Hiruzen > Minato all ages.
- Thread starter Rob Luffy
- Start date
Tsunade herself destroys old Hiruzen lol. Bro has literally nothing on her other than RDS, which is a suicide.
You can make the argument at best that he was stronger than Mei/Onoki/Ay individually in a 1vs1 at that time, if going by that statement since you're taking Kabuto's words as facts. That's it. Gaara wasn't made Kazekage during the time of the statement. Tsunade wasn't made Hokage.
Kabuto's intel on Hiruzen was also from the fights he had, which he hadn't done in over 10+ years lol.
You can make the argument at best that he was stronger than Mei/Onoki/Ay individually in a 1vs1 at that time, if going by that statement since you're taking Kabuto's words as facts. That's it. Gaara wasn't made Kazekage during the time of the statement. Tsunade wasn't made Hokage.
Kabuto's intel on Hiruzen was also from the fights he had, which he hadn't done in over 10+ years lol.
Tsunade destroys that same Orochimaru, not sure what you're telling me to relax for lol.
There's is virtually nothing old Hiruzen can do to Tsunade out of the RDS...
Either you don't realize how much of a monster Tsunade is in relation to anyone who doesn't have a hax or you're relying on some headcanon version of Hiruzen.
There's is virtually nothing old Hiruzen can do to Tsunade out of the RDS...
Either you don't realize how much of a monster Tsunade is in relation to anyone who doesn't have a hax or you're relying on some headcanon version of Hiruzen.
My brotha, I told you specifically, outside of the RDS which is a suicide tech, Hiruzen has nothing he can do anything to Tsunade with.
You stating she's trash isn't countering anything I've stated. Stating baseless opinions of where she stands in contrast to others isn't helping your point in this discussion.
You stating she's trash isn't countering anything I've stated. Stating baseless opinions of where she stands in contrast to others isn't helping your point in this discussion.
Yes and that Orochimaru with what he displayed is getting destroyed by peak Tsunade, outside of the Edo Tensei... which again goes back to what I said about hax...
- Not doing anything to her
- Not doing anything to her
- This is a lie and already been debunked countless times
- Tsunade is a MUCH bigger one
- This is headcanon
Yes and none of the bags you've listed so far is valid and the ones that are valid aren't doing shit to her lol.
You're proving my point that you're relying on a headcanon version of Old Hiruzen.
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- Not doing anything to her
- Not doing anything to her
- This is a lie and already been debunked countless times
- Tsunade is a MUCH bigger one
- This is headcanon
Yes and none of the bags you've listed so far is valid and the ones that are valid aren't doing shit to her lol.
You're proving my point that you're relying on a headcanon version of Old Hiruzen.
Hiruzen at the age of 69 > Any other present Kage.
Howver I do not think Hiruzen was superior to Minato. During the Kyuubi attack, Hiruzen + back up managed to push the Kyuubi outside the village with effort. Minato was able to counter it single handedly a few times by himself.
Prime Hiruzen vs Prime Minato would be a good fight but I'd favor Minato at the end.
when was this disproven again?
and not headcanon, we literally see Hiruzen and Tobirama teleport at the same time in the final war, and we saw Hiruzen save Naruto before Tobirama could do anything
- He can't use FTG
- He can't use Edo Tensei
- He can't use Soul transfer technique
- He can't use the various Mokuton techniques
- He can't use the Gates
- He can't use Mitotic Medical techniques of Tsunade
- He can't use the Seal of Tsunade's
- He can't use the various Byakugan abilities
- He can't use the various Sharingan abilities
^^^^ ALL OF THEM are Konoha techniques. If you believe it's about "techniques that were created and originate in Konoha", then you'd have to go ask Kishimoto which specific techniques originate from Konoha lol.
- This is also wrong and people always miscontextualized that panel. The Hokage were not racing each other to the war. Minato was sent ahead while the other 3 came together. You claiming Hiruzen's Body Flicker is on Tobirama level is just insanely wrong, when even Hashirama's body flicker isn't on Tobirama's level lol. There's a reason why Tobirama & Minato used their body flicker to take Hiruzen & Hashirama to their statues, instead of all 4 using their own body flickers.
Minato & Tobirama are in a realm by themselves when it comes to the body flicker.
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Hiruzen at the age of 69 > Any other present Kage.
Howver I do not think Hiruzen was superior to Minato. During the Kyuubi attack, Hiruzen + back up managed to push the Kyuubi outside the village with effort. Minato was able to counter it single handedly a few times by himself.
Prime Hiruzen vs Prime Minato would be a good fight but I'd favor Minato at the end.
My brotha read that clearly, Kabuto is stating Hiruzen's reputation, not his own opinion of factuality. @Roo
Just as people in Konoha believed Hiruzen was the strongest Hokage in history, because they had 0 idea how strong Hashirama/Madara/Tobirama/etc were in history.
This is virtually no different than Whitebeard being viewed as the strongest pirate on the seas, even though using basic CoC, was giving him a heart attack. Reputation of a character stemming from past events =/= reality of the character.
- FTG is the only exception I’ll grant here because it was shown to be a technique passed down by the leaf.
- He likely can and doesn’t. Edo tensei was considered a taboo technique.
- Dan’s ability was a unique one, pretty sure that doesn’t count as a leaf ability.
- Keke genkai are genetically restricted. Obviously Kishi didn’t mean this lmao
- bro anybody can open a gate. Kakashi did so in the manga
- Another unique ability. Tsunade spent years as a recluse and likely didn’t teach anybody but Sakura and Shizune
by leaf abilities it’s obviously abilities that are taught and can be learned by anybody in the leaf(including Kinjutsu) that’s why he’s called the professor
- He likely can and doesn’t. Edo tensei was considered a taboo technique.
- Dan’s ability was a unique one, pretty sure that doesn’t count as a leaf ability.
- Keke genkai are genetically restricted. Obviously Kishi didn’t mean this lmao
- bro anybody can open a gate. Kakashi did so in the manga
- Another unique ability. Tsunade spent years as a recluse and likely didn’t teach anybody but Sakura and Shizune
by leaf abilities it’s obviously abilities that are taught and can be learned by anybody in the leaf(including Kinjutsu) that’s why he’s called the professor
Alright now you're trying to headcanonly label which is a leaf ability and which isn't. All of those abilities are used by members of the leaf village and thus they are leaf abilities. It's that simple.
- Still a leaf ability
- Headcanon
- Right an ability of a leaf ninja doesn't count as a leaf ability, roger roger.
- Right abilities used by vast members of the leaf village don't count as leaf abilities.
- Kakashi can open the 1st gate. Even Rock Lee was struggling to get to 7th gate lol despite dedicated training. You're not gonna convince anyone Hiruzen can open up to 7th.
- An ability passed down from Mito to Tsunade to Sakura, but is not a leaf ability, roger roger
"Obviously Kishi didn't mean this" .. right now we're assuming what Kishi meant or didn't mean over a vague statement that he never once clarified.
I'd suggest going to Kishimoto to get a list of what Jutsu he qualifies as "Leaf's" and which ones he doesn't. Otherwise, you're wasting my time and yours arguing over that panel. Since all you're gonna be doing is labeling abilities that YOU think Hiruzen can use as "leaf abilities".
- Still a leaf ability
- Headcanon
- Right an ability of a leaf ninja doesn't count as a leaf ability, roger roger.
- Right abilities used by vast members of the leaf village don't count as leaf abilities.
- Kakashi can open the 1st gate. Even Rock Lee was struggling to get to 7th gate lol despite dedicated training. You're not gonna convince anyone Hiruzen can open up to 7th.
- An ability passed down from Mito to Tsunade to Sakura, but is not a leaf ability, roger roger
"Obviously Kishi didn't mean this" .. right now we're assuming what Kishi meant or didn't mean over a vague statement that he never once clarified.
I'd suggest going to Kishimoto to get a list of what Jutsu he qualifies as "Leaf's" and which ones he doesn't. Otherwise, you're wasting my time and yours arguing over that panel. Since all you're gonna be doing is labeling abilities that YOU think Hiruzen can use as "leaf abilities".
Bro according to you Hiruzen can’t use any ability he hasn’t shown using. You realize how ridiculous that sounds?
my assumptions are more grounded in reality. Hiruzen was pulling out abilities even Orochimaru didn’t know of. Hell you’re telling me Hiruzen can’t use Edo tensei yet he knew right away what the technique was before the reveal.
my assumptions are more grounded in reality. Hiruzen was pulling out abilities even Orochimaru didn’t know of. Hell you’re telling me Hiruzen can’t use Edo tensei yet he knew right away what the technique was before the reveal.
