Controversial Rumble’s Revenge On Democracy: WorstGen ASOIAF 2v2 Fighting Tournament

[Alexis2282AE]

What yall think about Darkstar? Fraud? He has aura

He is dangerous for much the same reason Jaime Lannister is dangerous: if someone else enables him, gives him an army, say, he’s probably quite capable of making use of such an army and callous enough to do so with little regard for the consequences.

Beyond that, it seems that House Dayne is having some dynastic troubles, suggesting that Darkstar may or may not be the de facto commander of a good 30-50% of the Dornish Mountains (from Starfall to the Tower of Joy, basically). Depending on his connections, he may also have a measure of support from other Dornish nobles. That means he could be a rallying second-in-command figure for anybody who wanted to split Dorne in two (Bone Mountains versus Sunspear/Greenblood).

 

[Etzel Andergast]

Meryn Trant, Boros Blout and Kettleblack brothers >>>>>> Arthur Dayne

 

[TheKnightOfTheSea]

What yall think about Darkstar? Fraud? He has aura

Probably around as good as competent Kingsguard members like Balon Swann. More dangerous for his ambitions

 

[Etzel Andergast]

Probably around as good as competent Kingsguard members like Balon Swann. More dangerous for his ambitions

Nah, I think he one step above all the current clowns of kingsguard

 

[Cichy]

Gregor takes this.

People jump to conclusions when it comes to their brief exchange. Sandor simply was able to parry few of Gregor's strikes. Just because he can do that does not mean he can press his own offense and win.

The Mountain still has range advantage, strength advantage and armor advantage. The Hound doesn't convince me as someone who can overcome those odds with technique.

 

[Elder Lee Hung]

People jump to conclusion when it comes to their brief exchange. Sandor simply was able to parry few of Gregor's strikes. Just because he can do that does not mean he can press his own offense and win.

Does the Mountain have amazing defensive ability that we don’t know about? Gregor is 100% offense, what is he going to do if Sandor actually starts fighting back?

The Mountain still has range advantage, strength advantage and armor advantage. The Hound doesn't convince me as someone who can overcome those odds with technique.

Gregor is 100% mindless rage. He doesn’t need to possess overwhelming skill, so he doesn’t. This is why Oberyn bodied him that severely. Sandor is much different, he is highly skilled and fights with his brain, and his brute strength is well more than enough to hold his own against Gregor.

Sandor is literally the superior fighter here.

 

[SakazOuki]

Sandor can win this, but more likely than not he gets pummeled by his older brother

 

[Cichy]

Does the Mountain have amazing defensive ability that we don’t know about?

Yes.

"Gregor wears the heaviest, thickest steel plate armor in the Seven Kingdoms. Dull grey in color and battle-scarred, his armor is so heavy that no ordinary man would be able to move, let alone fight effectively while wearing it. Below the plate he wears chainmail and boiled leather. He also wears a plate helm with only a narrow slit for vision. "

+ add to it the fact that he is using shield and was specifically praised for having great battle instincts.

Good luck trying to do any serious damage to Gregor when you don't have valyrian steel or god-tier technique.

Gregor is 100% offense, what is he going to do if Sandor actually starts fighting back?

The moment Sandor tries to focus on offense he gets torn to pieces. Gregor can allow himself to be full-offensive fighter, because again he has great advantage in both range and armor. Sandor trying to attack can create a potencial gap in his defense which could end badly for him, since the Mountain was literaly stated to be tier above him in physical strength and can cut people in half with one strike.

Gregor is 100% mindless rage. He doesn’t need to possess overwhelming skill, so he doesn’t. This is why Oberyn bodied him that severely. Sandor is much different, he is highly skilled and fights with his brain, and his brute strength is well more than enough to hold his own against Gregor.

No. Oberyn won, because he fought the way to become Mountain's kryptonite:

-using the spear instead of sword to have greater range over Gregor's longsword,
-no heavy armor to be able to dance around him and go full agility instead of taking him head on,
-using poison to weaken his opponent.

I agree that Sandor has better technique then his brother, but still his approach and skillset are different then those of Oberyn.

Sandor is literally the superior fighter here.

Nah, he has no feats to prove it. I'd pick the mountain over him although not by a huge margin.

 

[Elder Lee Hung]

Yes.

"Gregor wears the heaviest, thickest steel plate armor in the Seven Kingdoms. Dull grey in color and battle-scarred, his armor is so heavy that no ordinary man would be able to move, let alone fight effectively while wearing it. Below the plate he wears chainmail and boiled leather. He also wears a plate helm with only a narrow slit for vision. "

So your argument isn’t that Gregor has amazing defense, your argument is that Gregor wears heavy armor. I mean, okay lmfao. Sandor wears armor too, and we already know he can easily withstand a bloodlusted offensive from Gregor because it canonically happened.

+ add to it the fact that he is using shield and was specifically praised for having great battle instincts.

Gregor is tossing that shield out of the window as soon as he gets pissed. Which would take approximately 30 seconds if he is fighting an opponent he can’t kill in 10 seconds or less. Absolutely not relevant against Sandor post the first 30 seconds of the fight.

Good luck trying to do any serious damage to Gregor when you don't have valyrian steel or god-tier technique.

So is your argument that Gregor is invulnerable then lmfao? Nobody can even wound him if they don’t have Valyrian steel? Come on now, we know this isn’t that kind of series. Anyone with even passing strength can wound Gregor with a solid blow. Let alone a 7 foot Kingsguard who can canonically parry bloodlusted strikes from Gregor.

the Mountain was literaly stated to be tier above him in physical strength and can cut people in half with one strike.

^This was when Martin was still involved with the TV show btw.

No. Oberyn won, because he fought the way to become Mountain's kryptonite:

-using the spear instead of sword to have greater range over Gregor's longsword,
-no heavy armor to be able to dance around him and go full agility instead of taking him head on,
-using poison to weaken his opponent.

My man dancing around the point that even Oberyn, with far, far inferior brute strength than Sandor was still able to wound Gregor. Lol

 

[ElderOnitar]

The Hound seemed a bit more impressive when they clashed in the first book, so he has my vote.

But as Gregor lifted his sword for the killing blow, a rasping voice warned, “Leave him be,” and a steel-clad hand wrenched him away from the boy. The Mountain pivoted in wordless fury, swinging his longsword in a killing arc with all his massive strength behind it, but the Hound caught the blow and turned it, and for what seemed an eternity the two brothers stood hammering at each other as a dazed Loras Tyrell was helped to safety. Thrice Ned saw Ser Gregor aim savage blows at the hound’s-head helmet, yet not once did Sandor send a cut at his brother’s unprotected face

 

[RayanOO]

Clegane Bowl !

Sandor prepared for this fight all his life

He played this fight like 10000 times, he trained to beat no one else but Gregor

I don’t doubt one second that he has a way to harm his brother, that he studied his armor, the way he fights etc.

And from the whole narrative either be it in the books or in the show Sandor did/will one way or an other cross path with his bro and kill him

Hounds for the win for me

Even Oberyn doesn’t want Gregor dead as hard as Sandor

 

[Bullet]

Sandor takes this
Not only is he a physical monster and very skillful unlike the Mountain, he also very likely has studied his brother and thought about ways to kill him since his youth like @RayanOO said.

 

[NikaInParis]

I'm a Sandor mark so my heart barks for the Hound, but my brain says Gregor.
Really tough choice, I hope the show doesn't influence the voting.
@Elder Lee Hung I'll wait a bit more so, if you can, just tag me before the next round and I'll throw in my vote if it's close

 

[Etzel Andergast]

How strong is Victarion?

 

[God Buggy]

I think Sandor is one of the elite warriors who can beat Gregor yea. He is freakishly strong and for sure more skilled and mobile than the Mountain.

Like @KingOnizam posted, Sandor was was more than capable of going blow for blow against his brother while not really going on the offensive like Gregor was doing. Now this wasn't a prologed match but I would bet on Sandor in this one.

 

[Dragon777]

This fight will happen and Sandor is going to win through pure hate.

Sandor

 

[Cichy]

So your argument isn’t that Gregor has amazing defense, your argument is that Gregor wears heavy armor. I mean, okay lmfao. Sandor wears armor too, and we already know he can easily withstand a bloodlusted offensive from Gregor because it canonically happened.

No, my argument is that Gregor wears the thickest amor in the seven kingdoms that was clearly described as abnormal.

Gregor is tossing that shield out of the window as soon as he gets pissed. Which would take approximately 30 seconds if he is fighting an opponent he can’t kill in 10 seconds or less. Absolutely not relevant against Sandor post the first 30 seconds of the fight.

Gregor was using his shield against Oberyn and did not toss it away.

So is your argument that Gregor is invulnerable then lmfao? Nobody can even wound him if they don’t have Valyrian steel? Come on now, we know this isn’t that kind of series. Anyone with even passing strength can wound Gregor with a solid blow. Let alone a 7 foot Kingsguard who can canonically parry bloodlusted strikes from Gregor.

^This was when Martin was still involved with the TV show btw.

Showpleb arguement is not relevant here. Martin clearly described the show as a seperate universe. And again, Jaime described Mountain's physical strength as nothing he's ever seen.

No, I'm not saying Gregor is invulnerable, I'm saying doing serious damage to him is very difficult. You would have to be fast enough to overcome the range advantage of his greatsword he's using with one hand, aim the way to not get blocked by his large shield and then still have enough penetration power to go through his abnormal armor or enough precision to aim for very small weak spots and not loose your momentum.

My man dancing around the point that even Oberyn, with far, far inferior brute strength than Sandor was still able to wound Gregor. Lol

Oberyn went for chinks in the armor with a spear. The chapter literally describes at one point how he is aiming for places such as gaps at joints, back of knee etc with his pinpoint precision. And again, he could do that so easily because of his fighting style and choice of weapon + after the first hits the poison most likely started to take it's toll on the Mountain.

 

[God Buggy]

Tbf the Mountain really is a monster. I'd give it to Sandor but the risk of losing is there. Oberyn put up a true masterclass against him, that fighting sequence is one of Martin's best. It really felt like Oberyn was facing a giant almost.

Sandor isn't Oberyn and has his own path to winning, but yeah tough fight.

 

[Elder Lee Hung]

Alright guys, the last of the main brackets is upon us! Up next we have the true winner’s bracket. Also, do you guys think we should do a Loser’s bracket as well and allow the losers a second chance at glory?

Round 4b

Ser Ryam Redwyne

VERSUS

Sandoq the Shadow

WHO WINS AND WHY???

@God Buggy @Cruxroux @NikaInParis @SakazOuki @RayanOO @TheAncientCenturion @TheKnightOfTheSea @Rumble @Bullet @KingOnizam @Alexis2282AE @Daniel @Dragon777

 

[Cruxroux]

Alright guys, the last of the main brackets is upon us! Up next we have the true winner’s bracket. Also, do you guys think we should do a Loser’s bracket as well and allow the losers a second chance at glory?

Round 4b

Ser Ryam Redwyne

VERSUS

Sandoq the Shadow

WHO WINS AND WHY???

@God Buggy @Cruxroux @NikaInParis @SakazOuki @RayanOO @TheAncientCenturion @TheKnightOfTheSea @Rumble @Bullet @KingOnizam @Alexis2282AE @Daniel @Dragon777

I can't really remember any feat of his apart from being Jahaerys Kingsguard.
but Sandoq? MAY THE LORDS HAVE MERCY LOL.