Powers & Abilities Luffy's island-size punch shrinked.

[Sentinel]

That wouldn't be necessary because I do not think when one claims that X character's attack is island level or size of an island, they are not talking about a tiny piece of land surrounded by a body of water..... which is what the dictionary definition of an island would cover.

When I asked you to define island size, I meant by One Piece standards.
Obviously, Luffy's fist doesn't exactly have to be as large as Onigashima to be island sized. Marineford is island sized - albeit being a small island - but it is not even as big as the skull. Luffy's fist could easily engulf: Marineford, Cacao Island and several other islands of similar size.

But for one piece, when some claim "island level" it should span several dozen kilometers

Luffy's fist is actually above island level but let's forget that - it's useless to even start this debate in the first place - it is already island sized due to the fact that the fist was comparable to the skull at least, or even bigger. The skull already spans several kilometers; it has a massive mountain range of each mountain being 400 - 500m in size (numbers + door + mountain scaling). The rooftop basically has its own landscape worth of mountains... Then we have Yamato's statement of Luffy's punch being able to punch through the island itself due to its massive size.
I don't know what you're starting to do with this kind of information but the manga basically showed us that the fist is meant - both in feat and statement - to be comparable to the island. A few inconsistent drawings do not change this fact.

Kaido regenning has happened throughout the raid, whether it be visibly through the scabbards and Zoro's wounds closing instantaneously, or Luffy saying that his internal destruction damage is too shallow to do lasting damage to Kaido.

Yamato implied that Kaido's slowly losing his power to keep his fire clouds, indicating that he's weakening. There's no regeneration of ACoC attacks.

Luffy merely stated his ACoA attacks were too shallow, which wasn't the issue with his CoC Power-Up.

Luffy recovered FROM DEATH due to his mythical Zoan awakening, and has taken multiple powerful blows since, you are for some reason assuming Kaido's HP bar has remained static while Luffy recovered from a worse injury???

Except I never assumed this part.
But since you're mentioning this one, we literally have a panel of G5 Luffy recovering very quickly. How does it help your case?

Kaido was panting in consecutive panels and going all out in his swole mode (aside from trump card non physical fire attack he is using now).

Again, it does not help your point. You are just proving that Kaido was weakening prior to this attack.
Also, Kaido was panting in few panels but kept on tanking more hits. If he takes the God fist as well, you can forget the idea of another OKG knocking him out.

G4 is susceptible to having air knocked out, and Luffy was in a worse condition having just been blasted to shit from a boro breath point blank.

Let's not act like Kaido wasn't tanking a whole barrage of Snake Man's Hydra prior to tanking OKG lol.
Again, one attack knocked Kaido to the ground whilst quickly recovering and counterattacking Luffy - who was speedblitzed! - meanwhile, the other attack nearly knocked Luffy out AGAIN.

Luffy had the belief that his second blow HAD A CHANCE.

Do you really believe the MC's beliefs are relevant here when he didn't nearly push Kaido to his absolute limits like G5?

Luffy came into this final 1vs1 much more nerfed than Kaido, and still pushed him to that extent.

One had a whole gauntlet without going down, another one got knocked out a lot and had some breaks while Kaido couldn't take a break since fighting Yamato (and carrying the island)...

 

[Tyki_Mikk]

OKG wouldn't do any shit, even if it land, Kaido would tank it and Luffy would lose G4 and Lose the battle. It was clearly that Drunken Kaido is above G4 Boundman/Snakeman.

 

[Geo]

When I asked you to define island size, I meant by One Piece standards.
Obviously, Luffy's fist doesn't exactly have to be as large as Onigashima to be island sized. Marineford is island sized - albeit being a small island - but it is not even as big as the skull. Luffy's fist could easily engulf: Marineford, Cacao Island and several other islands of similar size.

I disagree. I don't think Luffy's fist is the size of Marineford.
We can scale Kaido's size from the horns of the skull and Kaido who is larger than Luffy's fist wouldn't be the size of MF

Luffy's fist is actually above island level but let's forget that - it's useless to even start this debate in the first place - it is already island sized due to the fact that the fist was comparable to the skull at least, or even bigger. The skull already spans several kilometers; it has a massive mountain range of each mountain being 400 - 500m in size (numbers + door + mountain scaling). The rooftop basically has its own landscape worth of mountains... Then we have Yamato's statement of Luffy's punch being able to punch through the island itself due to its massive size.
I don't know what you're starting to do with this kind of information but the manga basically showed us that the fist is meant - both in feat and statement - to be comparable to the island. A few inconsistent drawings do not change this fact.

But the inconsistene in Oda's drawings is what is causing the argument.

However, we see that Luffy's fist is the size of the head of Kaido's new form. The size of that head =\= size of Onigashima skull. So the fist can't be the size of the the skull in the first place from the above.
It is quite similar to the scalings of Law's attack

 

[Sentinel]

I disagree. I don't think Luffy's fist is the size of Marineford.
We can scale Kaido's size from the horns of the skull and Kaido who is larger than Luffy's fist wouldn't be the size of MF

Marineford is at best 1 to 2km... The skull is more than double its size.
Kaido's head is bigger than the part of the horn which was burned - especially since his mouth is wide open - and we also have dozens of panels where the fist is actually more comparable to the skull as well, even larger than the head. There are even panels of the fist being larger than Kaido's head.

But the inconsistene in Oda's drawings is what is causing the argument.

No, it merely confuses those pointing too much towards the inconsistencies in terms of size scaling in One Piece (weirdly, some people use characters to scale larger objects lol).

However, we see that Luffy's fist is the size of the head of Kaido's new form.

We have three panels:

VS

VS

In two of these three panels - the first and third panel - the fist is drawn to be larger than the head and other stuff are issues of perspectives and angles.
The next chapter will confirm even further whether this panel, which you meant, is the more consistent and solid one or the other ones.

It is quite similar to the scalings of Law's attack

Where is the issue with Law's attack tho?

 

[Ryuarashi]

Did it ?

Help yourself, reread the chapter

 

[Geo]

Marineford is at best 1 to 2km... The skull is more than double its size.
Kaido's head is bigger than the part of the horn which was burned - especially since his mouth is wide open - and we also have dozens of panels where the fist is actually more comparable to the skull as well, even larger than the head. There are even panels of the fist being larger than Kaido's head.

Really? 1km is the size of Pica IIRC so that's doubtful but I'm not sure.

My point was more that Kaido's tail is shown to be the similar I'm size to the horn. His head isn't substantially larger than his tail as Onigashima's skull is bigger than the horn. Roughly, Onigashima skull is 10x bigger than the horn ...maybe more.

No, it merely confuses those pointing too much towards the inconsistencies in terms of size scaling in One Piece (weirdly, some people use characters to scale larger objects lol).

But what if the inconsistency is coming from the panels which make the punch look that big. Frankly, you may be right but with how Oda has been with sizes, I think it is unlikely. Maybe future chapters will change.

We have three panels:

Yes that is what the point is based on that there are inconsistencies on which is the accurate scaling.

Even looking at the panels, the most Luffy's fist will be bigger than Kaido's head is 3x and that is giving a lot of latitude.
But looking at that, would you say that Onigashima skull is 3x larger than Kaido's head?

Where is the issue with Law's attack tho?

I meant the different scalings about Law's attack when it was first shown with some claiming that the diameter was larger than Onigashima.

 

[ShishioIsBack]

The fist is around 16km lol.Thats more than just baseline Islandsize

More like 5 Kms tops.

Its smaller than Onigashima skill
Kaidos width is same as Onigashima skill
At best Kaidos head is 4 times its width

 

[Finalbeta]

Did my boy Kaido turn bigger under that mode? 🤔

 

[Law-sama]

Kaido also shrink from his first appearance

 

[WesMidnight]

Yamato implied that Kaido's slowly losing his power to keep his fire clouds, indicating that he's weakening. There's no regeneration of ACoC attacks.

Luffy merely stated his ACoA attacks were too shallow, which wasn't the issue with his CoC Power-Up.

She said he was "starting to show signs" of fatigue, she also said Luffy was barely standing before coming for his final 1vs1, very much more nerfed.

Kaido closed Zoro's adv CoC scar almost instantly. Luffy has gotten up and is back alive, partially regenerated after taking tremendous damage from Kaido's adv CoC damage.

Except I never assumed this part.
But since you're mentioning this one, we literally have a panel of G5 Luffy recovering very quickly. How does it help your case?

Because this is about Kaido's HP prior to the second OKG compared to his current HP and that he has recovered substantially.

Again, it does not help your point. You are just proving that Kaido was weakening prior to this attack.
Also, Kaido was panting in few panels but kept on tanking more hits. If he takes the God fist as well, you can forget the idea of another OKG knocking him out.

He is nullifying large portions of this fist using his avatar form, so no he isn't tanking it in the same way he would have had to have tanked that second OKG, and he is currently less "near KO" in terms of momentary physical state than he was prior to that second OKG.

Let's not act like Kaido wasn't tanking a whole barrage of Snake Man's Hydra prior to tanking OKG lol.
Again, one attack knocked Kaido to the ground whilst quickly recovering and counterattacking Luffy - who was speedblitzed! - meanwhile, the other attack nearly knocked Luffy out AGAIN.

OKG is a potent final finisher in boundman, so not only a higher tier attack but in a more potent offense form.
Hydra is a gattling attack that Kaido was forced to dodge rather than tank because it was fucking his shit up badly, nice selective memory

Do you really believe the MC's beliefs are relevant here when he didn't nearly push Kaido to his absolute limits like G5?

Yes, Luffy has great CoO, great combat expertise and instincts, knew when his attacks were and weren't doing damage, and Kaido agreed that Luffy was pushing him extremely hard- and was huffing more at the end of that fight than he is now. G5 Has mainly been used for spectacle and defense, rather than offense, because Luffy is not used to it.

One had a whole gauntlet without going down, another one got knocked out a lot and had some breaks while Kaido couldn't take a break since fighting Yamato (and carrying the island)...

One fought a yonko with adv CoC, without adv CoC defense, taking blows to the point of unconsciousness... forced himself conscious... burned his haki down to nothing and to the point of unconsciousness due to inexperience and "sloppy" adv CoC usage. One fought a few non adv CoC users who couldn't penetrate his defense, while benefiting from regen.

Getting knocked unconscious is not a "rest" and pre awakening he didn't have zoan level recovery feature that Kaido does.

 

[timey42]

BASE LUFFY PUNCH = ZOLO STRONGEST ATTAXK

 

[Finalbeta]

BASE LUFFY PUNCH = ZOLO STRONGEST ATTAXK

What do you mean by Base?

 

[Loki D. Terror]

--Bare minimum its comparable to horn ; Kaido's susanoo mode's tail end is comparable to the horn size just like his head is comparable to the fist.

--It can be bigger but not onigashima sized imo but 30 to 40% of it
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I said this before. It's ~ 15x Elephant Gun sized. It might break an island, but it's not island sized.

Lol you brain dead ; luffy's elephant gun is size of kaido's head ( smaller than that) where flame mode kaido's head size >>>> Real dragon size

The size difference is gigantic