General & Others Oda needs to learn from Togashi on how to handle power ups and fights.

Does HxH and Naruto handle power systems and fights better than One Piece


  • Total voters
    48
#1
It's funny to me that you can pick any shounen battle manga and compare it to One Piece and the execution in fights are clearly better handled. Oda created a battle shounen with over 1000+ chapters and still doesn't know how to handle fights instead it has gotten worse throughout the years. For someone who claimed that he doesn't like drawing fights, he sure does draw fights a lot.
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First thing Oda needs to learn is how to have a legitimate reason for your main character to defeat the main antagonist of your story. Here you see Togashi creating the cause of defeating Pitou due to Kite's death. Or Kurapika defeating Uvogin due to the spiders destroying Kurapika's village. Why again does Kaido need to be defeated? No one knows yet because Oda refuses to tell us.


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Next step of writing shounen 101 is that when you spend over 30 chapters on your main character training, you would expect that the training will pay off. You see how one event follows the other in HxH i.e Gon and Kurapika trained in Zetsu, Nen, etc which were crucial in defeating their opponents. You see how they used the power systems that they trained in to defeat their opponents? No bullshit power ups that have nothing to do with what they trained in? Whereas in One Piece Luffy trains for 30 chapters and then gets two new power ups that have nothing to do with the training. Drawing shounen fights isn't rocket science. When you write a training arc, make sure you don't waste the reader's time.


 
#2
I dont think he needs to learn how to handle PU, even Naruto had shitty PU's.

The problem with One Piece regarding PS, is that it has been 1000+ chapters and we are still discovering how things work. Oda didnt have solid bases of his power system since the begining.

This can be seen good and bad, since it keeps up the hype for new discoveries and bad since he can still leave things without explaining so us the users wont understand a bit.

For example, what is Haki lol, from where does it come from? Unlike Nen or chakra, we know from where it comes and what can make it stronger and this is since the begining. The author made their characters explain in detail everything so we could understand, yet in One Piece, most times are vague.
 
#3
I'd agree with this honestly. In HxH, there are only 3 ways to get stronger:
  • training
  • ingenuity
  • sacrifice
You can't just magically jump tiers because you will it. The only time Gon defeated someone massively stronger than himself was when he basically sacrificed his life to do so.

Luffy on the other hand can just jump leaps and bounds in terms of strength just because he wishes to. Gets KO'd by kaido, now he has ACoC, gets KO'd again, now he is a sky splitter, gets KO'd for the third time, now he has awakening. When will the insanity end?
Post automatically merged:

Imagine if the chimera ant arc ended with Gon 1v1ing Meruem by perpetually getting defeated and magically unlocking new advanced nen techniques each time this happens.
 
#4
I'd agree with this honestly. In HxH, there are only 3 ways to get stronger:
  • training
  • ingenuity
  • sacrifice
You can't just magically jump tiers because you will it. The only time Gon defeated someone massively stronger than himself was when he basically sacrificed his life to do so.

Luffy on the other hand can just jump leaps and bounds in terms of strength just because he wishes to. Gets KO'd by kaido, now he has ACoC, gets KO'd again, now he is a sky splitter, gets KO'd for the third time, now he has awakening. When will the insanity end?
Haki blooms in hard fights lol.

But being honest, it aint that bad. It could had been taken much better, but Luffy already had conquer, he just needed to learn how to imbue his attacks with it, and his advanced armament haki training was the hint for it, so being able to do it is not bad.

And his awakening... well we havent seen any other character awaken it midst a battle so we dont know what can be unlocked once having it.

The only bad thing IMO is, not being defeated in these 3 or 4 times and coming with almost 100% HP again when his fight with Doflamingo or Katakuri took days to recover, but I guess it was because he wanted to rest then.
 
#8
I'd agree with this honestly. In HxH, there are only 3 ways to get stronger:
  • training
  • ingenuity
  • sacrifice
You can't just magically jump tiers because you will it. The only time Gon defeated someone massively stronger than himself was when he basically sacrificed his life to do so.

Luffy on the other hand can just jump leaps and bounds in terms of strength just because he wishes to. Gets KO'd by kaido, now he has ACoC, gets KO'd again, now he is a sky splitter, gets KO'd for the third time, now he has awakening. When will the insanity end?
Post automatically merged:

Imagine if the chimera ant arc ended with Gon 1v1ing Meruem by perpetually getting defeated and magically unlocking new advanced nen techniques each time this happens.
So your example of Luffy "jumping tiers" is getting stronger but still losing to the same guy who beat him 120 chapters ago.

There's no such thing as a tier anyway. Why is Oda obligated to define something you made up?
 
#10
I agree, Togashi fights and PU are godly, the only thing i hate about him was the hiatus, also Gon and Killua acting like they are in a relationship, there should be a rivalry between those two, what Togashi should have done is continue HXH that's all.
 
#11
I'd agree with this honestly. In HxH, there are only 3 ways to get stronger:
  • training
  • ingenuity
  • sacrifice
You can't just magically jump tiers because you will it. The only time Gon defeated someone massively stronger than himself was when he basically sacrificed his life to do so.

Luffy on the other hand can just jump leaps and bounds in terms of strength just because he wishes to. Gets KO'd by kaido, now he has ACoC, gets KO'd again, now he is a sky splitter, gets KO'd for the third time, now he has awakening. When will the insanity end?
Post automatically merged:

Imagine if the chimera ant arc ended with Gon 1v1ing Meruem by perpetually getting defeated and magically unlocking new advanced nen techniques each time this happens.
Yh Gon is the most realistic protagonist and thats why I love him.

- Had zero chance and basically lost against Hanzo.
- Lost against Hisoka
- Sacrificed both his limbs to beat the Bomber
- Lost to Knuckle
- Sacrificed his life, nen and potential to beat Pitou.

Compare that to Luffy who either gets tremendous plot and help or ridiculous PUs, and you can see who the superior MC is. Gon literally gets no help whatsoever, everything he does....he does it himself. And thats why hes a fucking Goat. Him being extremely self destructive and borderline psychopathtic is icing on the cake.
 
#13
Yh Gon is the most realistic protagonist and thats why I love him.

- Had zero chance and basically lost against Hanzo.
- Lost against Hisoka
- Sacrificed both his limbs to beat the Bomber
- Lost to Knuckle
- Sacrificed his life, nen and potential to beat Pitou.

Compare that to Luffy who either gets tremendous plot and help or ridiculous PUs, and you can see who the superior MC is. Gon literally gets no help whatsoever, everything he does....he does it himself. And thats why hes a fucking Goat. Him being extremely self destructive and borderline psychopathtic is icing on the cake.
Fact.

Also his peer can keep up with Gon. e.g. Killua, Kurapika, Hisoka etc. etc.
Gon is not the only one who is special, unlike OP.
 
#14
Yh Gon is the most realistic protagonist and thats why I love him.

- Had zero chance and basically lost against Hanzo.
- Lost against Hisoka
- Sacrificed both his limbs to beat the Bomber
- Lost to Knuckle
- Sacrificed his life, nen and potential to beat Pitou.

Compare that to Luffy who either gets tremendous plot and help or ridiculous PUs, and you can see who the superior MC is. Gon literally gets no help whatsoever, everything he does....he does it himself. And thats why hes a fucking Goat. Him being extremely self destructive and borderline psychopathtic is icing on the cake.
So he's good because he loses and doesn't run it back, and sacrifices things that he doesn't lose.
 
#15
So he's good because he loses and doesn't run it back, and sacrifices things that he doesn't lose.
Hes good because he doesnt rely on bullshit. His powers come with limations and he finds ways around it instead of skipping PLs. If hes taking an L, Id prefer that then bullshitting a W.

And yes you wont see him running away mid-match, kidnapping Brulee and asking for a timeout.
 
#16
Haki blooms in hard fights lol.
Yet it only blooms for Luffy, sometimes zoro, but never the villain or any characters like Kid or Law who could rival Luffy.

Haki bloom as a concept only exists so that Luffy and the SHs win their fights.
Post automatically merged:

There's no such thing as a tier anyway. Why is Oda obligated to define something you made up?
wtf are you talking about, Kaido literally neg diffed Luffy in act 1 and now Luffy is on par with kaido because of Oda spamming BS power ups.
 

Seth

𝐊𝐨𝐤𝐮𝐭𝐨 𝐒𝐡𝐮𝐬𝐮𝐢
#17
It's funny to me that you can pick any shounen battle manga and compare it to One Piece and the execution in fights are clearly better handled. Oda created a battle shounen with over 1000+ chapters and still doesn't know how to handle fights instead it has gotten worse throughout the years. For someone who claimed that he doesn't like drawing fights, he sure does draw fights a lot.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First thing Oda needs to learn is how to have a legitimate reason for your main character to defeat the main antagonist of your story. Here you see Togashi creating the cause of defeating Pitou due to Kite's death. Or Kurapika defeating Uvogin due to the spiders destroying Kurapika's village. Why again does Kaido need to be defeated? No one knows yet because Oda refuses to tell us.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Next step of writing shounen 101 is that when you spend over 30 chapters on your main character training, you would expect that the training will pay off. You see how one event follows the other in HxH i.e Gon and Kurapika trained in Zetsu, Nen, etc which were crucial in defeating their opponents. You see how they used the power systems that they trained in to defeat their opponents? No bullshit power ups that have nothing to do with what they trained in? Whereas in One Piece Luffy trains for 30 chapters and then gets two new power ups that have nothing to do with the training. Drawing shounen fights isn't rocket science. When you write a training arc, make sure you don't waste the reader's time.


Last time Oda tried to "learn" from Togashi he did a piss poor Walmart Nen called Haki and it's beyond shit.

You fucking want Oda to write fights on the Togashi level where this **** literally made MC a looney tunes clown?
 
#18
Hes good because he doesnt rely on bullshit. His powers come with limations and he finds ways around it instead of skipping PLs. If hes taking an L, Id prefer that then bullshitting a W.

And yes you wont see him running away mid-match, kidnapping Brulee and asking for a timeout.
So he just wins less often? His pride stops him from playing all his cards?
 
#20
Oda had a perfectly good power system in place with devil fruits, all he had to do was not create haki and we wouldn't have this power escalation problem; fights shifted towards who has the better haki wins and since everyone uses haki in more or less the same way there isn't much room left for uniqueness, it's like in dragon ball where everyone fought the same way more or less and the villain of the week was stronger than last week because he did everything the same just better and haki is like that. Oda could've just stuck to DFs and had characters apply them in unique ways, like adding more dimensions to a shape; everything stays fresh and personalized. But Luffys new gear is definitely a step in the right direction, anything that moves away from bland haki fights and more of what early one piece had the better, besides the whole Mythical Zoan Sun God part......everything else about it is great.
 
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