General & Others Is this Oda's way of telling us that Kid and Law didn't actually win their fight?

[Colt Buntline]

You guys are mixing different things by no checking the Japanese and studying their words.

Descriptive bynames like Straw Hat, Surgeon of Death or King of the Beasts are tsusho (通称) but Kaidou was talking about a rhetoric figure called makurakotoba (枕詞). Only because both can be translated as "epithet" doesn't mean they are the same; heck, even in English "epithet" has tons of different meanings.

When Oda says that the victor needs no epithets he doesn't mean that addressing Kid as "Captain" and Law as "Surgeon of death" delegitimizes their win, but that if samurai were as strong as they are claimed to be they would demonstrate it by their actions instead of their reputation.

For more information, this was my take back in the day about the makurakotoba issue:

I'm quite sure you're right. That's also the impression I had while reading the chapter with that title; It was obvious that it was referring to Kaidou and Luffy's talk about the samurai being strong, and the title wasn't even of the chapter in which the narrator announced Kaidou's victory.

 

[L55]

Add luffy to
Waido 1v15

 

[Monkey D Theories]

clearly, Oda was just trying to make the emperor fights special by showing epithets

 

[Finalbeta]

The yonko are just too flabbergasting to be done this soon @MonsterKaido

When do you predict their mythical return to come into place my mister?

 

[L55]

clearly, Oda was just trying to make the emperor fights special by showing epithets

Sure
Bombs and 1v15 kaido

 

[Herrera95]

Big Mom was still good after all Kid's and Law's attacks.

She got blank eye after bomb but was still good.

And then another bomb...

And now lava...

If she is defeated that means bombs and lavas > Kid + Law.

 

[Strawhats Bible]

Oda had Kaido fight for 60 straight chapters only for people to call his end soon

You could say that for Big Mom because that fight was a complete mess though.

 

[Finalbeta]

They are winners of that battle but maybe the war is not yet won

 

[yonbis]

You cannot be this stupid...
Epithets had nothing to do with that chapter. It's just that Viz translator wanting to be different and try to use smarter words.

It's more like "Winners don't need excuses"

Did you retards even read the chapter? Where are you getting epithets from? It had nothing to do with the chapter

 

[Warchief Sanji D Goat]

Both Kidd and Law still won their fight regardless of bombs or not.

 

[Charlotte Horchata]

You cannot be this stupid...
Epithets had nothing to do with that chapter. It's just that Viz translator wanting to be different and try to use smarter words.

It's more like "Winners don't need excuses"

Did you retards even read the chapter? Where are you getting epithets from? It had nothing to do with the chapter

"Epithet" is a valid translation, it isn't about trying to use smarter words but finding how to adapt a word naming a rhetoric figure from Japanese literature. The issue here is that some people tried to make their case on illegitimate wins without first checking 1) how many meanings "epithet" can have, since an epithet isn't only a byname like "Straw Hat"; and 2) how said bynames are called in Japanese and whether it fits the term Kaidou used (which it doesn't, as I explained in a previous post); which is the process they should have followed.

It's just about people lacking the ability to build proper reasonings and question their own hypothesis. Something way more structural that happens in everyday life and that of course will show among the fans of a story for teens. I can assure you right now that many of these guys consistently fall for confirmation bias, focus on verifiability instead of falsifiability, are vulnerable to fallacies and so on in their daily life only from the fact they wouldn't spend some minutes on checking the Japanese words and understanding them to make sure the foundations of their hypothesis make the slightest sense at all.

They didn't do the bare minimum here, simple as that.

 

[Kiiro]

Nice catch, we will just have to wait and see if it comes true.

But I also dont think Kaido is fully defeated.

 

[Finalbeta]

Nice catch, we will just have to wait and see if it comes true.

But I also dont think Kaido is fully defeated.

How do you foresee him coming back overall? :cheers:

 

[Kiiro]

How do you foresee him coming back overall? :cheers:

Maybe not even fighting, he might come back crawling and then Zoro finds him, Zoro more heatlhy and Kaido barely able to move, he kills Kaido and no one ever knows just like the event of Kuma.

 

[Finalbeta]

Maybe not even fighting, he might come back crawling and then Zoro finds him, Zoro more heatlhy and Kaido barely able to move, he kills Kaido and no one ever knows just like the event of Kuma.

I hope he gets rescued. That would be fun to witness for me.

 

[Jinjoo]

Kid and law won the fight without any doubt. Big mom was knocked unconscious from kid's damned punk and fell down. She regained her consciousness and tried a last ditch effort to save herself by grabbing the bomb. It literally blasted into her face and she fell down either way. If she did not try to grab the bomb, she would have fallen down anyway andand who knows how deep law made the hole and the impact would have taken her out of commission. Without bombs she falls down, eitherway. With bombs she still falls down either way. Kid and law won