Chapter Discussion One Piece Chapter 1168: ELBAF'S SNOW
- Thread starter MonsterKaido
- Start date
Hmm, now I am questioning the 8+5 count for the 13 (or honestly have no idea lol)
Went back and looked through Garling's 5(!!!) different intro boxes (wtf lol) and 4 of the 5 times he has a different position in the WG
- 38-40 years ago, Knight of God (in Kuma and Rocks' flashbacks)
** Note that you can see 4 of the 5 Known Gorosei here and we know Saturn has been around for hundreds of years. Keep this thought for later***
- 24 years ago, Commander/Captain of Knights of God (called Dancho in Japanese). Shamrock currently has this position.
- Present Day, Supreme Commander (called Saiko Shireikan in Japanese) of the Knights of God
- Present day, Gorosei
So when you frame it like this, the count starts to get weird.
- We know at least 40 years ago, the current Gorosei exist. So thats 5, right?
- Well, 38 years ago, Garling still neither has the Commander nor Supreme Commander titles. There are 7 revealed Knights in God Valley. But if these positions exist, then it would imply at least 9 God Knights exist.
- 24 years ago, he's promoted as commander and his son becomes a Knight presumably (or at least is one by 15 years ago). This would assume the Commander or Supreme Commander were removed and he went up the ladder. His open Knight position then was taken by Shamrock.
- 14 years ago, Shanks, then Harald are offered a knight position. To this point I would assume Garling was promoted again to Supreme Commander and his son Commander, however we dont have any confirmation on this. Harald obviously dies, leaving a vacant position.
- Now to present day, both Gunko and Killingham are Knights. Saturn was killed, and Garling is promoted a 3rd time, but we arent sure if he left his commander seat vacant. Worse yet, they offer a Knight Position to Loki lol.
So now just looking at this, unless Oda is killing off character designs he hasn't introduced, the count doesnt work?
- 5 Gorosei (including Garling)
- Shamrock
- Sommers
- Killingham
- Gunko
- Plus the 5 other Knight designs in God Valley.
Thats 14 total....with Loki being offered a position.
Now yes, 1 of the 5 could be dead. Maffey oddly enough looks like she could be Killingham's mother or something, even though their family names are different. But weirder is her the random power she shows. Does she have Kizaru's DF at this time lol?
She shoots a beam at Dragon and the only other things that can do this are Pacifista which literally copy Kizaru's logia powers
Then we have the fact that Loki is offered another open position.
So essentially we have 2 options:
- The 13 include the Gorosei, Maffey died and either the Commander or Supreme Commander didnt exist before Garling. But it makes it weird that Shamrock offered Loki a vacant position then. Yes, Saturn dies, but then this would mean at least 2 of the 5 Knight designs in GV are dead.
- The 13 dont include the Gorosei because every God Knight is still alive and the count goes to at least 14. This makes it easier but sort of contradicts the 13 statements because the Gorosei seem to just have elevated powers to Knights.
Now I dont know anymore lol
Went back and looked through Garling's 5(!!!) different intro boxes (wtf lol) and 4 of the 5 times he has a different position in the WG
- 38-40 years ago, Knight of God (in Kuma and Rocks' flashbacks)
** Note that you can see 4 of the 5 Known Gorosei here and we know Saturn has been around for hundreds of years. Keep this thought for later***
- 24 years ago, Commander/Captain of Knights of God (called Dancho in Japanese). Shamrock currently has this position.
- Present Day, Supreme Commander (called Saiko Shireikan in Japanese) of the Knights of God
- Present day, Gorosei
So when you frame it like this, the count starts to get weird.
- We know at least 40 years ago, the current Gorosei exist. So thats 5, right?
- Well, 38 years ago, Garling still neither has the Commander nor Supreme Commander titles. There are 7 revealed Knights in God Valley. But if these positions exist, then it would imply at least 9 God Knights exist.
- 24 years ago, he's promoted as commander and his son becomes a Knight presumably (or at least is one by 15 years ago). This would assume the Commander or Supreme Commander were removed and he went up the ladder. His open Knight position then was taken by Shamrock.
- 14 years ago, Shanks, then Harald are offered a knight position. To this point I would assume Garling was promoted again to Supreme Commander and his son Commander, however we dont have any confirmation on this. Harald obviously dies, leaving a vacant position.
- Now to present day, both Gunko and Killingham are Knights. Saturn was killed, and Garling is promoted a 3rd time, but we arent sure if he left his commander seat vacant. Worse yet, they offer a Knight Position to Loki lol.
So now just looking at this, unless Oda is killing off character designs he hasn't introduced, the count doesnt work?
- 5 Gorosei (including Garling)
- Shamrock
- Sommers
- Killingham
- Gunko
- Plus the 5 other Knight designs in God Valley.
Thats 14 total....with Loki being offered a position.
Now yes, 1 of the 5 could be dead. Maffey oddly enough looks like she could be Killingham's mother or something, even though their family names are different. But weirder is her the random power she shows. Does she have Kizaru's DF at this time lol?
She shoots a beam at Dragon and the only other things that can do this are Pacifista which literally copy Kizaru's logia powers
Then we have the fact that Loki is offered another open position.
So essentially we have 2 options:
- The 13 include the Gorosei, Maffey died and either the Commander or Supreme Commander didnt exist before Garling. But it makes it weird that Shamrock offered Loki a vacant position then. Yes, Saturn dies, but then this would mean at least 2 of the 5 Knight designs in GV are dead.
- The 13 dont include the Gorosei because every God Knight is still alive and the count goes to at least 14. This makes it easier but sort of contradicts the 13 statements because the Gorosei seem to just have elevated powers to Knights.
Now I dont know anymore lol
Arguably there's an implication here that Harald could potentially get to abyssal, which obviously makes no sense if that's Gorosei.
But I also wouldn't think too much about the GV God Knights. All the other factions have changed a lot since then, there's no reason to expect otherwise for them. They can age and die like everybody else. I mean it only took one year for a spot to open for Shanks/Harald. It's probably not that rare of an occurrence.
Oda's totally the guy to create a bunch of unique designs just for flavor. The Manmayer girl I'm sure will be a part of it because she was young a got a lot of screen time, but I don't know about the rest. I would actually expect more the gas mask guy and them to be the present day God Knight's (were probably Blades at the time) .
hmm what is... or was, this mission to complete for shanks to become a knight...?
- kill mihawk, or maybe apprehend him to become a knight too? (that's why a big fight errupted between the two, whitebeard heard of it)... not putting money on this one.
- erasing yet another island/clan that defied the current WG centuries ago.
- bringing elbaf's treasured devil fruit.
- kill mihawk, or maybe apprehend him to become a knight too? (that's why a big fight errupted between the two, whitebeard heard of it)... not putting money on this one.
- erasing yet another island/clan that defied the current WG centuries ago.
- bringing elbaf's treasured devil fruit.
If Mihawk is not a Nerona, I could see him being the last survivor of a hunting game. Kuraigana appears to have been a battleground at some point. Maybe rumors started circulating that someone still lives on the island, and Shanks was dispatched to complete the genocide, only to be met by a well-trained and possibly wrathful Mihawk.
I believe the message Oda wants to send through this backstory was "over relying on one thing is bad". And that Harald should've balanced between a peaceful route and military might.
The chapter subtly hinted that Ida actually was a little concerned about Harald going overboard with his peaceful route:
And In the very same chapter Saul also further showed this doubt:
I wouldn't really consider Harald a "bad" character. He is bad in the sense of choosing bad choices, but he served his central role in this backstory as a scapegoat so that readers can realize there's absolutely no way to "coexist" with the World Government if not a literal slave, setting the endgame war to take it down.
Throughout 800 years all Elbaph's kings were probably ruthless warriors, then Harald came and changed it but leaned too much towards the opposite side of power.
@Elder Lee Hung All in all? Loki will be the first Elbaph king ever to rule with a balance of peace and power.
@Elder Lee Hung @Owl Ki @PuckTheGreat @Bogard @Paperchampion23 @SakazOuki @Sentinel @Tyki_Mikk @Topi Jerami @ZenZu @nik87 @Monster Zoro's Tesla Supplier @MarineHQ @HA001
The chapter subtly hinted that Ida actually was a little concerned about Harald going overboard with his peaceful route:
And In the very same chapter Saul also further showed this doubt:
I wouldn't really consider Harald a "bad" character. He is bad in the sense of choosing bad choices, but he served his central role in this backstory as a scapegoat so that readers can realize there's absolutely no way to "coexist" with the World Government if not a literal slave, setting the endgame war to take it down.
Throughout 800 years all Elbaph's kings were probably ruthless warriors, then Harald came and changed it but leaned too much towards the opposite side of power.
@Elder Lee Hung All in all? Loki will be the first Elbaph king ever to rule with a balance of peace and power.
@Elder Lee Hung @Owl Ki @PuckTheGreat @Bogard @Paperchampion23 @SakazOuki @Sentinel @Tyki_Mikk @Topi Jerami @ZenZu @nik87 @Monster Zoro's Tesla Supplier @MarineHQ @HA001
