Future Events Kaido Must Die

[Cinera]

Oda doesn't just like to throw curve balls, he loves to lead the fandom in one direction, and then do something completely unexpected that nobody sees coming.

Right now he's making you all believe that there is no conceivable way for Kaido to be taken down and out of the picture without being killed. The Navy can't hold him. Wano will never be safe. The Straw Hats will never be safe. He MUST die, right? That's what Oda has everyone believing. So, which is the safer bet here? Oda is going to do what everyone is expecting him to do, which he's never done, OR, he going to do what he always does and show everyone that there's always another option?

No, really, this is a straight up idiotic way to reason.

Like what you're saying was that if there were no indications that Kaido will die, he would actually be more likely to die.

You're arguing that all the indications that Kaido will die, make him less likely to die.

You're arguing that being a character that was created for the express purpose of death actually makes one unlikely to die?

This is idiotic in the extreme. Like you're making elementary reasoning errors here.

What you're doing is the equivalent of seeing a pattern that goes:

2, 4, 8, 16, 32, ?

And asked if the next number is an even number or an odd number, you say it's probably an odd number?

That's incredibly stupid.


Leaving aside the idiocy of the argument you just presented — and have I mentioned that it's idiotic — the Oda likes to throw curve balls things is way overblown. Oda may change minor details, he may drop Red Herrings, he may set some Chekhov Guns and leave them unfired, he may try to deliberately mislead the readers, he may do all this.

But suggesting that he's doing it with Kaido is taking things a bit too far.

It's a bigger stretch than claiming: "Jimbe wouldn't join the crew because he's such an obvious candidate. Oda doesn't want the fans to predict his story, he's deliberately misleading them".

Oda has been building up Kaido's death for over 200 chapters — since his introduction into the story — and has reinforced it at every stretch of the way.

There's no precedent — nor any reason at all actually — to believe that Oda will throw the kind of curve ball you're claiming here.

Besides, the argument is idiotic.

Gosh, I'm annoyed at just how dumb an argument this is.


Like Kaido is not 100% confirmed to die. I don't even have credences as high as 90% in Kaido's death (I'm at 70% - 80% I think), but the argument you presented is so terrible it triggered me.

 

[Luffy is the mc]

The arguments you brought up make sense and everything should lead to Kaido's death.
It should be the most logical outcome.

However I still voted no because I don't trust Oda to deliver such a big moment.

 

[Cinera]

But if you really want some sort of "preexisting theory" on the matter @Cinera, one of the biggest tropes of dealing with someone who is seemingly un-killable, is to trap them for all eternity in some way or another.

https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AndIMustScream

Kaido is not unkillable though. Kaido is built up to die.

If Kaido was unkillable and Oda had set up Kaido has someone that cannot be killed, then this would be feasible. However, Oda didn't take this development.

Oda has instead setup Kaido as someone that must be killed.

 

[Celestial D. Dragon]

No, really, this is a straight up idiotic way to reason.

Like what you're saying was that if there were no indications that Kaido will die, he would actually be more likely to die.

You're arguing that all the indications that Kaido will die, make him less likely to die.

You're arguing that being a character that was created for the express purpose of death actually makes one unlikely to die?

This is idiotic in the extreme. Like you're making elementary reasoning errors here.

What you're doing is the equivalent of seeing a pattern that goes:

2, 4, 8, 16, 32, ?

And asked if the next number is an even number or an odd number, you say it's probably an odd number?

That's incredibly stupid.


Leaving aside the idiocy of the argument you just presented — and have I mentioned that it's idiotic — the Oda likes to throw curve balls things is way overblown. Oda may change minor details, he may drop Red Herrings, he may set some Chekhov Guns and leave them unfired, he may try to deliberately mislead the readers, he may do all this.

But suggesting that he's doing it with Kaido is taking things a bit too far.

It's a bigger stretch than claiming: "Jimbe wouldn't join the crew because he's such an obvious candidate. Oda doesn't want the fans to predict his story, he's deliberately misleading them".

Oda has been building up Kaido's death for over 200 chapters — since his introduction into the story — and has reinforced it at every stretch of the way.

There's no precedent — nor any reason at all actually — to believe that Oda will throw the kind of curve ball you're claiming here.

Besides, the argument is idiotic.

Gosh, I'm annoyed at just how dumb an argument this is.

Lmao, you're just annoyed because you know I am right. There is nothing idiotic about it. In fact it is sheer and utter stupidity to think you have it all figured out when Oda has being doing this shit for 23+ years.

This is just a bad attempt to push the ZKK narrative, by arguing against everything we know about Oda and One Piece.

 

[HA001]

Lmao, you're just annoyed because you know I am right. There is nothing idiotic about it. In fact it is sheer and utter stupidity to think you have it all figured out when Oda has being doing this shit for 23+ years.

This is just a sad attempt to push the ZKK narrative, by arguing against everything we know about Oda and One Piece.

No your points are shit. This is like your hes gonna get trapped in mont dors book shit.
Hes got a fish fruit cause in the east dragons are more akin to fish than lizards like they are in the west. It was simple taxonomy his model is still azure dragon.
I can't wait till oda throws a curveball and doesn't make the strawhats achieve their dreams right ?
Both kaido and the scabbards have said the way to declare victory is by taking the leaders head.
His head is coming off.

 

[Celestial D. Dragon]

No your points are shit. This is like your hes gonna get trapped in mont dors book shit.
Hes got a fish fruit cause in the east dragons are more akin to fish than lizards like they are in the west. It was simple taxonomy his model is still azure dragon.
I can't wait till oda throws a curveball and doesn't make the strawhats achieve their dreams right ?
Both kaido and the scabbards have said the way to declare victory is by taking the leaders head.
His head is coming off.

So I guess the Straw Hats never achieved victory, because they've never taken the heads of the antagonists before.

 

[HA001]

So I guess the Straw Hats never achieved victory, because they've never taken the heads of the antagonists before.

Croc all of baroque works Walpol lucci kaku Enel moriah etc are all free to attack them again if they wanted.
Luffy after wano still can't solo kaido and will get assblasted for the millionth time. What's funny is if page one and ulti get up that's page one ulti Jack the scabbards luffy multiple times soon zoro who will all get back up after being taken out but you think kaido an awakened myth zoan user will be out for good the first time he's taken out.

 

[Cinera]

Lmao, you're just annoyed because you know I am right. There is nothing idiotic about it. In fact it is sheer and utter stupidity to think you have it all figured out when Oda has being doing this shit for 23+ years.

No, I'm annoyed because it's an idiotic argument.

The people who argued that Jimbe wouldn't join the crew because "it would be too predictable", had more legs to stand on, but it was also idiotic back then.

This is the most idiotic version of the "it would be too predictable" argument.

I don't think Kaido will 100% die, there are actually reasons to be a bit sceptical, but "it would be too predictable" is extremely stupid as an argument.

I hate stupid arguments.

The arguments you brought up make sense and everything should lead to Kaido's death.
It should be the most logical outcome.

However I still voted no because I don't trust Oda to deliver such a big moment.

If Pedro and Yasuie remain dead, then it shows that Oda is willing to kill off characters when it serves the plot.

 

[Celestial D. Dragon]

No, I'm annoyed because it's an idiotic argument.

The people who argued that Jimbe wouldn't join the crew because "it would be too predictable", had more legs to stand on, but it was also idiotic back then.

This is the most idiotic version of the "it would be too predictable argument".

I don't think Kaido will 100% die, there are actually reasons to be a bit sceptical, but "it would be too predictable" is extremely stupid as an argument.

I hate stupid arguments.



If Pedro and Yasuie remain dead, then it shows that Oda is willing to kill off characters when it serves the plot.

It's not about being too predictable. It's about the fact that Oda is pushing the agenda that makes it extremely suspect. Like I said, when he pushes an agenda, it is mostly always followed by him throwing a curveball.

During Marineford, he had everyone believing Ace would be saved. He even went as far as actually having him get saved. Nobody thought Ace would die, because that's how Oda set it up. Then what happened?

If this was some other Mangaka, then yeah, it would be a dumb argument. But this is Oda, and we know his track record, and how he operates.

Not really sure how you can straight face say that it's a dumb argument to use Oda's track record to reach the conclusion that it's highly unlikely that he will kill off Kaido.

 

[Jackteo]

Yes, and Zoro is going to kill him after Orochi.

 

[HA001]

Yes, and Zoro is going to kill him after Orochi.

Hiyori will kill orochi.

 

[nik87]

The funniest posts are Luffy/Kidd/Cp0/whoever will kill Kaido... As if they can do it.

 

[Jackteo]

Hiyori will kill orochi.

After Zoro knocks him down with his CoC

 

[Cinera]

For the record, I'm currently like 75% confident that Kaido will die. I think this is somewhat conservative, but I'm a cautious person in general. Most of the other 25% is to account for stuff like:

• The possibility of Oda merely giving Kaido a symbolic death.
• The possibility of Kaido developing so as to no longer seek death.
• Unknown unknowns
  • The stuff I'm not accounting for because I don't know of it.
• Adjusting for my known biases.
  • I want Kaido to die because I want ZKK.
• Starting from a very low prior on villain death.
  • Unless I'm mistaken, no villain has ever died in One Piece.
• Scepticism of the entire argument itself.

Stuff that would cause me to significantly lower my credence in Kaido dying:

• Yasuie is revealed to be alive.
• Pedro is revealed to be alive.

Stuff that would cause me to significantly raise my credence in Kaido dying:

• Yamato alludes to Kaido's death during their confrontation.
• Kaido alludes to his own death.
• Kanjuro dies.
• Orochi dies.

@Celestial D. Dragon: just so you understand where I'm coming from when I get so triggered by: "it would be too predictable" arguments against Kaido dying. It's not that I'm 100% confident in Kaido dying. It's that "it would be too predictable" is a nonsense argument. It has no useful value, and it can be applied to anything someone doesn't like:

• Jimbe wouldn't join the crew because it would be too predictable.
• Zoro wouldn't fight Mihawk because it would be too predictable.
• Luffy wouldn't fight Sakazuki because it would be too predictable.
• Zoro wouldn't be a Shimotsuki because it would be too predictable.
• Kaido wouldn't be a dragon because it would be too predictable.

The argument has an absolute shit track record and makes no sense besides. Oda has only ever dropped Red Herrings for minor details (Paulie joining the crew, Zoro acquiring the Nidai Kitetsu (for now)), and never major stuff.

 

[Red Admiral]

I can't believe someone can die in one piece until I see their dead body

 

[nik87]

I can't believe someone can die in one piece until I see their dead body

What if Zoro cuts his body in such small pieces that there is nothing to see?

 

[Finalbeta]

Of course.

- Luffy never killed if not inadvertently
- Yamato probably won't push themselves as far as killing daddy no matter the factual level of despise
- Finding perfection in death like Kaido claimed
- Presumably preferring aforementioned perfection to a life of imprisonment

And I didn't even factor the eventuality that Zoro will need to assist Luffy in defeating him too.

This looks good enough to me.
Have yet to spot a compelling argument to bypass.

 

[Cinera]

So I guess the Straw Hats never achieved victory, because they've never taken the heads of the antagonists before.

• I am not saying the Strawhats will kill Kaido, but that Kaido will die.
  • I do believe Zoro will kill Kaido, but that's a separate matter from Kaido's death.
• There is no other antagonist for whom death was depicted to be a necessity.

It's not about being too predictable. It's about the fact that Oda is pushing the agenda that makes it extremely suspect. Like I said, when he pushes an agenda, it is mostly always followed by him throwing a curveball.

This is what I'm describing as being too predictable. If you believe this, then give five examples.

During Marineford, he had everyone believing Ace would be saved. He even went as far as actually having him get saved. Nobody thought Ace would die, because that's how Oda set it up. Then what happened?

I don't think it's all that analogous to the current situation, but Ace's death was a curve ball, so I would give you this as one example. I'm still waiting for the other four.

Kaido's death is like Jimbe joining the crew. An event for which the seeds were planted several hundred chapters ago and was continually reinforced until it happened.

Kaido's very introduction setup the theme of his impending death.

Not really sure how you can straight face say that it's a dumb argument to use Oda's track record to reach the conclusion that it's highly unlikely that he will kill off Kaido.

The Oda's track record arguments are overstated. Oda doesn't subvert his story to throw curve balls.

Ace's death was shocking, but it was just that. It wasn't a subversion of the story or a contradiction of what was previously established. Oda had always planned for Ace to die and followed through with his plans. He just made it come as a surprise.

Kaido surviving despite how it has been repeatedly stated that the battle is not over until he's dead would be a contradiction of the story. A subversion like that has not been done before. Oda doesn't actually have the track record you're claiming here.

 

[zzShinichi]

Is it really our fault for believing in ZKK when it's Oda himself who's been giving hints of his death? Like shit the first moment of Kaidou's introduction is about him wanting to die. Death has been the concurent idea throughout Wano. Is it really wrong to think that Kaidou might die? The "oh because it never happened so It won't happen" is bullshit anyway. I bet most of you guys didn't think Oda was gonna drop both Ace and WB in the same fucknig arc when he had never killed ANYONE outside of flashback before.
And fuck off with the "oh no no Villians can't achieve their dream". It's only if that dream directly and negatively affects the good guy. Kaidou's death would only bring peace and prosper to the entire world.

 

[Garp the Fist]

Homestly all you need to to is read the narration for Kaido’s first chapter to know he was going to die. From there on out, there was only two paths for his character
-death
-a newfound appreciation for the miracle of life

And that second option was never really likely, and has became increasingly, increasingly less so as we actually got to know Kaido.

Imprisonment isn’t going to happen. That’s nothing new to Kaido, then nothing is happening to him that hasn’t already happened multiple times before. He’s been caught 18 different times, sentenced to death 40 times. Capture is only a temporary solution. If Luffy defeats Kaido and then he’s imprisoned, then that is no different from any of the seven other times he’s been defeated as a pirate.

That’s Kaido’s “only rule of this world.” That needs to be broken, where the strong (Kaido) can die, while the weak (Momo, I’d guess? People of Onigashima? Even Luffy and co, given what Kaido did to him last chapter) survive.

Regardless of whether it’s Zoro that does it or someone else that does the deed, Kaido’s death is written into the series. Same as Whitebeard’s was.