Speculations Rob Lucci, the Man who Murdered Kuina, his Mentor Garp, and Zoro's Revenge

#22
This time, Garling was successful, and took Dragon as well, then branded him with the mark on Dragon's face. Laffy was impregnated by Garling, Laffy died, and Dragon then saved Luffy, Garling and Laffy's son, and vowed to raised Luffy as his own son, like Kuma with Bonney. Luffy had Sapphire Scales, so the WG believed him to die, but Vegapunk saved Luffy for Dragon. To hide Luffy, Dragon stashed him in the Goa Kingdom via Garp, where no one would ever look.
Firstly no you will not make Dragon a cuck, secondly dragon has already been using that symbol for 22 years at least but he only got as a tattoo at least 14 years ago, thirdly repeating Kuma’s backstory word for word is repetitive and boring, fourthly Garling is fodder compared to dragon

 

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#23
What in the wattpad is this
One clown who can't accept Kuina's death was just her falling down the stairs, and then realizing, "Wait, Kuina's bloodline is most likely hated by the WG because of Ryuma fighting the WG in the past, and the government just sends assassins to kill people like that."

Even if it's not Lucci, I'm pretty confident that Kuina was murdered by Cipher Pol. It solves all of the weirdness surrounding her death. Almost every death of an important character in this series has a bunch of emotional weight in how the person died, and Kuina just... tripped down the stairs?

The fact that "Down the Stairs" became such a huge meme SHOWS that the community itself thinks Kuina's cause of death is a giant joke. So, what if it was always that, a bad joke, a crappy lie?

Kuina being murdered makes her death MUCH more interesting to Zoro's current plotline, because it gives him a target to hunt for revenge in the current plot.

Zoro going "Sorry, Luffy... but I have to kill this man, no matter what. Even if it means rejecting your orders, and leaving the crew." Each of the Core 4 East Blue members, Zoro, Nami, Usopp, and Sanji, have left the crew in someway, besides Zoro (Nami with Arlong, Usopp with Merry, Sanji with Germa). This is what causes Zoro to leave the crew; the hunt for Kuina's killer.
 
#24
One clown who can't accept Kuina's death was just her falling down the stairs, and then realizing, "Wait, Kuina's bloodline is most likely hated by the WG because of Ryuma fighting the WG in the past, and the government just sends assassins to kill people like that."

Even if it's not Lucci, I'm pretty confident that Kuina was murdered by Cipher Pol. It solves all of the weirdness surrounding her death. Almost every death of an important character in this series has a bunch of emotional weight in how the person died, and Kuina just... tripped down the stairs?
Why not kill her daddy as well then?
 

CoC: Color of Clowns

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#25
Why not kill her daddy as well then?
At that point, it wouldn't look like an accident.

I think Koshiro saw the murder, but kept quiet to keep the rest of the village safe, maybe made a deal.

Cipher Pol 9 is supposed to be a secret organization, if Kuina, and Koshiro died on the same night, it would be obvious they were murdered.

To be honest, I also think there's some "chosen one" prophecy bullshit going on, but I'm so sick of that shit on some levels that I just don't want to touch on it. I believe Ace was meant to be Joy Boy, and that Luffy eating his Fruit was a mistake and broke the prophecy. If Luffy eating the Gomu Gomu no Mi was prophesied I will be so damn angry. Luffy BREAKING a prophecy by eating the Fruit meant for Ace is SOOOOOOOOO much better, IMO.
 
#26
At that point, it wouldn't look like an accident.

I think Koshiro saw the murder, but kept quiet to keep the rest of the village safe, maybe made a deal.

Cipher Pol 9 is supposed to be a secret organization, if Kuina, and Koshiro died on the same night, it would be obvious they were murdered.

To be honest, I also think there's some "chosen one" prophecy bullshit going on, but I'm so sick of that shit on some levels that I just don't want to touch on it. I believe Ace was meant to be Joy Boy, and that Luffy eating his Fruit was a mistake and broke the prophecy. If Luffy eating the Gomu Gomu no Mi was prophesied I will be so damn angry. Luffy BREAKING a prophecy by eating the Fruit meant for Ace is SOOOOOOOOO much better, IMO.
He can keep the bloodline going, so this isnt making all that much sense
 

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#28
He can keep the bloodline going, so this isnt making all that much sense
That's where the "prophecy" part comes in. If the Gorosei believed a Shimotsuki child would rise up to kill them, and they thought Kuina was the last one, they wouldn't have to worry about Koshiro having some kid who would still be very young, 10 at most, at this point.

The Dawn has been established as a legitimate Prophecy by Toki, and I'm fairly confident the Gorosei know enough about it to be looking for candidates that could cause it. This has been established through Imu looking over Luffy, Vivi, Blackbeard, and Shirahoshi's posters.



It's not about the bloodline, it's about the timing of the bloodline. Hence Roger's "we were too early" when Poseidon, Shirahoshi, hadn't been born yet.

Oda has put a TON of emphasis on the Shimotsuki bloodline, and there hasn't been a payoff for it yet. I'll be frank, I believe Kuina was given the duty of returning to Wano to help free it, which is why she was so obsessed with her training, there's just very little Kuina panels to work with to theorize about her beyond her death.
 

CoC: Color of Clowns

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#30
Reminds me of the finding the cure for cancer jokes. "He died by commiting suicide shooting himself in the back 26 times".
:bignews::bignews::bignews::bignews::bignews::bignews:

Breaking Story: Yesterday evening, everyone in the Shimotsuki village fell down the stairs. There were no survivors, everyone in the village perished. Thanks to Big News Morgans for the scoop. In other news, the Goa Kingdom has placed a mass-order on Escalators produced by Dr. Vegapunk."

Has Zoro seen an escalator in this series? I need Zoro vs an escalator.
 
#31
:bignews::bignews::bignews::bignews::bignews::bignews:

Breaking Story: Yesterday evening, everyone in the Shimotsuki village fell down the stairs. There were no survivors, everyone in the village perished. Thanks to Big News Morgans for the scoop. In other news, the Goa Kingdom has placed a mass-order on Escalators produced by Dr. Vegapunk."

Has Zoro seen an escalator in this series? I need Zoro vs an escalator.
Zoro would press on the floor 1 button just to end up in the Dragon Ball verse
 
#34
TLDR:
-Dragon visited Shimotsuki village before Kuina's death. Dragon was being hunted by CP Agents.
-V. Nusjuro learned from CP that Shimotsuki settlers from Wano were training Samurai in the East Blue.
-V. Nusjuro ordered Kuina to be murdered to end the Shimotsuki clan
-Lucci, 19, killed Kuina 11 years ago.
-Lucci is Garling's bastard son, who was raised by Garling to kill mercilessly
-Garp and Garling hate each other, and Garp trained Lucci to believe in justice in the WG
-When Blackbeard attacks Wano for Pluton, Zoro will learn from Who's Who that Lucci killed Kuina (Who's Who hates Lucci and has been tracking his career)
-Garp will escape from Blackbeard and try to protect Lucci from Zoro
-Tashigi, Kuina's cousin, will keep Zoro from attacking Garp to kill Lucci
-Zoro will learn to "Cut Nothing" by giving up on his revenge
-Lucci helps Franky build another Pluton to fight the Pluton Blackbeard stole





Zoro's greatest emotional focus in this story is Kuina. Important characters in One Piece have a mentor/senpai character who inspired them to become who they are. Luffy and Shanks, Sanji and Zeff, Nami and Bellemere, Usopp and Yasopp.

But, unlike those characters, Kuina is oddly... absent from Zoro's plotline. There's Tashigi, sure, and there's Mihawk, but, outside of "swords" Mihawk and Kuina have no real connection. Mihawk isn't tied to Wano, and nothing about his character connects to Kuina, besides Perona being a ghost girl.

Shanks ties Luffy into Garp, Zeff ties Sanji into Germa and Judge, Yasopp ties Usopp into the Giants... where is Zoro's greater connector to Kuina? So, I believe that the character we're missing that connect into Zoro's plotline, has to connect to her DEATH, which never made sense to a lot of people. Many people believe this could be Koshiro, Zoro's sensei and Kuina's father, who killed Kuuina, but this also doesn't really fit. So, let's say Kuina was killed. Why would Koshiro lie about the death of his child he clearly cared for to Zoro?

Well... because if she was murdered, Zoro would seek revenge. Egghead has had the Gorosei speak about eliminating certain races and tribes; the Buccaneers, and now, the Giants. What if this extends into Wano, who we know the WG considers to be their enemies? We know that Dragon visited the Shimotsuki Village that Koshiro was a part of building, where Zoro grew up.



So... if the WG viewed the Shimotsuki as enemies, they would try to eliminate their family lineage. Who do we know from Shimotsuki village, who was hyper obsessed with becoming stronger, as if they had some destiny to fulfill? Yes. Kuina was murdered by the WG, and Cipher Pol. Which Cipher Pol unit has freedom to kill, and is therefore unknown to the public? CP9, the unit we were introduced to through... Rob Lucci.

Yes. Kuina did not trip down the stairs. She was pushed, and murdered, by Rob Lucci of CP9. Allow me to explain.

I believe Lucci is the half-son of Garling, like Bonney, and that Garling intentionally hunted down Ginny and Dragon's wife, Laffy, to make examples out of them.



In God Valley, we're shown that the Celestial Dragons despise having anything named after them. They attacked God Valley partially because it has the name "God" in the title. That's how evil/arrogant they are.

Garp is know to despise Celestial Dragons, and his son is named... Dragon. I believe Garp named Dragon this purely to piss of the Celstial Dragons. And, because Garp was a Marine, and Dragon became a Marine, the Celestial Dragons couldn't do anything, since the Marines are part of the WG. So, Garling, Garp's rival, decided to get back at Garp by attacking his weak spot; Goa Kingdom. Garling annexed Goa Kingdom, and held a human hunt there, where Laffy, Dragon's wife, was hunted. However, Dragon saved her... until Garling came back to take her again.

This time, Garling was successful, and took Dragon as well, then branded him with the mark on Dragon's face. Laffy was impregnated by Garling, Laffy died, and Dragon then saved Luffy, Garling and Laffy's son, and vowed to raised Luffy as his own son, like Kuma with Bonney. Luffy had Sapphire Scales, so the WG believed him to die, but Vegapunk saved Luffy for Dragon. To hide Luffy, Dragon stashed him in the Goa Kingdom via Garp, where no one would ever look.

However, eventually, Dragon was spotted in East Blue 12 years ago, in Gray Terminal, when he rescued Sabo. Cipher Pol had been active in this area ever since Who's Who lost Luffy's Fruit to Shanks two years prior, 13 years ago. Since Luffy was off the grid, Cipher Pol didn't know anything about him. Cipher Pol saw Dragon, and started tracking him in the area. Eventually, they see Dragon land on a village named... Shimotsuki Village. They report to the Gorosei about Dragon, and V. Nusjuro recognizes the name, and realizes that the Shimotsuki clan migrated out of Wano and is raising new Samurai in the East Blue. V. Nusjuro orders the most promising heir to the Shimotsuki clan to be murdered by Cipher Pol 9.



Rob Lucci, who was 19yo eleven years ago, and started killing at the age of 13yo seventeen years ago, killed Kuina by pushing her down the stairs. We know that Rob Lucci has no problem killing ANYONE, having murdered those innocent hostages when he was only 13.

This is why Oda had Lucci fight Zoro, and why Zoro wants to kill Lucci so bad; it's Kuina's spirit willing him on.

This obviously has more implications; Shanks is Luffy's half brother, and Lucci is Luffy's half brother, as well, due to Garling being their father. If this theory is accurate, then Lucci is a murder machine because he was raised by Garling to view people as something to hunt. Lucci is a dark mirror of Luffy; a child raised to be the tool of the WG, rather than a child who grew up free. Garling raised his bastard son to be a monster, while Shanks', Garling's son, raised Luffy, Garling's bastrd son, to be a hero.

So, what kept Lucci from being completely evil? We see that he cares for the Cipher Pol agents he grew up with, like Kaku, and his pet pigeon Hattori. I think it was Garp. Lucci mentions that he wants to tell a "certain idiot" about Luffy during the end of Enies Lobby, and, since Garp is heavily involved in teaching soldiers in the WG, I believe Garp was Lucci's Rokushiki teacher. Shank's, Garling's son, raised Luffy, Garling's bastard son, and Shanks' half brother, while Garp, Garling's rival, raised Lucci, Garling's other bastard son. Craaaaaaaaaaaaazy. I think Hattori also might have been a gift from Garp to Lucci, and that Sengoku's Goat is the same. Garp seems like the kind of dude to buy people he knows random pets. Garp offloaded his grandson to mountain bandits.




Garp is captured by Blackbeard, who is headed for Pluton. Zoro's past is tied to Wano, and is still unexplored, and Lucci's plotline is tied to Pluton, which is... in Wano.

So, I believe that, like Sanji before him, Zoro will go off on his own, abandoning the crew, to kill Lucci after finding out what he did, once we're back in Wano to deal with the WG and Blackbeard fighting over Pluton. The question is where Zoro will learn that Lucci killed Kuina. This could be from a number of sources. Who's Who was captured by the WG before Lucci killed Kuina, but, considering Kaido's close ties with Cipher Pol, it's possible Who's Who found out later that Lucci killed Kuina (Who's Who is obsessive and clearly has followed Lucci's career out of spite post-arrest), and would tell Zoro just to get Zoro to hunt Lucci. Stussy and Kaku also might know, and I could see Kaku letting it slip in Wano that he and Lucci had been involved in murdering a Shimotsuki before.

The last option I've thought of is Guernica, the bowler hat CP0 agent who got clobbered by Kaido, but survived and took a picture of Gear 5 Luffy. Maha, the CP0 Agent who fought Izo, was apparently dead, and Joseph, the Agent who escaped, was seemingly captured by the Big Mom Pirates. I could see Guernica offering the Straw Hats info in exchange for help to rescue Maha or Joseph could be a possibility.

Either way, like Sanji, Zoro will have a reason to put his own personal family issues over the crew. Sanji was willing to leave to save his family, Zeff's, life, and Zoro will leave to avenge his family, Kuina's, death.



Rather than attack Blackbeard to stop Pluton's Activation, Zoro will choose to hunt Lucci. Since Sanji's family resolved his issues in Whole Cake, through Reiju, I except estranged family to save Zoro from this situation. Sanji saved his hated father figure from dying in order to save Reiju, so, in a reverse reading, I see Garp, Lucci's kind step-father, defending him from Zoro, only for Tashigi to stop Zoro entirely. Tashigi is indeed a Shimotsuki, Kuina's cousin, as there was another group of Shimotsuki settlers that chose to settle on a different island than Koshiro and Shimotsuki Village. Upon realizing that Zoro is a Shimotsuki, Tashigi will beg him not to choose revenge over the way of the blade. For the sake of Luffy's grandpa, Garp, Zoro will spare Kuina's killer, and learn to truly cut nothing, as Koshiro instructed him long ago.

I believe Lucci will eventually join the crew, and help the Straw Hats build a new Pluton to defeat Blackbeard's Pluton, as Franky memorized Pluton's blueprints before burning them in Enies Lobby. Lucci, who was introduced an an evil character trying to prevent Pluton from destroying the world, will become a criminal/pirate to build a new Pluton, as if foreshadowed by Lucci and Kaku being shipwrights.

So, yeah. Expect more Zoro vs Lucci in the future.

And... yes... (@Rambles )



ROB LUCCI FOR NAKAMA!!! AND KAKU!!! AND DON'T FORGET STUSSY WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
You cooked again!
The theme of brohterhood/sisterhood runs deep in One Piece. Especially with Luffy. I also think that Luffy will see some kind of brother in Lucci (once the arc of Egghead will come to it's climax).

With Wano, I think we will see the involvement into the story again soon - we already have that cover-story of Yamato. So, Oda is going to probably pick up that plot-line in the future again.

Do you think Zoro and Tashigi will become a couple at the end? I think she is going to have a big influence regarding him. And I hope this does not require him saving her like a damsel in distress.... .
 

CoC: Color of Clowns

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#36
You cooked again!
The theme of brohterhood/sisterhood runs deep in One Piece. Especially with Luffy. I also think that Luffy will see some kind of brother in Lucci (once the arc of Egghead will come to it's climax).

With Wano, I think we will see the involvement into the story again soon - we already have that cover-story of Yamato. So, Oda is going to probably pick up that plot-line in the future again.

Do you think Zoro and Tashigi will become a couple at the end? I think she is going to have a big influence regarding him. And I hope this does not require him saving her like a damsel in distress.... .
Pluton has too much signifigance to be off-screened, IMO. I was worried for a bit, but, now I"m confident.

Yeah, I think Zoro and Tashigi will get together. I'm still of the mindset that Zoro is Ryuma and Toki's kid sent forward in time by Toki. So... uh... that would make Hiyori x Zoro pretty awkward.

Tashigi is a character I really love but always get frustrated with, I really want her to have a big moment where she takes up Kuina's legacy and wrecks someone beside Zoro. Tashigi saving Zoro would do a ton for me.
 
#38
Pluton has too much signifigance to be off-screened, IMO. I was worried for a bit, but, now I"m confident.

Yeah, I think Zoro and Tashigi will get together. I'm still of the mindset that Zoro is Ryuma and Toki's kid sent forward in time by Toki. So... uh... that would make Hiyori x Zoro pretty awkward.

Tashigi is a character I really love but always get frustrated with, I really want her to have a big moment where she takes up Kuina's legacy and wrecks someone beside Zoro. Tashigi saving Zoro would do a ton for me.
Yeah, I think Tashigi really needs some feats. It would be great, if Oda could write that.

The problem with Toki was for me always that her character had a much too interesting background for a side character. But this background did not really get explored by Oda. Why think of that background only to waste it in the end? - This does not make any sense. And her sudden death seems awkward, too. I would not be surprised, if she used her Df-power to somehow travel to the present time and interact with the plot once more.
 
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