Controversial General Political Discussion

[Zenos7]

To point out the difference

Only need one for that kinda
[automerge]1723875443[/automerge]

but you also don't want a distinction to be made between trans people and others.

We have the trans prefix for that.
[automerge]1723876099[/automerge]

Basically,its a dude that was born with a vagina. His body and biochemistry is that of a male, so he should compete with the other guys.

Depends on what gamete is produced.

And then on what criteria you have in the tournament. She wasnt allowed to compete in the world championships (iirc) but was allowed to compete in the olympics
[automerge]1723876369[/automerge]

specifically speaking about trans people who transition from one gender to another

Since gender is about self identification and not physical characteristics, there isnt really a gender transition. Just changing the appearance to improve the mental health of the individual. People can identify as trans without undergoing any changes to their physical appearance
[automerge]1723876537[/automerge]

Trans people would be wrong to be offended

Not at all what i said.

Not sure whether you are just being a disingenuous shithead or whether this is a language barrier issue.
[automerge]1723876716[/automerge]

faking the moon landing

Oh boy

 

[Bisoromi Bear]

What? Intersexuality is not a new term, and it’s different to the definitions of man and woman.

There have been many many examples of intersex people in the last 100 years.

Read the post again🙄here you go again putting words in my mouth.

 

[Logiko]

Since gender is about self identification and not physical characteristics, there isnt really a gender transition.

And yet there is, gender identity is still a big object of research. Some might say that gender is over, but it's not really the case for Trans people who feel gender in their bones.

So right now, the consensus is to say that yes, it is a real transition.

People can identify as trans without undergoing any changes to their physical appearance

That would be true in a society without gender. Not in a patriarcal and heteronormative society where gender are clearly defined and have very strong stereotypes attached to them.

Gender Disphoria is a mix of internal and external push mate. If the society wasn't oppressive toward people who are not aligned witht heteronormative stereotypes, there would be less problems, but that's not the case. And you can see it without even talking about Trans people.

Imane Khelif who is a CIS woman boxer was massively harrassed for having too much masculine physical attributes.

Not at all what i said.

Not sure whether you are just being a disingenuous shithead or whether this is a language barrier issue.

I literally asked you to ask them a question. And you answered that if they say "no" to you question "would it be ok to say that a trans woman just a trans woman and not a real woman", they would be wrong.

You are therefore saying that they would be wrong to be offended because you are denying their legitimacy mate.

 

[Zenos7]

That would be true in a society without gender.

So a male person cant identify as a transwoman if said individual doesnt alter his appearance?
[automerge]1723884501[/automerge]

You are therefore saying that they would be wrong to be offended because you are denying their legitimacy mate

Nah. Of course they can be offended by whatever they want. I didnt say they cant be offended or that they would be wrong about being offended.

They would be wrong about telling me its not ok to use words as they are defined.

Has once again nothing to do with denying their legitimacy either

 

[Natalija]

Read the post again🙄here you go again putting words in my mouth.

I read it. You said something wrong and uninformed

 

[Logiko]

So a male person cant identify as a transwoman if said individual doesnt alter his appearance?

There are no "male person" in the human kind. Only person with male characteristics. Sex is more complicated than just female and male.

But yes, someone with male characteristic can completely identify as transwomen without changing his appearance. But chances are that they will try to change it anyway because of gender disphoria or heteronormativity in society.

Also, some some trans (gender fluid people for example) will not try to change their physical appearance but remain as they are and simply tweeking the surface level (closes, make up etc.)

They would be wrong about telling me its not ok to use words as they are defined.

Which is basically the same as saying that they would be wrong to tell you they they are factually systematically oppressed by the usage of said words.

Not by you necessarily, but by society in general.

You usage participate in said oppression. There no, they are not wrong to tell you that you are not using the correct usage. They are telling you that you are using an oppressive usage.

And yes.. AGAIN, it has EVERYTHING to do with the fact of delegitimazing their identity. It's an indirect consequence of your usage.

 

[Zenos7]

There are no "male person" in the human kind

 

[Logiko]

You can laugh all you want. That's how sex work.

It's not just one thing, it's an accumulation of things.

 

[NikaInParis]

Billions of humans can, through their physical and biological traits, be defined as male. Billions can be defined as female through their physical and biological characteristics. The minority that does not fall directly within either of the two is an exception.

Exceptions only exist because there are norms. Without clear norms there would be no exceptions - everything would be undefinable.

 

[Zenos7]

You can laugh all you want. That's how sex work.

It's not just one thing, it's an accumulation of things.

well by saying there are no male individuals you are bascially saying sex isnt a thing in humans.




attention everyone: logiko will win a nobel prize because he uncovered that sexual reproduction isnt possible in humans, meaning that all supposed reproduction we can see around us is an elaborate conspiracy done by our alien overlords

[automerge]1723890014[/automerge]

Billions of humans can, through their physical and biological traits, be defined as male. Billions can be defined as female through their physical and biological characteristics. The minority that does not fall directly within either of the two is an exception.

Exceptions only exist because there are norms. Without clear norms there would be no exceptions - everything would be undefinable.

and exceptions are a thing because nature isnt perfect and fucks up occasionally.

 

[Logiko]

well by saying there are no male individuals you are bascially saying sex isnt a thing in humans.

It is. It's just not defined as easily as you think, that's all.

Sex is male or female, but sex is multidimensional.

attention everyone: logiko will win a nobel prize because he uncovered that sexual reproduction isnt possible in humans, meaning that all supposed reproduction we can see around us is an elaborate conspiracy done by our alien overlords

Mate :

https://orwh.od.nih.gov/sex-gender

 

[Zenos7]

It is. It's just not defined as easily as you think, that's all.

Sex is male or female, but sex is multidimensional.



Mate :

https://orwh.od.nih.gov/sex-gender

logikos source: "All animals (including humans) have a sex."

logiko:

There are no "male person" in the human kind.

[automerge]1723890675[/automerge]

Scientists have observed important sex differences across key pathways and processes, such as how the body fights disease (immune system), processes pain (nervous system), and maintains heart health (cardiovascular system). A growing body of health research demonstrates how these sex differences can influence a person’s vulnerability to disease, experience of symptoms, and response to treatment.
Until recent decades, however, the vast majority of clinical research was conducted with exclusively or predominantly male participants. In addition, most preclinical research with animal and cell models—used to inform our knowledge of human biology and disease—studied almost exclusively male cells or male animals. Despite this narrow approach, the research findings and medical treatments developed from this knowledge were often (and sometimes continue to be) assumed to apply to the whole population.

how can one person be so full of shit. its kind of amazing actually.

 

[Logiko]

logikos source: "All animals (including humans) have a sex."

logiko:

No technically.

Simply because sex is multidimensionnal. And the best way is to defined a person through all their sexual characteristics.

Of course, you can say "they are male, or female" to short it up, but it might not really be exact.

The best things to say is: "they have said and said male or female characteristics or ALL female or male characteristics"

 

[AL sama]

 

[Bisoromi Bear]

🙄 the series of quotes:

To me, that is actually a very complicated situation, because it was only in the last 30 or so years that anyone would have even referred to her as a man.

This. The definitions of men and women have already changed with the advancements in biology.

What? Intersexuality is not a new term, and it’s different to the definitions of man and woman.

There have been many many examples of intersex people in the last 100 years.

I read it. You said something wrong and uninformed

You are implying I don't know what intersex is. You got to be one of the most disingenuous debaters here.
Stop quoting me.

 

[Natalija]

🙄 the series of quotes:





You are implying I don't know what intersex is. You got to be one of the most disingenuous debaters here.
Stop quoting me.

No, you’re just wrong. You said the definitions of men and women changed. They haven’t. Intersex is a different category, separate altogether and it’s not new either.

Hahah don’t go saying incorrect things if you don’t want to be corrected

 

[Zenos7]

🙄 the series of quotes:





You are implying I don't know what intersex is. You got to be one of the most disingenuous debaters here.
Stop quoting me.

No, you’re just wrong. You said the definitions of men and women changed. They haven’t. Intersex is a different category, separate altogether and it’s not new either.

Hahah don’t go saying incorrect things if you don’t want to be corrected

well chromosomes and gametes were discovered in the 19th century

 

[K!NG HARA$H!MA]

My Twitter timeline is full of Indian Feminists pushing *ALL MEN ARE RAPISTS* rheotic.

Idk why Musk's algorithm pushing this.

Then I see an Indian trainee doctor got gang raped in state run hospital so emotions are high


Instead of putting pressure to the government and hospital it's full gender wars in Twitter

 

[Bisoromi Bear]

well chromosomes and gametes were discovered in the 19th century

Kitty doesn't seem to be aware of the arbitrary gender assignment and forced removal of sex organs done by doctors either and always has to be right about everything. Mod syndrome 🙄

 

[Zenos7]

arbitrary gender assignment

Why is it arbitrary?