Rules Kingdom General Discussion

Yeah Heki will end up like Choutou.

Something of historical spoiler talk;
i actually think the panel of heki/rokuomi being the 2 generals that Hara showed us, when the Q6th member was being discussed, was quite telling. If Tou is to retire, I see Rokuomi going solo and it will be he + Heki will grow old and in the shadow of the new Q6. Both with different perspectives of Shin and co (Heki with pride, Rokuomi with spite, but both with envy).
 
Not sure where to post this but will post it here ^^. Apparently English Scans have referred to Ai Sen as a ‘he’ but the reality is that Ai Sen’s gender has never been specified in the manga & Hara is still yet to confirm this. This topic of Ai Sen’s gender is apparently a hot topic of debate in the Japanese community.

Not taking jabs at the scans btw. They are doing a fantastic job. Just thought I should share this.
 

Fleet Admiral Lee Hung

Conqueror of the Stars
@Shanks okay bro, I Fucking called it. I called this shit so fucking hard:

Chapter 724 was straight up the most severe miscalculation that Riboku has made in his entire military career. I actually ended up rereading Riboku’s logic several times because even without the benefit of having my knowledge as a reader, I think I would’ve questioned Riboku’s logic here.

Riboku’s logic was “Kanki has achieved all of his victories through Un-traditional strategies, therefore his weakness is traditional warfare.” Okay, that’s fine, I can agree with that, but then Riboku says “because Kanki didn’t pincer Keisha at KokuYou Hills, this means Kanki straight up does not know formal strategy.” Okay, so:
-We as the readers know that this logic is wrong. Kanki knew he should have pincered Keisha, but simply decided not to.
-Even if we didn’t know that, this is almost an elementary logical fuckup from Riboku. I understand that it’s hard for Riboku to reverse engineer someone’s tactics without even knowing what they look like, but like..this was such a severe leap in logic that I actually thought it might straight up cost Riboku this battle (though as of 727, this does not seem to be the case, Kanki is likely finished here).

Like I said, I actually reread Riboku’s reasoning here multiple times because I was so in shock that a character who thus far I thought has shown pretty flawless logic, to make such a glaring error in his calculations. And like I said I literally thought Riboku may lose this battle when I read that. But anyway, onto other things:
First Riboku horribly and glaringly misunderstood Kanki’s character in 724, and now when it comes to this Hika situation, Riboku once again glaringly misunderstands Kanki.

Riboku’s logic of “Kanki is attacking Hika out of severe desperation to cause carnage before he dies,” again Riboku makes very bizarre assumptions that result in the situation we see in 741 with Kanki triple-pondering Riboku’s HQ.

Man…Hara really is a genius. He planted the seeds of Riboku very severely misunderstanding Kanki back in 724 and now we are seeing the result of those seeds: that Riboku’s own current desperate situation is resulting from his severe logical mis-steps.

And now, Hara is even foreshadowing that Kanki’s actions in Northern Zhao are ultimately what will cause the Zhao court to question his leadership and ability as a General???

Man…even when Riboku “wins” here…is it truly a victory??? Lol
 
@Fleet Admiral Lee Hung
Since I was discussing with @FW123 about this, I'll put my thoughts here too.
So, in 741:




So the points are:

- At this stage, considering how problematic currently is the situation for Zhao as a whole, Riboku knows that he has to avoid barbarisms being done. And Kanki knows that Riboku knows...and anticipates that this will cast a cloud on Riboku's judgment.

- Riboku admits of having being foolish in regards of Hika - that it could be taken or, at least, that it could have been taken before the Zhao army arrives.

- He also had a "drastic misunderstanding" about Kanki's goal and, trapped in it, he lost his composure and Kanki saw through him. And thus Riboku fell for Kanki's standard play.

Kanki used his brutal history record and the current state of Zhao's overall situation and had Riboku - who was instead worried by Kanki brutalizing his citizens - fall into his classical trap. Damn, Kanki lol.

That being said, there is also a situational aspect here. The civilians and, worse, the current situation of Zhao (that also relates to them).
Make no mistake, it's Kanki's credit that he employed this perfectly. But I just wanted to say that when civilians aren't into the equation, Kanki loses something he could possibly use. He's a monster anyway make absolutely no mistake, see all the incredible feats and victories he had without him using them inside his tactics. But yeah.
 
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@Fleet Admiral Lee Hung
Since I was discussing with @FW123
Kanki used his brutal history record and the current state of Zhao's overall situation and had Riboku - who was instead worried by Kanki brutalizing his citizens - fall into his classical trap. Damn, Kanki lol.
that's why he is the goaaaaaaaaat
:finally:


last page of 701 it said kanki and rbk will clash while putting thier lifes on line
this is only in arabic scans not english


 
If Kanki, someone with less overall hype than Ousen, who has less relevance to the plot, managed to do something like this
Imagine the Ousen greatness we are about to witness soon
:steef:
Imagine the heated discussions and rejection at those moments from Riboku stans coz its them who hates Ousen to the core. Lol

The way Ousen treated Riboku in the central battlefield already fused there brain.
 
Imagine the heated discussions and rejection at those moments from Riboku stans coz its them who hates Ousen to the core. Lol

The way Ousen treated Riboku in the central battlefield already fused there brain.
Riboku is still an extremely capable general but people overestimated his effectiveness as a general way too much.
I don’t understand why they deny Riboku’s words of him losing to old Renpa for example, that’s clear portrayal. The reason Riboku is such a dangerous man is his ability to think into the future and build grand strategies. For example, targeting Ouki, the coalition army, north Zhao plan etc, along with his devious charisma and top tier tactics.
In that regard he’s the most complete military man.

He is basically a mix of Ryofui + SHK + Gokei, but never the best in any category.
His pokemons kinda undermined him too but let’s not go there lol
 
Riboku is still an extremely capable general but people overestimated his effectiveness as a general way too much.
I don’t understand why they deny Riboku’s words of him losing to old Renpa for example, that’s clear portrayal. The reason Riboku is such a dangerous man is his ability to think into the future and build grand strategies. For example, targeting Ouki, the coalition army, north Zhao plan etc, along with his devious charisma and top tier tactics.
In that regard he’s the most complete military man.

He is basically a mix of Ryofui + SHK + Gokei, but never the best in any category.
His pokemons kinda undermined him too but let’s not go there lol
Quite matching to the reality. I've said this before too.

He's the best in devising strategy on board but when it comes to employing them in reality he fails drastically.

The situation of coalitions is the best example where he manages to form the biggest coalition in the history but when it comes to leading it , he fails to win over Qin at any place in northern gate battlefield and that is when coalition was around of the double of Qin army with better generals as well.

I believe his greatest achievement is taking down Gekishin but even there Gekishin destroyed Riboku in the game of tactics but Houken made the difference and saved the day for Riboku.
 
If Kanki, someone with less overall hype than Ousen, who has less relevance to the plot, managed to do something like this
Imagine the Ousen greatness we are about to witness soon
:steef:
I'm stanning Kanki like the rest of you, he's super badass and a monster but if anything this short battle has reminded us how important matchups are in Kingdom. We can't just tackle it the way we do in One piece.

Also @Shanks. I think you're shitting on Riboku here way to much. Riboku was actually never really hyped for his skills in direct clashes, Renpa was all about that, Riboku is legendary for his preparations and foresight before the battle even starts. The man is so good that he predicted an armies future movement 6 months before it happened and he did it flawlessly!

Another thing. If we're talking Ousen vs Riboku I'd like to remind you of this lol
 
Another thing. If we're talking Ousen vs Riboku I'd like to remind you of this lol
When you consider the astronomical disadvantage Ousen had in both quantity and quality of generals then things start looking differently. Ousen completely outplayed the Zhao right wing, but then Riboku did his stunt.

That stunt has a couple flaws:
-Riboku risked his life in doing so as stated multiple times in the manga, he could've easily been killed right there and then. Makou literally didn't have his glaive on him, if he did then things wouldn't look so good for Riboku
-Riboku's escape from the field was not within his control, but by the work of Kisui, by Riboku's own words.
-From a writing perspective, having someone like Makou stranded in that way is huge bs. This point is mainly for people who downplayed Ousen/Kanki for the some of the plot induced strategies that they pulled. Like please Makou's death in this manner is on the level of 100 unit Shin slaying those generals in Bayou asspull lmao

But yeah the quality of Zhao's generals was insane, and also we can't forget Houken showing up to the party in the end.
On the other hand whatever singular achievements done by Qin's rising stars were orchestrated by Ousen himself

Regardless Ousen came out totally victorious, he did secure Gyou afterall
 

Fleet Admiral Lee Hung

Conqueror of the Stars
Imagine the heated discussions and rejection at those moments from Riboku stans coz its them who hates Ousen to the core. Lol

The way Ousen treated Riboku in the central battlefield already fused there brain.
I’m a huge Riboku stan who loves Ousen lol. Not sure which Riboku fans have ever denied any of Ousen’s feats in the past lol, all we did was point out that Ousen himself stated that Riboku was the superior tactician at Shukai Plains, while also pointing out that had Riboku not been betrayed by his own state, he likely would’ve stopped the Qi reinforcements from reaching Gyou which would’ve ultimately resulted in Qin and Ousen losing the Gyou campaign.
 
Ri Boku out-performed Ou Sen at Shukai Plains.

Taking the entire campaign into consideration, however, while Ri Boku undoubtedly worked under the constraints of a combative court and uncooperative king, the campaign ultimately came down to Ou Sen's excellent decision-making, so I consider it a fair and square win.

Also, apropos of nothing, allow me to quote myself from another thread put the narrative around Kan Ki vs Ko Chou to bed. Kan Ki's defeat of Ko Chou is the #1 feat achieved in the manga thus far, but Kan Ki does not deserve as much credit for it as he is given. Facilitating the success of his schemes ultimately came down to favourable timing and tasking strong allies with impossible tasks that they achieved without his involvement.
In fact, Eikyuu is the most egregious example of Kan Ki getting all the credit for an operation that could not have been achieved without the help of multiple 6GG talents pretty much acting independently, and even then it came down to the wire, such that it should become clear to audiences, albeit perhaps in hindsight, that Ko Chou wasn't fighting Kan Ki so much as he was racing against the clock in a contest fate had already determined before the Hi Shin Army even arrived.

The Hi Shin Army arrived half a day early, just in time to save Ou Hon's life.

Because of that, they learned what the best point of attack was, and not only that, they inherited the opportunity to complete the pincer A Ka Kin had put into motion.




Because of good timing and strong allies, Eikyuu fell before the Kan Ki Army was completely wiped out, and in taking it, they forced Ko Chou to divert too many soldiers, leaving him vulnerable.






The story demanded Ko Chou's sacrifice and so he fell, but he did not fall only to Kan Ki. Ou Hon and Shin each deserve a far bigger slice of the credit pie than they've been getting from this fanbase.
 
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