Questions & Mysteries how much are you certain that Shinobu is the traitor? :D and why ?

A

ardym

#1
#1
well we know for sure there is a traitor in the alliance , Shinobu was always a candidate for many reason.
  1. the traitor should be known for us , since it doesn't make any sense to bring unknown character in the end and say that was the culprit.
  2. Oda create her as an ugly character and gave her a DF that make things literally rot. usually rotten things make other things rot. maybe he wanted to say she is a rotten person herself too.
  3. the traitor must be really very close and skilled in deceiving people , this person must have been in the group of Amigasa village , since the traitor knew about the 1000 sunny location, the exact number of the alliance , the situation in Oden and location of Hiyori , and must be there as Kawamatsu and Zoro told them about Hiyori well seeing the people in chapters 954, 955 i doubt really the traitor is a mink , hitetsu , or a scabbard , the scabbards always supported and believed in Oden even as he made a laughing stock of himself. the only option is really Shiobu.
  4. her quarrel with Law , and accusing his crew to be the traitors and going far as wanting them killed , can be seen as wanting to cause havoc in the alliance from inside and she even continued to be hostile towards him even after Kanjuro went mad on her , and short before depart with Momo and co. she stated who cares if he join or not.
  5. the enemy knew about the destination of Kinemoan and co being Zou.
  6. the fact that the enemy even knew that some of the strawhats were in the path house and if Sanji was not , Nami and Robin would really have been captured.
  7. she was there and knew for sure what happened between Oden and Orochi , and no one else came to know even 5 years later , she has not told anyone. as it seems .
i would say i am 99% convinced that she is the traitor . 90 % for the mentioned reason , 9 % me being biased lol
what about you ?
 
Gargo

Gargo

‎
#3
#3
I don't know, I don't feel her like a traitor.

I think she do know more of Oden story than the Scabbards, and maybe she was even Orochi underling at first ( because Ninja and traitors go well together ) but I see him like a Nami Who did betray Oden for good and unknown reason, Or Kamazou, but now she would be like Law scheming on her side.
 
Uncle Van

Uncle Van

Monké Don't Do Taxes
‎
#5
#5
The traitor should someone that would leave an impact so.....not Shinobu please. It would be completely underwhelming and therefore, BULLSHIT! *cough cough*

My bet is on Okiku.
1. Was the only one who stayed behind in Wano after jumping 20 years

2. Laid low and did nothing while Kinemon and the others were gone

3. The only one showed in armor with face hidden when the other scabbards were sad that their boats were gone.

4. Would greatly play into the themes of loyalty and duty. Okiku could believe that Kaido is unbeatable since even the great Oden perished, and that the other scabbards are just rushing to their deaths. Sabotage could be the only way to keep them alive.

Kanjuro has always been a popular choice and Denjiro is too obvious imo.
 
A

ardym

#6
#6
spitles said:
among all of the funny possibilities, these are my current favorites :
- zou : the donquixote pirates did threat to cut kanjuro's hairs, and kanjuro gave everything
- wanokuni : caesar clown did hide in the sunny till wanokuni, now it's time for ultimate vengeance

other favorite possibilities (wano only) :
- frog (fruit user) : usopp has a frog on his head, the frog as the mysterious informer is a funny possibility imo
- eventual hair fruit user : some dude who could create clone/spy made of hairs - alternatives : flower, snow, etc...
Click to expand...
Kanjiro is not the man because , Oden's scabbards are really very loyal they believed in him even as he made a laughing stock of himself possibility is really very low .
caesar being in ship cannot be true. it would be really an insult to the many observation haki user not sense his presence especially Luffy and Sanji.
Usopp was not in the Amagasia village it was stated that it doesn't usopp head how could it communicate ?
Post automatically merged:

Van said:
The traitor should someone that would leave an impact so.....not Shinobu please. It would be completely underwhelming and therefore, BULLSHIT! *cough cough*

My bet is on Okiku.
1. Was the only one who stayed behind in Wano after jumping 20 years

2. Laid low and did nothing while Kinemon and the others were gone

3. The only one showed in armor with face hidden when the other scabbards were sad that their boats were gone.

4. Would greatly play into the themes of loyalty and duty. Okiku could believe that Kaido is unbeatable since even the great Oden perished, and that the other scabbards are just rushing to their deaths. Sabotage could be the only way to keep them alive.

Kanjuro has always been a popular choice and Denjiro is too obvious imo.
Click to expand...
O-kiku gathered infos about the enemy , even she was the traitor she would have told them about Udon from the beginning she could have gave them info so they could capture Momo easily. since she was guarding him to Udon.
 
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Uncle Van

Uncle Van

Monké Don't Do Taxes
‎
#7
#7
ardym said:
Kanjiro is not the man because , Oden's scabbards are really very loyal they believed in him even as he made a laughing stock of himself possibility is really very low .
caesar being in ship cannot be true. it would be really an insult to the many observation haki user not sense his presence especially Luffy and Sanji.
Usopp was not in the Amagasia village it was stated that it doesn't usopp head how could it communicate ?
Post automatically merged:


O-kiku gathered infos about the enemy , even she was the traitor she would have told them about Udon from the beginning she could have gave them info so they could capture Momo easily. since she was guarding him to Udon.
Click to expand...
Capture doesnt have to be the motivation of the traitor; just prevent the other scabbards from rushing to their deaths against an unbeatable enemy.

Kinemon, Neko, Inu, Ashura Doji, Kawamatsu and Raizo are proven innocent, leaving Okiku, Kanjuro and Denjiro left. Along with that, Orochi was certain that the scabbards would return and wasnt surprised at all when they did, which implies a time jumper was his insurance(yes and I know Toki prophecied it to him).
 
A

ardym

#8
#8
Van said:
Capture doesnt have to be the motivation of the traitor; just prevent the other scabbards from rushing to their deaths against an unbeatable enemy.

Kinemon, Neko, Inu, Ashura Doji, Kawamatsu and Raizo are proven innocent, leaving Okiku, Kanjuro and Denjiro left. Along with that, Orochi was certain that the scabbards would return and wasnt surprised at all when they did, which implies a time jumper was his insurance(yes and I know Toki prophecied it to him).
Click to expand...
doesn't have to be if they had a vivre card they would know that they are not dead
 
Uncle Van

Uncle Van

Monké Don't Do Taxes
‎
#10
#10
Saving Momo doesnt exempt someone from betraying you for your own good.....there are no facts or guarantees who it is or why they did it....
 
Diamond

Diamond

‎
#11
#11
She feels more like a red herring to me. Someone you could think is the traitor but just diverts attention from the real deal. She might be mistrustful, but I think deeply caring about her friends makes her that way.

The traitor is probably someone who is not obvious or acting suspicious in anyway.
 
Uncle Van

Uncle Van

Monké Don't Do Taxes
‎
#12
#12
Diamond said:
She feels more like a red herring to me. Someone you could think is the traitor but just diverts attention from the real deal. She might be mistrustful, but I think deeply caring about her friends makes her that way.

The traitor is probably someone who is not obvious or acting suspicious in anyway.
Click to expand...
Possibly. I'm not stating anything to be facts, but I prefer if its Okiku even though Kanjuro would be the shocking and best choice.
 
Diamond

Diamond

‎
#13
#13
Van said:
Possibly. I'm not stating anything to be facts, but I prefer if its Okiku even though Kanjuro would be the shocking and best choice.
Click to expand...
I would like it to be one of the alliance members or nine scabbards was well. Kanjuro is the popular guess since he we don't know much about his past or what he was doing on Dressrosa during Kinemon's absence.
 
Dr. Spook

Dr. Spook

‎
#14
#14
ardym said:
well we know for sure there is a traitor in the alliance , Shinobu was always a candidate for many reason.
  1. the traitor should be known for us , since it doesn't make any sense to bring unknown character in the end and say that was the culprit.
  2. Oda create her as an ugly character and gave her a DF that make things literally rot. usually rotten things make other things rot. maybe he wanted to say she is a rotten person herself too.
  3. the traitor must be really very close and skilled in deceiving people , this person must have been in the group of Amigasa village , since the traitor knew about the 1000 sunny location, the exact number of the alliance , the situation in Oden and location of Hiyori , and must be there as Kawamatsu and Zoro told them about Hiyori well seeing the people in chapters 954, 955 i doubt really the traitor is a mink , hitetsu , or a scabbard , the scabbards always supported and believed in Oden even as he made a laughing stock of himself. the only option is really Shiobu.
  4. her quarrel with Law , and accusing his crew to be the traitors and going far as wanting them killed , can be seen as wanting to cause havoc in the alliance from inside and she even continued to be hostile towards him even after Kanjuro went mad on her , and short before depart with Momo and co. she stated who cares if he join or not.
  5. the enemy knew about the destination of Kinemoan and co being Zou.
  6. the fact that the enemy even knew that some of the strawhats were in the path house and if Sanji was not , Nami and Robin would really have been captured.
  7. she was there and knew for sure what happened between Oden and Orochi , and no one else came to know even 5 years later , she has not told anyone. as it seems .
i would say i am 99% convinced that she is the traitor . 90 % for the mentioned reason , 9 % me being biased lol
what about you ?
Click to expand...
What is completely certain, is that the traitor in the alliance should be among those who attended the strategy meeting.... except for the SH crew, Kinemon and Kawamatsu objectively..


The reason is that all the details leaked by the traitor to Orochi the second time were mentioned in that meeting, making it impossible for a mink to be the traitor (and Jibuemon, if some are still thinking this).

1. The details of the meetup point was given by Kinemon, with some of the scabbards present.​


2. Kinemon stated the number of men that sided with them in the rebellion​


3. Luffy blurted out the location of the sunny in that meeting.​


4. Interestingly enough, lady hiyori being alive was also exposed in that meeting, which was leaked to Orochi by the traitor afterwards.​


Another thing that was leaked was how Kinemon and co traveled 20 years thru time to get to present day Wano, but with that leak, I guess it could be anyone (or imo, possibly someone who only just knew that Kinemon traveled in time, right after the first plan got leaked)... but for certain, it's definitely not a mink.


This is an unpopular opinion, but I'm still sold on the idea that Shutenmaru is really the traitor... and what kind-of pisses me off is that I've had this idea for 3 months now, and yet I couldn't find any damn time to explain my reasons, with RL shit fucking me over these days.. :cautious:
 
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Longleg Larry

Longleg Larry

‎
#15
#15
Van said:
Sabotage could be the only way to keep them alive.
Click to expand...
I think Kiku genuinely hates Oden & wants them to die, and rightfully so. The dick Oden hops on a ship to play hooky, and Kiku's only family leaves to try to bring Oden back for literal years. And when he does return (for a quick min), he only brings back HIS OWN NEW FAMILY, then leaves again while his country disintegrates. At this point, I really hate Oden & hope that every Scabbard besides Kappa & Cat-Dog get a piece of that betrayal (Oden saved them from the stake, they're square)

Van said:
The only one showed in armor with face hidden when the other scabbards were sad that their boats were gone.
Click to expand...

All the proof I need
:kata:
 
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