General & Others Overall How much has One Piece series Declined if at all over the timeskip?
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I agree with this, but it's Dressrosa + Reverie that have enjoyed the most post skip. It seems most people seem to forget that the Reverie was between the end of WCI and Wano. It doesn't even feel like it fits because it's much better in quality despite being short.
The funniest thing to me now is all the people that were clamoring for Wano to begin while I wanted to stay with the Reverie for a while longer. Now even those that claim to love Wano so much are complaining that it's been too long and they want to move on.
The funniest thing to me now is all the people that were clamoring for Wano to begin while I wanted to stay with the Reverie for a while longer. Now even those that claim to love Wano so much are complaining that it's been too long and they want to move on.
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Honestly this is a very dumb criticism. You're complaining that Kaido and Big Mom weren't developed before their arcs began, because they weren't the driving force in arcs before WCI or Wano.
Whitebeard was introduced all the way back at Jaya and wasn't developed at all until Marineford. Were you calling it bad writing that Luffy was wasting time with guys like Enel instead of the story developing Whitebeard more?
Whitebeard was introduced all the way back at Jaya and wasn't developed at all until Marineford. Were you calling it bad writing that Luffy was wasting time with guys like Enel instead of the story developing Whitebeard more?
Enel wasn't a fodder, and beyond that, WB's story had a good conclusion. Oda fucked up Kaido and Linlin. He couldn't find out how to make the supernova strong enough to beat them.
So for Linlin, he just offscreens almost the entire fight and leaves it up to the reader to guess how they dealt with things like Linlin's ACoC.
As for Kaido, Oda just spams power ups as if this was fairy tail or something.
So for Linlin, he just offscreens almost the entire fight and leaves it up to the reader to guess how they dealt with things like Linlin's ACoC.
As for Kaido, Oda just spams power ups as if this was fairy tail or something.
Kaido's and Linlin's stories have not concluded, yet you're bitching about him fucking them up 
I'm not saying you need to like everything but at least wait for plot lines to actually finish before drawing conclusions on them
I'm not saying you need to like everything but at least wait for plot lines to actually finish before drawing conclusions on them
Luffy vs kaido is 90% finished and Oda has ruined it as well.
I partially agree with this but to be FAIR there could be more to both characters than their fights
Big Mom clearly isn't dead and we don't know enough about Kaido to speak on him
Oda laid the groundwork for Big Mom during WCI and it looks like she'll meet her end in Elbaf. Oda having her come to Wano was a mistake tbh
Kaido's flashback could save his character so I'm waiting for that before I take a stance
Big Mom clearly isn't dead and we don't know enough about Kaido to speak on him
Oda laid the groundwork for Big Mom during WCI and it looks like she'll meet her end in Elbaf. Oda having her come to Wano was a mistake tbh
Kaido's flashback could save his character so I'm waiting for that before I take a stance
Yes, it’s declined.
The main reasons for that decline can actually be traced back to pre-skip and Saobody, where Oda
-introduced a ton of new characters
-split up the Strawhats
And that was really successful. Fans loved it. I think that made two problems for Oda. Or more accurately, for future readers.
-it made him think he can introduce a bunch of new characters all at once and it can replicate the success of the Supernovas. The Coliseum Gladiators being the main example here. And they were really not that successful, for the most part in Dressrosa people thought it was a waste of time focusing on them and the eventual Grand Fleet coming together… it wasn’t really received that well. More of a “oh, that’s what they’re for. Okay” than “HOLY FUCK IT ALL MAKES SENSE NOW!”
-he felt that Luffy could carry the series basically alone and the Strawhats weren’t really needed. I think this, combined with the above, resulted in the two big crew splits, which were unsuccesful.
So, the problems now. Tons and tons of characters. Pre-skip arcs were usually pretty tight, you had Strawhats, a corresponding number in the enemy group, native allies and maybe a wild card or two (Smoker, Kuma, Aokiji, folk like that).
Now we’ve got the Strawhats- but sometimes half of them aren’t even in the arc. If they are in the arc, not all of them are getting anything to do. The enemy groups are bigger and bigger. There was fourteen Donquioxtes in Dressrosa for some reason, plus Bellamy and Quin and Burgess. And the Yonko crews have been even bigger.
(They’ve actually been slightly better managed in that although there’s been more, Oda hasn’t focused on them all. To the detriment of some, like the TR).
Meanwhile the biggest enemy groups pre-skip was CP9 in EL with eight. Obvious big difference there.
And with EL, the supporting characters were the old Tom’s Workers members, the Franky Family and the shipwrights. But Oda got the balance right there. Tom’s Workers all fitted in to Franky’s plot. He gave Pauli a bit of focus in W7 to make him a red herring then pretty much dropped him. The others were all, for the most part, comic relief. Once it got to the meat of the action in EL they were essentially off-screened.
If EL was taking place now we’d have big flashbacks for Pauli and Zambia and Oda would be trying to invent more enemies for them to get a fight with.
Now on Wano what do we have? Nine Scabbards. Red flag right there- nine characters? Plus Momo, Hiyori, Kanjuro and Yamato? And Oden and Toki in the flashback? We’re at fifteen for one group alone, that’s far too many. There were barely fifteen important characters in all of Alabasta.
Then there’s Hyogoro and the Yakuza- at least the Yakuza are properly just shunted to the side. There’s the Minks. There’s Marco. There’s Tama. And there’s half the Supernovas. All (Kanjuro swapling around) on the side of the heroes.
Who are now, with ten Strawhats, the biggest they’ve ever been.
It’s patently obvious that’s too many characters to properly deal with. That’s not even including the villains! Instead of relegating these supporting characters to Franky Family and Galley La shipwright levels of importance, he’s trying to give nearly all of them paneltime. It simply can’t be done.
And with the lack of Strawhats, really, a lot of the heart has been taken out of the arc. And even when he does use them, he’s going through the motions.
WCI summed this up for me. Where he attempted to recapture the feeling of Arlong Park and EL but botched it entirely. There was next to no buildup for Sanji running away (certainly not compared to Nami and Robin). His second flashback was shit. Does anyone care about the saintly Sora compared to Zeff or Bellemere or Hiriluk? Of course not, she was barely a character. As bad as Usopp’s mother, but there Oda had the excuse of only having being a professional for a year. We expect better by now. The fact that Reiju gave Sanji near enough the exact same message as Saul gave Robin was awful. So was Sanji’s entire dilemma really- at this stage, twenty years in, everyone knew he’d be back. A “will he leave” just doesn’t work anymore like it did with Usopp and Robin.
And half the crew weren’t even there to see it. Even the ones on WCI- only Luffy and Nami actually got involved in Sanji. Brook and Chopper were off exploring another part of the island. Imagine “save me Luffy” happening but Sanji and Usopp are off doing something entirely different. The CP9 facedown with only three Strawhats. Awful.
So this rant is a bit dijointed but yeah, that’s my current thoughts on why One Piece isn’t as good as it was.
The main reasons for that decline can actually be traced back to pre-skip and Saobody, where Oda
-introduced a ton of new characters
-split up the Strawhats
And that was really successful. Fans loved it. I think that made two problems for Oda. Or more accurately, for future readers.
-it made him think he can introduce a bunch of new characters all at once and it can replicate the success of the Supernovas. The Coliseum Gladiators being the main example here. And they were really not that successful, for the most part in Dressrosa people thought it was a waste of time focusing on them and the eventual Grand Fleet coming together… it wasn’t really received that well. More of a “oh, that’s what they’re for. Okay” than “HOLY FUCK IT ALL MAKES SENSE NOW!”
-he felt that Luffy could carry the series basically alone and the Strawhats weren’t really needed. I think this, combined with the above, resulted in the two big crew splits, which were unsuccesful.
So, the problems now. Tons and tons of characters. Pre-skip arcs were usually pretty tight, you had Strawhats, a corresponding number in the enemy group, native allies and maybe a wild card or two (Smoker, Kuma, Aokiji, folk like that).
Now we’ve got the Strawhats- but sometimes half of them aren’t even in the arc. If they are in the arc, not all of them are getting anything to do. The enemy groups are bigger and bigger. There was fourteen Donquioxtes in Dressrosa for some reason, plus Bellamy and Quin and Burgess. And the Yonko crews have been even bigger.
(They’ve actually been slightly better managed in that although there’s been more, Oda hasn’t focused on them all. To the detriment of some, like the TR).
Meanwhile the biggest enemy groups pre-skip was CP9 in EL with eight. Obvious big difference there.
And with EL, the supporting characters were the old Tom’s Workers members, the Franky Family and the shipwrights. But Oda got the balance right there. Tom’s Workers all fitted in to Franky’s plot. He gave Pauli a bit of focus in W7 to make him a red herring then pretty much dropped him. The others were all, for the most part, comic relief. Once it got to the meat of the action in EL they were essentially off-screened.
If EL was taking place now we’d have big flashbacks for Pauli and Zambia and Oda would be trying to invent more enemies for them to get a fight with.
Now on Wano what do we have? Nine Scabbards. Red flag right there- nine characters? Plus Momo, Hiyori, Kanjuro and Yamato? And Oden and Toki in the flashback? We’re at fifteen for one group alone, that’s far too many. There were barely fifteen important characters in all of Alabasta.
Then there’s Hyogoro and the Yakuza- at least the Yakuza are properly just shunted to the side. There’s the Minks. There’s Marco. There’s Tama. And there’s half the Supernovas. All (Kanjuro swapling around) on the side of the heroes.
Who are now, with ten Strawhats, the biggest they’ve ever been.
It’s patently obvious that’s too many characters to properly deal with. That’s not even including the villains! Instead of relegating these supporting characters to Franky Family and Galley La shipwright levels of importance, he’s trying to give nearly all of them paneltime. It simply can’t be done.
And with the lack of Strawhats, really, a lot of the heart has been taken out of the arc. And even when he does use them, he’s going through the motions.
WCI summed this up for me. Where he attempted to recapture the feeling of Arlong Park and EL but botched it entirely. There was next to no buildup for Sanji running away (certainly not compared to Nami and Robin). His second flashback was shit. Does anyone care about the saintly Sora compared to Zeff or Bellemere or Hiriluk? Of course not, she was barely a character. As bad as Usopp’s mother, but there Oda had the excuse of only having being a professional for a year. We expect better by now. The fact that Reiju gave Sanji near enough the exact same message as Saul gave Robin was awful. So was Sanji’s entire dilemma really- at this stage, twenty years in, everyone knew he’d be back. A “will he leave” just doesn’t work anymore like it did with Usopp and Robin.
And half the crew weren’t even there to see it. Even the ones on WCI- only Luffy and Nami actually got involved in Sanji. Brook and Chopper were off exploring another part of the island. Imagine “save me Luffy” happening but Sanji and Usopp are off doing something entirely different. The CP9 facedown with only three Strawhats. Awful.
So this rant is a bit dijointed but yeah, that’s my current thoughts on why One Piece isn’t as good as it was.
Feel like the moment he decided to portray too sterile content the series downgraded but it's a good thing Wano is an arc featuring many different types of content at least 
I personally miss Punk Hazard and Dressrosa but merely for certain things while I appreciate Wano for others.
Still think Pre TS was better in its totality.
I personally miss Punk Hazard and Dressrosa but merely for certain things while I appreciate Wano for others.
Still think Pre TS was better in its totality.
I think in the end we will realize that the problem wasnt the post-timeskip but just the Yonko saga. Now that this Yonko saga will be over,we will see some cool stuff connected to the endgame and that Oda is planning since the beginning with Mihawk,Blackbeard,Dragon and Shanks. And we will get to know more also about Rox and Roger.
Wano fights are looking like gmg or final arc fairy tail fights. How 5 SN even survived 2 yonkos with, big mom loosing to law and kid in less than 5 mins, beast pirate looking and getting beaten like its a dynasty warriors game, King not giving that kimg feel,etc. Wano alot puts the decline at 5-6 to me. Oh god how could I forget nika model.
It's a side character issue. Really my only problem with post. It made DR/WCI/Wano last longer than they needed to be.
I actually do not have an issue with the Supernova, they were a fantastic addition to the manga, and their focus has overall been a good thing. But yes, there's certainly an issue with a number of side characters and how they take screentime from the crews social/basic interactions overall.
I'm hoping post-Wano is a little more focused/return to form with Vegapunk/Elbaf plot (if that's next). But it's not something I expect at this rate with the number of MAJOR characters still left in the series.
It is true though, One Piece went from a character driven to a world driven series post-timeskip. Does that indicate a decline in quality? To many, yes. To some, no. To me, in some way yea. I enjoy the increased world building, but not at the expense of the crew.
I actually do not have an issue with the Supernova, they were a fantastic addition to the manga, and their focus has overall been a good thing. But yes, there's certainly an issue with a number of side characters and how they take screentime from the crews social/basic interactions overall.
I'm hoping post-Wano is a little more focused/return to form with Vegapunk/Elbaf plot (if that's next). But it's not something I expect at this rate with the number of MAJOR characters still left in the series.
It is true though, One Piece went from a character driven to a world driven series post-timeskip. Does that indicate a decline in quality? To many, yes. To some, no. To me, in some way yea. I enjoy the increased world building, but not at the expense of the crew.