Powers & Abilities The final “Sword Skill” thread
- Thread starter ImmaIvanoM
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We don’t know when Mihawk went on this journey, we don’t know when Mihawk made his sword black and we don’t know who he fought.
what we do know is that he has in fact gone around the world, even up to Mariejois and he genuinely believes he’s stronger than every swordsman he’s ever seen or heard of.
and his Vivre card confirms that He is ACTUALLY the Strongest swordsman in the world.
He is. The fact that Oda himself was asked what is an appropriate DF for Zoro and he chose this exact scenario, that means he thinks Zoro would still be a swordsman
And of course that means shamrock with his Cerberus sword is also a swordsman
what we do know is that he has in fact gone around the world, even up to Mariejois and he genuinely believes he’s stronger than every swordsman he’s ever seen or heard of.
and his Vivre card confirms that He is ACTUALLY the Strongest swordsman in the world.
He is. The fact that Oda himself was asked what is an appropriate DF for Zoro and he chose this exact scenario, that means he thinks Zoro would still be a swordsman
And of course that means shamrock with his Cerberus sword is also a swordsman
Whatever mental gymnastic that was.. Enma's personality is sucking Haki out of the user, Kinemon's Blades ability is creating fire and canceling explosions..
What are you on about.. Zoro didn't have full control of Enma until he completely tamed it when he awakened CoC.. It has nothing to do the cutting more than it needs too, nor about the teaching of Swordsmanship to cut anything and nothing..
Blacksmithing Philosophy =/= Swordsmanship Philosophy
What are you on about.. Zoro didn't have full control of Enma until he completely tamed it when he awakened CoC.. It has nothing to do the cutting more than it needs too, nor about the teaching of Swordsmanship to cut anything and nothing..
Blacksmithing Philosophy =/= Swordsmanship Philosophy
You’re saying I’m using mental gymnastics when you make shit up wholesale? Didn’t I tell you that Zoro was creating fire pre time skip when he cut Ryuma yet you insist that the fire attacks are due to “sword abilities”
and It seems your idea is that The flashback Zoro had during the king fight was for NOTHING? That literally nothing Kozaburo said had any baring on the fight. Zoro didn’t learn anything.
and you’re saying that the panel of Zoro saying he’s releasing so much Haki that he’s about to die also doesn’t mean anything.
And the panel of Zoro praising oden for using Enma at that level also doesn’t mean anything since that panel is about Zoro saying that the correct way of using Enma is giving it all the haki it wants and Oden is impressive for giving Enma all that haki so easily… None of this mattered.
so you've graduated from thinking Anything you make up is worth discussing as if it’s canon to the things that happened in canon don’t matter compared to whatever you believe
and It seems your idea is that The flashback Zoro had during the king fight was for NOTHING? That literally nothing Kozaburo said had any baring on the fight. Zoro didn’t learn anything.
and you’re saying that the panel of Zoro saying he’s releasing so much Haki that he’s about to die also doesn’t mean anything.
And the panel of Zoro praising oden for using Enma at that level also doesn’t mean anything since that panel is about Zoro saying that the correct way of using Enma is giving it all the haki it wants and Oden is impressive for giving Enma all that haki so easily… None of this mattered.
so you've graduated from thinking Anything you make up is worth discussing as if it’s canon to the things that happened in canon don’t matter compared to whatever you believe
I don't mind speculation but it needs to make sense.. Applying Blacksmith philosophy to Swordsman philosophy is comparing apples to oranges, or i'm missing something..
Most of it was lore, it came down to a '' Sword sees you and chooses it's wielder ''.. So Zoro realized Enma revealed itself in front of him to test him.. He was the one Lacking in power to wield Enma as light as feather.. And it's the Swordsman's duty to tame the Blade..
Giving it '' all the Haki it wants '' was for Zoro to awaken CoC, Enma didn't actually want a huge amount of CoA Haki, it wanted base CoC.. It wasn't giving Enma all the Haki it wanted, it was giving his very life(CoC) by facing death..
Most of it was lore, it came down to a '' Sword sees you and chooses it's wielder ''.. So Zoro realized Enma revealed itself in front of him to test him.. He was the one Lacking in power to wield Enma as light as feather.. And it's the Swordsman's duty to tame the Blade..
Giving it '' all the Haki it wants '' was for Zoro to awaken CoC, Enma didn't actually want a huge amount of CoA Haki, it wanted base CoC.. It wasn't giving Enma all the Haki it wanted, it was giving his very life(CoC) by facing death..
Sword Skill is the combined application of raw strength, haki, and technique using a sword.
Shanks fans are claiming despite Mihawk being the WSS, Shanks is stronger.
This means Shanks has more raw power and haki than Mihawk.
But Mihawk has greater skills which means his skills are more effective than Shanks,
despite Shanks being stronger in raw strength and haki.
This is what Shanks fans claim.
So how come Shanks is not the WSS if he's more powerful and on top of that skillful enough to use Kamusari at age 15?
Basically Shanks fans are telling us he is dumb asf.
It's like saying Shanks is the strongest weight lifter in the world.
But Mihawk is prime Mike Tyson.
Shanks fans are claiming despite Mihawk being the WSS, Shanks is stronger.
This means Shanks has more raw power and haki than Mihawk.
But Mihawk has greater skills which means his skills are more effective than Shanks,
despite Shanks being stronger in raw strength and haki.
This is what Shanks fans claim.
So how come Shanks is not the WSS if he's more powerful and on top of that skillful enough to use Kamusari at age 15?
Basically Shanks fans are telling us he is dumb asf.
It's like saying Shanks is the strongest weight lifter in the world.
But Mihawk is prime Mike Tyson.
Exactly, we don't know who fought amongst top tiers (not counting fodder he fights all the time), but we do know who he didn't fight. The list includes:
Keep in mind that Oda didn't hesitate with Rocks' introduction and immediately revealed that he killed an Admiral, he didn't do anything like that with Mihawk. I really wonder about Oda's thought process here. Strange, right!? And why wasn't Rocks' the WSS of his era? Because he clearly was. Like WTF Oda? This makes no sense, and it's strange that I'm the only one asking these questions. Is it possible that the only way you can get that title is by making a black blade? Kinda lame if you ask me, and it would mean that WSS isn't a strength title.
It's hard to tell what Mihawk thinks about the title since he rarely talks or mentions it, it's as if he doesn't give a fuck.
Keep in mind that Whitbeard's WSM title was explained by saying that "he lived as the world's strongest man, so that's why he was one." And since nobody in the community cares I guess that's enough explanation.
- Nusjuro
- Ryokugyu
- Fujitora
- Garling
- Shamrock
Keep in mind that Oda didn't hesitate with Rocks' introduction and immediately revealed that he killed an Admiral, he didn't do anything like that with Mihawk. I really wonder about Oda's thought process here. Strange, right!? And why wasn't Rocks' the WSS of his era? Because he clearly was. Like WTF Oda? This makes no sense, and it's strange that I'm the only one asking these questions. Is it possible that the only way you can get that title is by making a black blade? Kinda lame if you ask me, and it would mean that WSS isn't a strength title.
It's hard to tell what Mihawk thinks about the title since he rarely talks or mentions it, it's as if he doesn't give a fuck.
Keep in mind that Whitbeard's WSM title was explained by saying that "he lived as the world's strongest man, so that's why he was one." And since nobody in the community cares I guess that's enough explanation.
Because the title was created when mihawk singlehandedly went around the world to prove he is WSS
none of these titles existed before. Xebec wasn’t WSM or WSS or WSC. Because none of these titles existed back then. He also wasn’t pirate king since the term Pirate king was invented for Roger. The titles were created in SPECIFIC SITUATIONS.
WSC was created when the rumor that Kaido cannot lose in a 1v1 spread around the world. WSM was created when Whitebeard seemingly showed that he can singlehandedly end the world. (That’s why Whitebeard had the WSM title at the same time as Roger was pirate king and even at the same time as Imu was obviously around).
and Mihawk created the WSS title not simply by being The strongest swordsman, but by LITERALLY GOING AROUND THE WORLD TO PROVE IT. And yes, around the world includes Mariejois, Mihawk was a warlord, he has been to Mariejois. If he thought and Gorosei or Holy knight was stronger than him, he wouldn’t be WSS.
No he explicitly tells Zoro in Baratie that he’ll wait for him at the top of the world. Mihawk directly says he is the Top of all swordsmen. And this isn’t even Mihawk over inflating his position since in the same chapter he acknowledges that pirate king is a title above his own
and then later in Marineford Mihawk isn’t sure what the gap between him and WSM title is (although of course in this instance he’s thinking of the Prime WSM Whitebeard, he has no idea how much Whitebeard has deteriorated) So Mihawk is very fine with properly placing himself in the food chain of power. He’s not arrogant or delusional about his strength or anyone else’s strength. In that same arc, he’s fighting a weakling like Luffy and he soon realizes that actually Luffy has a power that already eclipses his own even in Marineford, the power to gather allies who are willing to die for his cause.
So not only does Mihawk legitimately think he is in fact the strongest swordsman across the entire one piece planet, he’s also incredibly conscious and humble about anyone being stronger than him and he seemingly doesn’t feel any which way about that.
In the manga the WSM title is associated with two feats. At first it was buggy saying that simply because Whitebeard could have an equal fight with Roger, that made him WSM. But then later on this feat isn’t even mentioned in Marineford and Sengoku only seems to care about the fact that he genuinely thinks Whitebeard can end the world.
and btw, this is a big deal type statement. I want to remind you that Imu cannot do this. Imu needs Vegapunk and decades of technology to replicate the mother flame and the ancient weapon Uranus, and 5 consecutive uses of Uranus to flood that world, AND THEN Imu would have managed to “end the world”. Supposedly Whitebeard can do a feat similar to this, BY HIMSELF.
And the vivre card says that Whitebeard’s was WSM before he even had that “equal fight with Roger” that we saw in the oden flashback (the fight that buggy was obviously exaggerating since it was entirely friendly). So I would say the Sengoku statement is more accurate about why Whitebeard is WSM. (But note that, Whitebeard’s title isn’t a 1v1 combat title like WSS and WSC in this case)
none of these titles existed before. Xebec wasn’t WSM or WSS or WSC. Because none of these titles existed back then. He also wasn’t pirate king since the term Pirate king was invented for Roger. The titles were created in SPECIFIC SITUATIONS.
WSC was created when the rumor that Kaido cannot lose in a 1v1 spread around the world. WSM was created when Whitebeard seemingly showed that he can singlehandedly end the world. (That’s why Whitebeard had the WSM title at the same time as Roger was pirate king and even at the same time as Imu was obviously around).
and Mihawk created the WSS title not simply by being The strongest swordsman, but by LITERALLY GOING AROUND THE WORLD TO PROVE IT. And yes, around the world includes Mariejois, Mihawk was a warlord, he has been to Mariejois. If he thought and Gorosei or Holy knight was stronger than him, he wouldn’t be WSS.
No he explicitly tells Zoro in Baratie that he’ll wait for him at the top of the world. Mihawk directly says he is the Top of all swordsmen. And this isn’t even Mihawk over inflating his position since in the same chapter he acknowledges that pirate king is a title above his own
and then later in Marineford Mihawk isn’t sure what the gap between him and WSM title is (although of course in this instance he’s thinking of the Prime WSM Whitebeard, he has no idea how much Whitebeard has deteriorated) So Mihawk is very fine with properly placing himself in the food chain of power. He’s not arrogant or delusional about his strength or anyone else’s strength. In that same arc, he’s fighting a weakling like Luffy and he soon realizes that actually Luffy has a power that already eclipses his own even in Marineford, the power to gather allies who are willing to die for his cause.
So not only does Mihawk legitimately think he is in fact the strongest swordsman across the entire one piece planet, he’s also incredibly conscious and humble about anyone being stronger than him and he seemingly doesn’t feel any which way about that.
In the manga the WSM title is associated with two feats. At first it was buggy saying that simply because Whitebeard could have an equal fight with Roger, that made him WSM. But then later on this feat isn’t even mentioned in Marineford and Sengoku only seems to care about the fact that he genuinely thinks Whitebeard can end the world.
and btw, this is a big deal type statement. I want to remind you that Imu cannot do this. Imu needs Vegapunk and decades of technology to replicate the mother flame and the ancient weapon Uranus, and 5 consecutive uses of Uranus to flood that world, AND THEN Imu would have managed to “end the world”. Supposedly Whitebeard can do a feat similar to this, BY HIMSELF.
And the vivre card says that Whitebeard’s was WSM before he even had that “equal fight with Roger” that we saw in the oden flashback (the fight that buggy was obviously exaggerating since it was entirely friendly). So I would say the Sengoku statement is more accurate about why Whitebeard is WSM. (But note that, Whitebeard’s title isn’t a 1v1 combat title like WSS and WSC in this case)
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Anything that is achievable by sword, Mihawk can do it best. Cut through anything. Cut ice berg. Not cut through the paper. Turn the sword Black.
Roger didn't turn his sword Black, his sword skills inferior. Green bull turned his sword black, his sword skills superior and he's better swordmaster. 🤷
Roger didn't turn his sword Black, his sword skills inferior. Green bull turned his sword black, his sword skills superior and he's better swordmaster. 🤷
But how did he prove it though? And who did he prove it to? Hopefully we'll find it out in his flashback. The most likely scenario for now is that a Morgan type journalists started calling him WSS, similar how they called Roger "Pirate King," they even changed his last name from Gol. D. Roger to Gold Roger to hide his origin.
I absolutely agree with you, I've been arguing this for years. These titles never existed and are a relatively new things introduced by the free flow of information. Now the grand achievements of certain individuals are being reported to people world wide.
Sure, all these titles were CALLED BY SOMEONE, because somebody had to SPREAD IT ALL OVER THE WORLD. I mean the achievements of certain individuals, because otherwise nobody would know about them.
But how though? This is one of those things that seem to be spread intentionally. Because if we assume that Gura Gura=Ancient weapons then it should be classified as one, or at the very least be put on the same pedestal. And why isn't Blackbeard WSM now, he has the DF? If we assume Whitebeard could destroy the world without his DF, then he was the strongest character ever lol. Plus, the existence of Imu is a secret, so nobody puts him in the equation of WS titles, because nobody knows that he exists in the first place.
How did he prove it though? We're back to the same question. Did he defeat some BIG NAMES, OR SOME SERIOUS HEAVY HITTERS? All the known heavy hitters never fought him. I mean there's a possibility Oda will create new top tier swordsmen just for Mihawk, but that would require an insanely long flashback. I hope he does it though, because I'd love to see additional top tier swordsmen.
Again, he never talks about it though. Like he never tells us his opinion and who considers a strong swordsmen etc.
Sure, he tells Zoro he will not lose his title until Zoro challenges him again. But he never mentioned how he got, what did he do something SO GRAND THAT IT CREATED A TITLE THAT NEVER EXISTED BEFORE, AND BOTH ROCKS AND ROGER COULDN'T DO THAT. Mihawk clearly did something that Rocks and Roger couldn't, and the only thing that comes to mind is the black blade. Honestly, it's the only thing that stands out! And the only thing sword related was mentioned in Wano arc was the black blades, it could be way more important we think.
Exactly, that's why I'm surprised (as I mentioned above) that Gura Gura isn't equal to ancient weapons.
I absolutely agree with you, I've been arguing this for years. These titles never existed and are a relatively new things introduced by the free flow of information. Now the grand achievements of certain individuals are being reported to people world wide.
Sure, all these titles were CALLED BY SOMEONE, because somebody had to SPREAD IT ALL OVER THE WORLD. I mean the achievements of certain individuals, because otherwise nobody would know about them.
But how though? This is one of those things that seem to be spread intentionally. Because if we assume that Gura Gura=Ancient weapons then it should be classified as one, or at the very least be put on the same pedestal. And why isn't Blackbeard WSM now, he has the DF? If we assume Whitebeard could destroy the world without his DF, then he was the strongest character ever lol. Plus, the existence of Imu is a secret, so nobody puts him in the equation of WS titles, because nobody knows that he exists in the first place.
How did he prove it though? We're back to the same question. Did he defeat some BIG NAMES, OR SOME SERIOUS HEAVY HITTERS? All the known heavy hitters never fought him. I mean there's a possibility Oda will create new top tier swordsmen just for Mihawk, but that would require an insanely long flashback. I hope he does it though, because I'd love to see additional top tier swordsmen.
Again, he never talks about it though. Like he never tells us his opinion and who considers a strong swordsmen etc.
Sure, he tells Zoro he will not lose his title until Zoro challenges him again. But he never mentioned how he got, what did he do something SO GRAND THAT IT CREATED A TITLE THAT NEVER EXISTED BEFORE, AND BOTH ROCKS AND ROGER COULDN'T DO THAT. Mihawk clearly did something that Rocks and Roger couldn't, and the only thing that comes to mind is the black blade. Honestly, it's the only thing that stands out! And the only thing sword related was mentioned in Wano arc was the black blades, it could be way more important we think.
Exactly, that's why I'm surprised (as I mentioned above) that Gura Gura isn't equal to ancient weapons.
He doesn’t have the experience with the fruit that Whitebeard has. I mean this isn’t the first time we have seen a situation where two people have the same fruit yet one person’s proficiency with the fruit isn’t as good as another person’s.
I mean maybe Blackbeard will reach this level by the time he’s fighting Luffy, but we can just assume he didn’t instantaneously acquire Whitebeard’s level of Fruit mastery
His words are “I will wait for you at the top”
The information about how he got the title only exists in the Vivre card about him sailing the world fighting people.
That’s the new thing that Mihawk did that Roger or xebec didn’t do. xebec seemingly had a world wide tour of Davy back fights to collect pirates which is similar except here he’s only targeting pirates. Roger also had a word wide tour but his was collecting poneglyph information for 13 years so he wasn’t going around getting into fights for the sake of it. Mihawk’s world wide tour was entirely based on him fighting any swordsman he thought he needed to until he was the top
I’m not gonna pretend I know who he fought and what happened, but this is the canon statement for what happened and that’s all we can go off of
I mean maybe Blackbeard will reach this level by the time he’s fighting Luffy, but we can just assume he didn’t instantaneously acquire Whitebeard’s level of Fruit mastery
His words are “I will wait for you at the top”
The information about how he got the title only exists in the Vivre card about him sailing the world fighting people.
That’s the new thing that Mihawk did that Roger or xebec didn’t do. xebec seemingly had a world wide tour of Davy back fights to collect pirates which is similar except here he’s only targeting pirates. Roger also had a word wide tour but his was collecting poneglyph information for 13 years so he wasn’t going around getting into fights for the sake of it. Mihawk’s world wide tour was entirely based on him fighting any swordsman he thought he needed to until he was the top
I’m not gonna pretend I know who he fought and what happened, but this is the canon statement for what happened and that’s all we can go off of
