amount of characters and it's insane to me that Hara managed the arc so well.
Juuko - Too short, the primary focus and reason for the arc was to introduce the Juuko guys for a future arc.
Now lets compare the other 6GGS armies.
Tou's - We got the beforementioned Bayou arc along with the Wei Fire Dragon arc to show them off.
Kanki - We had Koko You Arc along with the Kochou arc and current arc, and we still don't know that much about the Saki Clan who seem important.
Yo Tan Wa - They received tons of focus during Seikyou and during the Western Zhao Invasion. Baijo is probably the GG subordinate with the most panel time behind maybe Tou lmao.
Ousen - Western Zhao Invasion had tons of screentime for his.
Lets look at all the arcs where Moubu had tons of screentime.
Bayou - We saw a shit ton of the Ouki commanders like Tou, and Moubu himself was overshadowed in importance by Shin, Ouki, Riboku and Houken. Moubu's role in the arc was to get humbled, it wasn't the time or the place to show off his subordinates.
Coalition - There wasn't enough time for his army to get screentime. Coalition Arc had a stupid large amount of characters and it's insane to me that Hara managed the arc so well.
Juuko - Too short, the primary focus and reason for the arc was to introduce the Juuko guys for a future arc.
Now lets compare the other 6GGS armies.
Tou's - We got the beforementioned Bayou arc along with the Wei Fire Dragon arc to show them off.
Kanki - We had Koko You Arc along with the Kochou arc and current arc, and we still don't know that much about the Saki Clan who seem important.
Yo Tan Wa - They received tons of focus during Seikyou and during the Western Zhao Invasion. Baijo is probably the GG subordinate with the most panel time behind maybe Tou lmao.
Ousen - Western Zhao Invasion had tons of screentime for his.
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He isn't someone who listens or follows to others tactics and strategy. It was shown countless times (with coalition being an exception). So, maybe Hara didn't want to waste panels on him listening to his deputies only to shoot down their game plans. But we do know he had/ has some monsters under him like Aisen and I believe their are many others like him.
It's good to see how heated this thread has become.
It's good to see how heated this thread has become.
Not saying they are weak. But we are 800 chapters deep into the story and Moubu army stays a complete mystery. Just shows that Hara doesn’t really care and only Moubu is important story wise during his battle, the focus is always on Moubu and likely will stay on Moubu.
Lots of time to even show them, show their faces, had them making a comment during the Kanmei fight etc.
Ouki commanders had their moments to shine during that battle : Rokuomi fought RBK, they had their moments with Karin and elephants etc etc. While we didn’t see even a glimpse of Moubu commanders. Hara could have used a folder commander and make him die but didn’t do it either but chose a Ouki commander again.
Same here. Tons of way to at least show once or twice Moubu army, a comments, just faces, etc etc.
Yet nothing.
Moubu had been here for a lot of time yet we still have nothing. And given the trend I don’t think this will really change in the future.
Lots of time to even show them, show their faces, had them making a comment during the Kanmei fight etc.
Ouki commanders had their moments to shine during that battle : Rokuomi fought RBK, they had their moments with Karin and elephants etc etc. While we didn’t see even a glimpse of Moubu commanders. Hara could have used a folder commander and make him die but didn’t do it either but chose a Ouki commander again.
Same here. Tons of way to at least show once or twice Moubu army, a comments, just faces, etc etc.
Yet nothing.
Moubu had been here for a lot of time yet we still have nothing. And given the trend I don’t think this will really change in the future.
Riboku sounds completely full of himself. Strategies and tactics and battle formations are not fixed and limited. Kanki is flexible enough to adapt his battle plan to the situation. He is aware his forces are overwhelmingly outnumbered. So what he is doing makes sense: delay, buy himself/his side more time, distract the enemy, make them stop and rethink their attack, slow them down, etc.
Calling Kanki a general who has no idea of battle strategies, tactics, formations, etc.... Who is Riboku to say that those traditional strategies, tactics, formations that he has studied are an exhaustive list? If Kanki's battle formation manages to buy him an extra day to survive against overwhelming odds, in the chance that the extra day buys him enough time for help to arrive or escape this death trap, then it's more than a good enough formation that defeats Riboku's simply strategy of using numbers to win.
Calling Kanki a general who has no idea of battle strategies, tactics, formations, etc.... Who is Riboku to say that those traditional strategies, tactics, formations that he has studied are an exhaustive list? If Kanki's battle formation manages to buy him an extra day to survive against overwhelming odds, in the chance that the extra day buys him enough time for help to arrive or escape this death trap, then it's more than a good enough formation that defeats Riboku's simply strategy of using numbers to win.