Great Generals Tournament, Pools-Round 1

[Elder Lee Hung]

Totally different, you're taking about MUCH bigger impact.

The guy leading Kanki's cavalry Ringyoku didn't even participate in Kokuyou 'cause that's obviously a problematic terrain for him, and yet put him in the plains of Gyou and...

Spoiler

And I can't be bothered to go and pick other panels that explain how mountains are totally different. E.G., Kyouen having and edge due to the ability to manouver his army with his arrow in the mountains, Ouki telling Moubu not to go deep inside the mountain range to avoid ambushes and whatnot, Zhao's cavalry coming down from mountains when Qin thought was impossible etc. etc.

With this lineup with I favour Kanmei on the plains and Ousen on the mountains. The terrain totally flips the result. Not to mention tha t you write about a pre-built fort for Ousen? What? Why would he get that advantage?

It’s up to the General to use the terrain to their advantage or not. If Ousen tries to bait Kanmei into the mountains, it’s up to Kanmei to not fall for that. If Kanmei tries to bait Ousen into the plains, it’s up to Ousen not to fall for that.

For any tactic each general tries to pull, it’s up to the other general to react to that tactic in a way that gets them the advantage lol.

And it’s up to each individual voter to decide whether or not each general could successfully bait the other lol. If you think the fight would take place in the plains because Kanmei would force Ousen to fight there, then explain why and vote accordingly. Lol

 

[Patryipe]

It’s up to the General to use the terrain to their advantage or not. If Ousen tries to bait Kanmei into the mountains, it’s up to Kanmei to not fall for that. If Kanmei tries to bait Ousen into the plains, it’s up to Ousen not to fall for that.

For any tactic each general tries to pull, it’s up to the other general to react to that tactic in a way that gets them the advantage lol.

And it’s up to each individual voter to decide whether or not each general could successfully bait the other lol. If you think the fight would take place in the plains because Kanmei would force Ousen to fight there, then explain why and vote accordingly. Lol

So basically they start in a vacuum and every poster comes up with the best scenario for his favourite general...

Ok fine.

 

[Elder Lee Hung]

So basically they start in the same type of environment every large scale war in Kingdom has and we explain why the Generals will won in a scenario where the objective is to eliminate the other by General by any
Means necessary.

Fixed, and yes. :)

 

[Patryipe]

Fixed, and yes. :)

Yeah sure. Kokuyou or Shukai plains are exactly identical like every single Kingdom war.

Alright, I don't wanna go on further.

I'm clearly the only one bothered by this so you guys can have fun without me bitching around.

 

[Guan Yu]

Using terrain is still open war lol, But I’ll edit the post above for more accuracy

Yes, utilizing the terrain to gain advantage is still an open warfare. Such as the battle of Dakan plain.

But, building a fortress to wait up enemies like what Ousen did in Sanyou or a battle of attrition isn't an open warfare, it's a guerilla warfare.

 

[Elder Lee Hung]

Yes, utilizing the terrain to gain advantage is still an open warfare. Such as the battle of Dakan plain.

But, building a fortress to wait up enemies like what Ousen did in Sanyou or a battle of attrition isn't an open warfare, it's a guerilla warfare.

I edited the OP to avoid this confusion in the future lol.

 

[Guan Yu]

I edited the OP to avoid this confusion in the future lol.

Alright, just wanted to point that out.

 

[Blackbeard]

Terrain: each side has equal access to flat plains, forests, mountains, gorges, etc

Not even Renpa could reach Ousen's HQ with his environment defenses, Kanmei will just waste his troops.

Kanmei himself would arguably best Shiryu, Sou Ou and even Akou. but with enough preparations, Ousen's fortifications made even Renpa lose interest at attacking it.

What's even worse for Kanmei, it's a battle between regular troops vs troops + powerful generals and vassals. Ousen can utilize a special formation to get the upper hand in numbers again.

 

[Shanks]

Ousen has close to zero chance of slaying Kanmei unless he overwhelms him with troops with no end in sight until Kanmei simply has no stamina left. And where exactly are Kanmei's troops in that scenario?

The best martial artist Ousen has is Akou and Kanmei straight up bullies him.

I said clearly up there that OuSen and Denrimi would be toying with 120k of Kanmei with only 80k through tactics and formations. While four heavy duelists of OuSen together can definitely slay Kanmei no matter how strong he is. Its 4 vs 1.

In no dream i could say OuSen vs Kanmei as duel would be in favour of OuSen.

 

[Owl Ki]

@Admiral Lee Hung @Owl Ki what's your opinion ??

Spoiler

OuSen's underestimation is damn high here. Lol

There are people commenting here that are placing far too much emphasis on Kanmei’s martial prowess and not appreciating both Ousen’s tactical genius and the fact he has all his subordinates with him in this matchup.

In no scenario, regardless of the surrounding terrain, will Kanmei claim victory, not against Ousen and not without any decent subordinates.

Let us assume this battle takes place on a flat plain where Kanmei can unleash the full force of the Chu Army.

For offensive maneuvers, Ousen has Akou for head on engagements,

Spoiler

Makou for tactical large scale assaults

Spoiler

and Sou’Ou and Shiryou for precision strikes.

For defensive maneuvers, Ousen has himself and Denrimi. The Ousen Army has also shown one of the strongest defensive formations ever seen in Kingdom that was able to simultaneously hold back Bananji, Gyou’Un and Chougaryuu. It took Riboku himself to figure out the weakness of this formation and Kanmei is certainly no Riboku.

Spoiler

That being said, Ousen and Denrimi can utilize offensive tactics even if they themselves do not take to the field.

This means that the Ousen Army can launch four whole simultaneous offensives personally led by commanders in addition to two tactical offensives, all of which are guaranteed to work considering the lack of defensive formations employed by the Kanmei Army.

It is true that Kanmei can kill any one individual opponent in a dual. Problem is, Kanmei is just one man and he can only be at one place at any one time. If he leaves his headquarters to personally deal with any one threat then he is giving the other commanders of the Ousen Army free reign to tear his own army apart.

However, if he stays at his headquarters then he is fighting a tactical battle that he cannot hope to win. His army will be devastated by the expert assault tactics of the Ousen Army.

Ultimately, the Kanmei Army will be overwhelmed and decimated and Kanmei himself will fall to an endless stream of Qin soldiers.

Edit: MangaSee images do not permanently stay on posts within this forum, so I am replacing any that are in my posts.

 

[Xione]

Gonna go with Ousen. Bro is going to pull some fuckery and with Kanmei lacking strategists and underlings to command that huge of an army, while he himself not being a capable strategist, it's too easy work for Ousen when he's loaded with Akou and etc. Not too worried about the numerical advantage with the lack of competent generals on that side.

Kanmei best watchout, Shiryou might low-diff him with an instant 180 horse turn.