Versus Battle Kanki vs Karin

[kom5]

I agree Kanki is very impressive. His all-or-nothing gambits are why he takes much fewer losses than others. In which case his victories are more impressive.

I just think there aren't things that he could exploit against Ousen, Kanki and Renpa. Same with a few others like Tou and Totanwa. We don't have much on Karin that's why I say that I won't be surprised if Kanki wins. It's just that hype built around her and her stats that I say I would bet on Karin.

İn a direct battle Ousen wouldn't prob fall for his traps that's true
But I love Kanki he is doing the impossible let's hope he won't steal everyone the show

I have also the feeling Karin is top class her stats too in the battle amongst the church generals in the coalition war she was the most impressive one or smartest one if she would figure Kankis trap ignore it Kanki would lose

Karin has brother
Do you know what I mean..

They look alike and have the same eyes also the cruelty and stand is the same somehow

 

[Ninjashadow0209]

For now i see Kanki winning.

Because of his Army and his unexpected strategies who effected his opponents mind.

 

[God Buggy]

Bump. @Fleet Admiral Lee Hung @TheKnightOfTheSea @Jailer etc

As I had previously written, I think this would pretty interesting. My thoughts a bit more in depth :

Kanki has been placed on the level Qin Six generals various times and received a great amount of recognition in verse. His warfare methods can be very unorthodox and Ousen said that Kanki's thoughts escape even him. His warfare eliminated outstanding strategists like Genpo and defeated Kochou through methods like infilitrations, "taking the head" and "insane" actions (like his plan to take out Kochou, ending his enormous army as well). He did some of those during the Coalition War as well, as well breaking Gohoumei's siege tower strategy immediately. He got the better of a general like Keisha as well. Keisha, as talented as he was, was the one to end up dancing in the palm of Kanki. Kanki has made effective use of psycological warfare as well.

Now we'll have to see what Hara will do with this battle against Riboku but Kanki will shine and showcase his stuff, no doubts. The mf looks ready to fuck shit up.

Kanki has weakness that Keisha knew and Riboku knows. Keisha got outplayed anyway, I'm sure Riboku will make a better use of it.

For what concerns Karin, she was called "A genius at warfare" by Shunshinkun and "The real deal" by Riboku. That's very impressive hype as well.
She has been presented as an outstanding strategist/tactician who, while going against a general as a good as Tou, formulated a plan to take Kankoku Pass through a very effective use of deception, which would have been a deadly hit had Ousen himself (who had already effectively taken care of Ordo) not come in clutch to stop it.
She should be an hell of a fighter, martially.

We have not seen all of Kanki but we have seen even less of Karin lol.

Coming to the battle (150k, with equalized forces).

I do think though that :

- Kanki's own "taking the head" methods might have an harder time working on her.

- I very much think she'd be able to eventually figure out Kanki's weakness.

- As I said, Kanki's mind is dangerous but hers is dangerous as well (both can inflict damage and hits on each other's army and counter moves) and if she's that strong of a warrior, she could have the option to also employ powerful offensive charges with his men, Ouki style.

Now again, it's completely possible that after having seen eveything both have to offer and all of their feats, Kanki will be the man to pick. I'm ready to see what he does against Riboku and

Spoiler

I think Shin?

in the future.

But as of today, I'm personally leaning towards Karin, extreme diff.

 

[Elder Lee Hung]

Doesn’t Karin have an army of 300,000 men loyal specifically to her? That’s fucking nuts lol. Even Ouki and Renpa only had like 20,000 troops loyal to them. No idea how Karin amassed such a huge army to her name, I’d like to learn more on that.

I never understood why some online doubt Karin. She basically took control over the entire Coalition army after day 1, and she did this just with sheer brains. She was like “tf are these idiots doing? No, I’m in charge now”

What Karin did there would have been like if one of the Qin generals just decided that they were in charge of Qin’s army, and then laid out a very simple yet brilliant plan so efficiently that Shouheikun was like “it’s fine, we’ll go with that plan” lol. I feel like what Karin did there doesn’t get talked about enough. She’s also the leader of the entire Chu military now so there’s that.

Okay so stats. Normally I don’t like Kingdom stats but we know so little of Karin that I’m fine with it:

Karin:
94 Strength
94 Leadership (how is her leadership this low with 300k men loyal to her)
98 Intelligence

Kanki
93 Strength
95 Leadership
96 Intelligence

So by stats Karin wins. Her intelligence is even higher than people like Renpa so she’s surely one of the most intelligent in Kingdom atm, smarter than Kochou who was unable to decipher Kanki’s tactic before it was too late for him. But honestly even Ousen didn’t figure that tactic out until it was too late so who knows. Kanki is lethal bro.

But yeah I think Karin has the portrayal edge right now, she is Chu’s Shouheikun which is greater hype than being one of the 6GG I think.

 

[God Buggy]

Bump. @Elder Lee Hung @FutureWarrior123 @Xione @Jailer @Owl Ki @Shanks

This thread was made quite some time ago. We've been witnessing the Riboku vs Kanki war, which is now on its very ending phase. Kanki has given back his Qin Six ornamnet and his death might well be where this is heading.

Spoiler: Unless

...Hara wants to have Kanki vs Shin in the future, in this case Kanki won't obviously die here.

So now we have the showing Kanki gave here too, all the new stuff.

Regarding Karin, nothing has changed, nothing new has been added, it hasn't been her time.

My view on who I'd give the W to is still the same (Karin). Kanki showed yet again in this arc that he's a monster - and Riboku had never came that close to being outright slain, despite everything he had prepared - but, in this matchup, I believe Karin would take it.

 

[Elder Lee Hung]

Bump. @Elder Lee Hung @FutureWarrior123 @Xione @Jailer @Owl Ki @Shanks

This thread was made quite some time ago. We've been witnessing the Riboku vs Kanki war, which is now on its very ending phase. Kanki has given back his Qin Six ornamnet and his death might well be where this is heading.

Spoiler: Unless

...Hara wants to have Kanki vs Shin in the future, in this case Kanki won't obviously die here.

So now we have the showing Kanki gave here too, all the new stuff.

Regarding Karin, nothing has changed, nothing new has been added, it hasn't been her time.

My view on who I'd give the W to is still the same (Karin). Kanki showed yet again in this arc that he's a monster - and Riboku had never came that close to being outright slain, despite everything he had prepared - but, in this matchup, I believe Karin would take it.

Karin seems like she is more of a traditional tactician and traditional tacticians can struggle against Kanki. Kind of tough to say who would win this, but I think Kanki would need Zenou to slay Karin in a duel, he probably doesn’t have anyone else who can take her.

 

[Yo Tan Wa]

I believe Karin would take it.

I think i agree

Post automatically merged: Feb 19, 2023

Karin is an opponent that doesn't care much about anything beside winning so can't think of what Kanki can play arround Karin with. In head up battle like happened with Riboku i see a similar end to battle, ie Karin winning.

 

[Elder Lee Hung]

In any case, I doubt his psychological warfare would have substantial effects on Karin.

It depends, if Kanki is in a position to threaten Chu Civilians then I don’t think Karin would just sit back and allow him to kill Chu’s people and burn their cities.

If we look at the tactics Kanki was using against Kaishibou, hiding in the terrain and torturing Kaishibou’s prisoners, this tactic didn’t necessarily have an effect on Kaishibou himself but it had an a huge effect on Kaishibou’s men who’s morale plummeted. And I’m not sure we’ve ever met a Great General in this manga who could undo those effects on their men’s morale short of finding and killing Kanki himself, which is the whole challenge lol. When Kanki vanishes, he vanishes and not even Riboku can find him.

Karin seems a monster in close quarters too, look at her build and the freaking mace Moubu/Kanmei style lol - it's very possible that it ends in failure.

It also depends, I think strength stats are largely irrelevant in mass melees. Strength stats can decide entire wars in scenarios like Ouki vs Houken or Duke Hyou vs Gokei where the enemy troops observe their generals dueling rather than interfering.

But Kanki doesn’t play this shit lol, when Kanki finds the enemy generals, he just has his men swarm them until they die. Kochou for example had a 93 strength stat, close to Karin’s 94, and Kochou still fell to the Shuma fairly quickly. Again I hate using stats but we have no feats for Karin, and I think swarm strategies will kill any General unless that General can escape (maybe Houken could survive a swarm strategy). So if Kanki swarms Karin I imagine she wouldn’t survive for very long. The question is if he can maneuver her into a situation where he can swarm her to begin with, and Riboku and Kochou both fell for this so I’m just not sure. Kanki really could win this.

 

[God Buggy]

It also depends, I think strength stats are largely irrelevant in mass melees. Strength stats can decide entire wars in scenarios like Ouki vs Houken or Duke Hyou vs Gokei where the enemy troops observe their generals dueling rather than interfering.

But Kanki doesn’t play this shit lol, when Kanki finds the enemy generals, he just has his men swarm them until they die. Kochou for example had a 93 strength stat, close to Karin’s 94, and Kochou still fell to the Shuma fairly quickly. Again I hate using stats but we have no feats for Karin, and I think swarm strategies will kill any General unless that General can escape (maybe Houken could survive a swarm strategy). So if Kanki swarms Karin I imagine she wouldn’t survive for very long. The question is if he can maneuver her into a situation where he can swarm her to begin with, and Riboku and Kochou both fell for this so I’m just not sure. Kanki really could win this.

Oh yeah anyone is going down in that case lool. Against the mass of soldiers, Houken would probably be the one to hold out the most.

 

[Red Admiral]

Big Breast Strong Monster

look at the title man, and we say Oda is horny af
but honestly, being a woman at the top of a man's game take more than what most might believe
it's not that her underlings are fine with her being around, they are fucking shitless in front of her
Karin is more scary than Kanki if you ask me.
Kanki can use the elemnt of fear a lot to win most of his battels
but Karin underlings are surely more afraid of her than Kanki or anyone
this alone make her a very effective counter to Kanki cause one of his main tactics are very ineffective in front of her

and not to mention Karin is smarter and stronger
her plans were only got beaten thanks to Ousen and I think without him, she was the real winner of the war

Kanki can't match her in making plans
Kanki can't beat her in 1 Vs 1
Kanki can't use fear tactic to ease his way to win


and I won't say these cause I definitely want to hit that
even if it cost me a lot :)

 

[Phoenix]

Well, I had a view of this battle before and nothing has changed in the details per se, but I believe I will give Kanki the benefit of the doubt this time.

Karin is pretty overconfident and likes making big moves which would backfire against Kanki, I think Kanki takes it 6/10 times

 

[Rumble]

In my estimation, Ka Rin is the greater raw intellect, but Kan Ki is a shade more cunning - he has the psychological edge even against her, albeit by only so much.

The challenge I have in assessing a showdown between these two is that we already know the Ka Rin Army is extremely powerful, and it appears she's added quite a few powerful swords to her collection.

Kan Ki would need to be kitted out with some additional armies to make this a fair fight, and terrain would be hugely important.

 

[MarineHQ]

In my estimation, Ka Rin is the greater raw intellect, but Kan Ki is a shade more cunning - he has the psychological edge even against her, albeit by only so much.

The challenge I have in assessing a showdown between these two is that we already know the Ka Rin Army is extremely powerful, and it appears she's added quite a few powerful swords to her collection.

Kan Ki would need to be kitted out with some additional armies to make this a fair fight, and terrain would be hugely important.

I believe the Kanki army was pretty busted as they were tbh, in raw strength at least ignoring the Zenou clan, but yeah, Karin's army isn't weak either.

Karin is well equipped battling his unorthodox methods but unlike Kanki she's well trained in traditional warfare and can incorporate it in her unorthodox style to be even more unpredictable than Kanki.

Having even outplayed Tou and sneaking an entire army past the Qin must be a Top 10 most underrated Kingdom feats.

 

[God Buggy]

Having even outplayed Tou and sneaking an entire army past the Qin must be a Top 10 most underrated Kingdom feats.

That was so impressive. She had even Tou fooled like you said.

Also, Riboku's reaction:

Spoiler

Even Kanki was like: "Ayo man, this shit is bad for real".

Spoiler

 

[Rumble]

Having even outplayed Tou and sneaking an entire army past the Qin must be a Top 10 most underrated Kingdom feats.

That was so impressive. She had even Tou fooled like you said.

Ka Rin proved herself to be a serious threat, but I don't think she got the better of Tou in her performance against him.

Remember, Tou had only 30,000 men under his command at the beginning of the battle, which was 90K Qin divided between himself and Mou Bu vs 150K Chu divided evenly across three armies.

Tou first defeated the 50K Rin Bu Kun Army, whose remnants then became fodder for a fresh 50K Ka Rin Army to set the stage. She had the element of surprise, fresher troops, and by the time she made her move to crush Tou, he had under 20K men in his command to take on three times the number.

All things considered, I don't think she made the fool of Tou or outplayed him. That she possessed the means to hide a 5K unit says it all in terms of army size discrepancies.

 

[Xione]

Big Sis > Lil Bro, easy work.

 

[SakazOuki]

Their raw talent should more or less be equal, and a fight like this can go either way.
However Karin being as arrogant as she is puts her at a disadvantage against Kanki, the brigand should win more times than not.

 

[Xlaw]

She has brother right ?

 

[Seraphim Croc]

Imo, kanki is a level above Karin.

If we swap the two generals position, then I can see kanki replicating the same level of "success" Karin had in the coalition.
Using feints to sneak behind kankoku pass.

But I can't see karin pressing riboku to the level kanki did in the northern zhao invasion, with a third of Riboku's army nonetheless and right in the middle of Riboku's territory. Yet kanki nearly defeated riboku and lost with extreme difficulty.

Karin is impressive but not to Kanki/Ousen/Riboku's level.

 

[MUUGEN]

Kanki, did we all just not read the same manga where he gave Riboku the hardest battle of his life, dude was hanging by a thread when all odds were in his favor.

Kanki shits on any other general tbh

the fact that people blame kanki for heki are annoying cause hekis downfall was his own doing.