Powers & Abilities General CoA Discussion - Basic & Advanced
- Thread starter Gol D. Roger
- Start date
I'm sure people have pieced it together already, but those that haven't just wanted to point this out...
Ryouuou!
The method of CoA control that focuses on flowing your Haki into a single point. Either using it to coat your swords or releasing it out your palms to create a concussive blast.
The aspect im focusing on is how Oda illustrates it to help us readers identify it. The steamy aura.
Now with that said. Time to be straight forward. The fanbase has always wondered what Big Mom did to Luffy to deactivate his G4. Many speculated she somehow drained his Haki. Well whoever guessed that, you people are correct. He only loses energy and is unable to utilize the form when his Haki is depleted.
And seeing this panel of Zoro:
https://i.imgur.com/5oiEcQq.png
Made me think back to the clash between Big Mom and Luffy.
Big Mom knows how to utilize Ryou, and she is capable of draining it.
https://i.imgur.com/GrGt1bx.png
Her being an Iron Balloon is probably linked to Ryou as well, considering when she's distressed her defense lowers to the point where kneeling causes her knees to bleed.
Kaido also has Ryou. Pretty much outright hinted in his introduction chapter. Guillotine blade mysteriously breaks, spears break when he's stabbed. Surivived 10,000 different types of torture unscathed. Only Oden who probably had powerful ass Haki was able to scar him.
http://i.imgur.com/Nawuwxx.jpg
The alliance are about to go up against these two at once. And honestly Act 2 made these two Yonko alot more dangerous in my point of view. Especially if they are capable of using Ryou offensively in ways Luffy showed with the tree themselves
https://i.imgur.com/Q7K0Zee.png
Ryouuou!
The method of CoA control that focuses on flowing your Haki into a single point. Either using it to coat your swords or releasing it out your palms to create a concussive blast.
The aspect im focusing on is how Oda illustrates it to help us readers identify it. The steamy aura.
Now with that said. Time to be straight forward. The fanbase has always wondered what Big Mom did to Luffy to deactivate his G4. Many speculated she somehow drained his Haki. Well whoever guessed that, you people are correct. He only loses energy and is unable to utilize the form when his Haki is depleted.
And seeing this panel of Zoro:
https://i.imgur.com/5oiEcQq.png
Made me think back to the clash between Big Mom and Luffy.
Big Mom knows how to utilize Ryou, and she is capable of draining it.
https://i.imgur.com/GrGt1bx.png
Her being an Iron Balloon is probably linked to Ryou as well, considering when she's distressed her defense lowers to the point where kneeling causes her knees to bleed.
Kaido also has Ryou. Pretty much outright hinted in his introduction chapter. Guillotine blade mysteriously breaks, spears break when he's stabbed. Surivived 10,000 different types of torture unscathed. Only Oden who probably had powerful ass Haki was able to scar him.
http://i.imgur.com/Nawuwxx.jpg
The alliance are about to go up against these two at once. And honestly Act 2 made these two Yonko alot more dangerous in my point of view. Especially if they are capable of using Ryou offensively in ways Luffy showed with the tree themselves
https://i.imgur.com/Q7K0Zee.png
I don't think that Aisa's case applies to Linlin who didn't show any signs of having Coa during her childhood and has been shown many times to be super durable even when not using Coa like when she taked Zeus' lightning, Pedro's suicide attack, a Coup de Burst or Jinbei's Vagabond Drill without getting injured.
the fact that her durability drops to the point where she can scrape her knees is suggesting its not a permanent thing. which means its not her body that is naturally durable, but more something that she can switch on and off, even involuntarily.
in the Luffy vs Linlin encounter I just assumed BM hit him with so much force that he deflated. knocked him semi-unconscious and he reverted back.
Post automatically merged:
in the Luffy vs Linlin encounter I just assumed BM hit him with so much force that he deflated. knocked him semi-unconscious and he reverted back.
Haki is a power that comes from will power and spirit. In wano, it's called ryuo. There are three types of haki (CoO, CoA and CoC) or one can say haki gives you three types of abilities. As one becomes proficient in any type of haki, ability given by that type of haki will also become advanced.
For example, Katakuri has Future sight, after being proficient in observation haki.
As both, advanced and basic abilities comes from same source, that is will power, they all are generally referred as haki/Ryuo
Now, let's talk about basic and advanced usage of CoA.(please read panels carefully). I will be explaining the concept through Luffy and Zoro.
Basic color of Armament gives you ability to hit logia and coat your body part with armament /koka.
In wano, Luffy called koka, coating of body with armament, a basic ability and showed desire to learn advanced ability(deflection/Shockwave ) as shown by Rayleigh.
Hyo after noticing what Luffy is trying to learn (advanced CoA:deflection) says that in wano they have a similar ability through which a swordsman can cut anything yet nothing(panel is given above) -that is he can cut steel if he desires or will not cut even a paper, if he doesn't desire.
He went on to demonstrate this ability by deflecting a gifter.
So advanced usage of CoA = defection/Shockwave and ability to cut anything yet nothing.
Now, let's move on to more interesting part.
Zoro indeed has unlocked ability to cut anything yet nothing in alabasta as he was taught by kuina father who apparently belongs to Wano and so is Zoro who is shimotsuki. He did so under extreme situation but just didn't realize it to have full grasp until TS where Mihawk taught him how to make blade black.
Another definitive proof of both Zoro and Luffy having advanced usage of CoA is explain below
Now, the last part - highly advanced usage of Armament or as some called penetration.
Hyo mentioned that there is much more advanced version of CoA which allows user to damage object from within after Luffy broke the collar without making it explode.
So yes, what Luffy end up learning is much more advanced version of CoA.
However, for a swordsman this ability seem to be in parallel with making blade black which Zoro has yet to do and for that he needs to become one with the sword.
Which Mihawk taught him but he is yet to do so
The black blade has been equated to breaking objects from within on the basis of inference drawn from the above panels.
Learning the flow of haki gives ability to cut anything yet nothing and ability of defection.
As Luffy practiced this, he instead of deflection, end up destroying collar from within. One can imply, that he infused his Haki into the collar, altered it properties to destroy it from within(penetration and destruction)
However, the same concept is inherent in making blade black. Through consistent use of flow of haki into blades through countless battles, the nature of the blade will permanently change making it harder and black.(penetration and modification)
So both breaking collar and making blade black is based on similar concept of flowing haki and changing nature of the object from within permanently, with difference lying in that former breaks it from within and other strengthens it from within. Thus both being placed as highly advanced usage of CoA.
So in short,
Basic CoA(Hitting Logia, coating/koka) - - - - >advanced CoA [deflection/shockwave; ability to cut anything yet nothing ; haki imbued slashes (it's also based on flow of haki into slashes from user)] - - - - - - >highly advanced usage of CoA (destroying objects from within and making blade black)
If you have any argument against this, please substantiate it with facts and not your headcannon. Lol
Thank you for reading this. Please post your opinion.
Some tags
@Rivaille @Bogard @BossYimz
@Sentinel @hades @TheAncientCenturion @HA001 @Cyrus the Cactus @nik87 @Rukusho
For example, Katakuri has Future sight, after being proficient in observation haki.
As both, advanced and basic abilities comes from same source, that is will power, they all are generally referred as haki/Ryuo
Now, let's talk about basic and advanced usage of CoA.(please read panels carefully). I will be explaining the concept through Luffy and Zoro.
Basic color of Armament gives you ability to hit logia and coat your body part with armament /koka.
In wano, Luffy called koka, coating of body with armament, a basic ability and showed desire to learn advanced ability(deflection/Shockwave ) as shown by Rayleigh.
Luffy calling koka - basic
In panel below, Luffy calls deflection advanced
In panel below, Hyo said that deflection ability Luffy is trying to learn is similar to ability to cut anything yet nothing.
In panel below, Luffy calls deflection advanced
In panel below, Hyo said that deflection ability Luffy is trying to learn is similar to ability to cut anything yet nothing.
Hyo after noticing what Luffy is trying to learn (advanced CoA:deflection) says that in wano they have a similar ability through which a swordsman can cut anything yet nothing(panel is given above) -that is he can cut steel if he desires or will not cut even a paper, if he doesn't desire.
He went on to demonstrate this ability by deflecting a gifter.
Now, let's move on to more interesting part.
Zoro indeed has unlocked ability to cut anything yet nothing in alabasta as he was taught by kuina father who apparently belongs to Wano and so is Zoro who is shimotsuki. He did so under extreme situation but just didn't realize it to have full grasp until TS where Mihawk taught him how to make blade black.
This panel shows Zoro sensing the breathe of non living things and mention ability to cut anything yet nothing.
The panel below shows that Zoro dodged all falling stones as if he knew where they will fall(he was feeling the breathe of stones)
The panel below shows that Zoro even figured out under which stone his sword is buried.
And, in the panel below he demonstrated ability to cut anything yet nothing - he didn't cut leaves because he didn't desire but cut the stone because he desired. His swords understood his will. (similar to what Hyo said)
The panel below shows that Zoro dodged all falling stones as if he knew where they will fall(he was feeling the breathe of stones)
The panel below shows that Zoro even figured out under which stone his sword is buried.
And, in the panel below he demonstrated ability to cut anything yet nothing - he didn't cut leaves because he didn't desire but cut the stone because he desired. His swords understood his will. (similar to what Hyo said)
Another definitive proof of both Zoro and Luffy having advanced usage of CoA is explain below
As I said earlier, hyuo was teaching Luffy advanced usage of ryuo/haki - that is focusing on making haki flow.
In above panel, notice Luffy's hand - it is surrounded by clouds. Now where we saw similar phenomenon recently
Did you guys notice the similar clouds around Zoro? But what's interesting is Zoro immediately tamed enma implying his control over flow of haki (the concept on which Hyo was teaching Luffy advanced version). He did so because he already been taught such ability, first by kuina father and then during TS by Mihawk.
In above panel, notice Luffy's hand - it is surrounded by clouds. Now where we saw similar phenomenon recently
Did you guys notice the similar clouds around Zoro? But what's interesting is Zoro immediately tamed enma implying his control over flow of haki (the concept on which Hyo was teaching Luffy advanced version). He did so because he already been taught such ability, first by kuina father and then during TS by Mihawk.
Now, the last part - highly advanced usage of Armament or as some called penetration.
Hyo mentioned that there is much more advanced version of CoA which allows user to damage object from within after Luffy broke the collar without making it explode.
So yes, what Luffy end up learning is much more advanced version of CoA.
However, for a swordsman this ability seem to be in parallel with making blade black which Zoro has yet to do and for that he needs to become one with the sword.
Which Mihawk taught him but he is yet to do so
The black blade has been equated to breaking objects from within on the basis of inference drawn from the above panels.
Learning the flow of haki gives ability to cut anything yet nothing and ability of defection.
As Luffy practiced this, he instead of deflection, end up destroying collar from within. One can imply, that he infused his Haki into the collar, altered it properties to destroy it from within(penetration and destruction)
However, the same concept is inherent in making blade black. Through consistent use of flow of haki into blades through countless battles, the nature of the blade will permanently change making it harder and black.(penetration and modification)
So both breaking collar and making blade black is based on similar concept of flowing haki and changing nature of the object from within permanently, with difference lying in that former breaks it from within and other strengthens it from within. Thus both being placed as highly advanced usage of CoA.
So in short,
Basic CoA(Hitting Logia, coating/koka) - - - - >advanced CoA [deflection/shockwave; ability to cut anything yet nothing ; haki imbued slashes (it's also based on flow of haki into slashes from user)] - - - - - - >highly advanced usage of CoA (destroying objects from within and making blade black)
If you have any argument against this, please substantiate it with facts and not your headcannon. Lol
Thank you for reading this. Please post your opinion.
Post automatically merged:
Some tags
@Rivaille @Bogard @BossYimz
@Sentinel @hades @TheAncientCenturion @HA001 @Cyrus the Cactus @nik87 @Rukusho
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Great thread and I agree.
But where is it stated with "please substantiate it with facts and not your headcanon" that Making blades black is the same as destroying objects from within and I mean I want you to use what you said, "substantiate it with facts and not your headcanon".
Making black blades is the pinnacle of haki for a swordsman it never was stated or implied that it is the maximum level of COA, neither destroying objects from within?
"However, for a swordsman, this ability seems to be in parallel with making blade black which Zoro has yet to do and for that he needs to become one with the sword. "
This was your basis for the thesis, which from what you have said does not meet the threshold: "please substantiate it with facts and not your headcanon", black blades might be even higher than current COA peak and still not be the maximum of COA.
The rest I agree.
But where is it stated with "please substantiate it with facts and not your headcanon" that Making blades black is the same as destroying objects from within and I mean I want you to use what you said, "substantiate it with facts and not your headcanon".
Making black blades is the pinnacle of haki for a swordsman it never was stated or implied that it is the maximum level of COA, neither destroying objects from within?
"However, for a swordsman, this ability seems to be in parallel with making blade black which Zoro has yet to do and for that he needs to become one with the sword. "
This was your basis for the thesis, which from what you have said does not meet the threshold: "please substantiate it with facts and not your headcanon", black blades might be even higher than current COA peak and still not be the maximum of COA.
The rest I agree.
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Haki is a power that comes from will power and spirit. In wano, it's called ryuo. There are three types of haki (CoO, CoA and CoC) or one can say haki gives you three types of abilities. As one becomes proficient in any type of haki, ability given by that type of haki will also become advanced.
For example, Katakuri has Future sight, after being proficient in observation haki.
As both, advanced and basic abilities comes from same source, that is will power, they all are generally referred as haki/Ryuo
Now, let's talk about basic and advanced usage of CoA.(please read panels carefully)
In wano, Luffy called koka, coating of body with armament, a basic ability and showed desire to learn advanced ability(deflection/Shockwave ) as shown by Rayleigh.
Hyo after noticing what Luffy is trying to learn (advanced CoA:deflection) says that in wano they have a similar ability through which a swordsman can cut anything yet nothing(panel is given above) -that is he can cut steel if he desires or will not cut even a paper, if he doesn't desire.
He went on to demonstrate this ability by deflecting a gifter.
So advanced usage of CoA = defection/Shockwave and ability to cut anything yet nothing.
Now, let's move on to more interesting part.
Zoro indeed has unlocked ability to cut anything yet nothing in alabasta as he was taught by kuina father who apparently belongs to Wano and so is Zoro who is shimotsuki. He did so under extreme situation but just didn't realize it to have full grasp until TS where Mihawk taught him how to make blade black.
Another definitive proof of both Zoro and Luffy having advanced usage of CoA is explain below
Now, the last part - highly advanced usage of armament.
Hyo mentioned that there is much more advanced version of CoA which allows user to damage object from within after Luffy broke the collar without making it explode.
So yes, what Luffy end up learning is much more advanced version of CoA.
However, for a swordsman this ability seem to be in parallel with making blade black which Zoro has yet to do and for that he needs to become one with the sword.
Which Mihawk taught him but he is yet to do so
So in short,
Basic CoA(Hitting Logia, coating/koka) - - - - >advanced CoA [deflection/shockwave; ability to cut anything yet nothing ; haki imbued slashes (it's also based on flow of haki into slashes from user)] - - - - - - >highly advanced usage of CoA (destroying objects from within and making blade black)
If you have any argument against this, please substantiate it with facts and not your headcannon. Lol
Thank you for reading this. Please post your opinion.
Some tags
@Rivaille @Bogard @BossYimz
@Sentinel @hades @TheAncientCenturion @HA001 @Cyrus the Cactus @nik87 @Rukusho
For example, Katakuri has Future sight, after being proficient in observation haki.
As both, advanced and basic abilities comes from same source, that is will power, they all are generally referred as haki/Ryuo
Now, let's talk about basic and advanced usage of CoA.(please read panels carefully)
In wano, Luffy called koka, coating of body with armament, a basic ability and showed desire to learn advanced ability(deflection/Shockwave ) as shown by Rayleigh.
Luffy calling koka - basic
In panel below, Luffy calls deflection advanced
In panel below, Hyo said that deflection ability Luffy is trying to learn is similar to ability to cut anything yet nothing.
In panel below, Luffy calls deflection advanced
In panel below, Hyo said that deflection ability Luffy is trying to learn is similar to ability to cut anything yet nothing.
Hyo after noticing what Luffy is trying to learn (advanced CoA:deflection) says that in wano they have a similar ability through which a swordsman can cut anything yet nothing(panel is given above) -that is he can cut steel if he desires or will not cut even a paper, if he doesn't desire.
He went on to demonstrate this ability by deflecting a gifter.
Now, let's move on to more interesting part.
Zoro indeed has unlocked ability to cut anything yet nothing in alabasta as he was taught by kuina father who apparently belongs to Wano and so is Zoro who is shimotsuki. He did so under extreme situation but just didn't realize it to have full grasp until TS where Mihawk taught him how to make blade black.
This panel shows Zoro sensing the breathe of non living things and mention ability to cut anything yet nothing.
The panel below shows that Zoro dodged all falling stones as if he knew where they will fall(he was feeling the breathe of stones)
The panel below shows that Zoro even figured out under which stone his sword is buried.
And, in the panel below he demonstrated ability to cut anything yet nothing - he didn't cut leaves because he didn't desire but cut the stone because he desired. His swords understood his will. (similar to what Hyo said)
The panel below shows that Zoro dodged all falling stones as if he knew where they will fall(he was feeling the breathe of stones)
The panel below shows that Zoro even figured out under which stone his sword is buried.
And, in the panel below he demonstrated ability to cut anything yet nothing - he didn't cut leaves because he didn't desire but cut the stone because he desired. His swords understood his will. (similar to what Hyo said)
Another definitive proof of both Zoro and Luffy having advanced usage of CoA is explain below
As I said earlier, hyuo was teaching Luffy advanced usage of ryuo/haki - that is focusing on making haki flow.
In above panel, notice Luffy's hand - it is surrounded by clouds. Now where we saw similar phenomenon recently
Did you guys notice the similar clouds around Zoro? But what's interesting is Zoro immediately tamed enma implying his control over flow of haki (the concept on which Hyo was teaching Luffy advanced version). He did so because he already been taught such ability, first by kuina father and then during TS by Mihawk.
In above panel, notice Luffy's hand - it is surrounded by clouds. Now where we saw similar phenomenon recently
Did you guys notice the similar clouds around Zoro? But what's interesting is Zoro immediately tamed enma implying his control over flow of haki (the concept on which Hyo was teaching Luffy advanced version). He did so because he already been taught such ability, first by kuina father and then during TS by Mihawk.
Now, the last part - highly advanced usage of armament.
Hyo mentioned that there is much more advanced version of CoA which allows user to damage object from within after Luffy broke the collar without making it explode.
So yes, what Luffy end up learning is much more advanced version of CoA.
However, for a swordsman this ability seem to be in parallel with making blade black which Zoro has yet to do and for that he needs to become one with the sword.
Which Mihawk taught him but he is yet to do so
So in short,
Basic CoA(Hitting Logia, coating/koka) - - - - >advanced CoA [deflection/shockwave; ability to cut anything yet nothing ; haki imbued slashes (it's also based on flow of haki into slashes from user)] - - - - - - >highly advanced usage of CoA (destroying objects from within and making blade black)
If you have any argument against this, please substantiate it with facts and not your headcannon. Lol
Thank you for reading this. Please post your opinion.
Post automatically merged:
Some tags
@Rivaille @Bogard @BossYimz
@Sentinel @hades @TheAncientCenturion @HA001 @Cyrus the Cactus @nik87 @Rukusho
Anyway, another interesting thing is that we also indirectly got told that Zoro has had strong haki since loguetown east blue and the fact that he was able to tame sandai shows he had good haki control even in loguetown east blue.
In the latest chapter, we were told by Hitetsu that Sandai and Enma are similar in that weak people can't use them. The reason being is that they suck the haki of the users dry and then ultimately kill the weak people cause they dont hahavhahave enough haki and can't control the flow to force the sword to give them back their haki.
In the past Zoro said sandai was a problem child as it wanted to cause bloodshed and kill.
Enma is a problem child as it wants to make large cuts
However, Zorovmanaged to take Sandai and even Emma.
So this ultimately tells us Zoro always had strong haki since east blue.