Character Discussion The impressiveness of Eustass Kidd and massacre soldier Killer

[hedera__helix]

You realize he can be both a dark Luffy and a rival right? Those are not mutually exclusive. Kidd serves as both a rival and foil for Luffy. The same way Luffy’s nemesis Blackbeard is also a foil for him. Lol I seriously have no idea how this is even an argument. The author has obviously set up Kidd as Luffy’s rival whether you like him or not. Kidd has never once shown to be a weakling, it’s you guys that have this headcanon that he is a scrub compared to Luffy and that is what clouds your vision I guess.

He's a "rival" in the sense that they argue I guess...but he's not a serious threat to Luffy's dream of being Pirate King in the same way as Blackbeard is. He's supposed to represent what would have happened to Luffy if he didn't take that 2 year gap aka a bunch of lost battles, crippled subordinates, etc. I just don't see him as a serious rival

 

[Ricassian]

- Even before the fight started killer became luffy fanboy that's what we said before , and just from his speech u can think that he had that idea he will lose against kaido with kid he doesn't have that faith in kid even when he is with him but the inverse happened and he got that faith from Luffy things aren't good for kid fans

"Killer has no faith in Kidd"

 

[Pantheos]

It’s pretty simple.
Luffy vs Kid, good fight
Strawhat Pirates vs Kid Pirates, Strawhats stomp. The M3 alone might manage to beat them tbh, add in Jinbei and it’s a cert
Strawhats and Grand Fleet vs Kid Pirates, complete annihilation
Strawhats using just the people he’s officially allied with vs Kid Pirates, Kid Pirates are wiped off the face of the earth.

.

But at the same time you claim BB is the true Rival of Luffy.

Strawhats and Grand Fleet and friends vs BB pirates -> ???
You think that would go otherwise than complete annihilation?

 

[Jo_Ndule]

It shows that Oda has actually displayed the two of them as opponents. Kid? He’s Luffy’s backup.

Yeah, and Luffy and Smoker could easily fight in the future. There’s actual build up to it. With Luffy saying they will... fight in the future,



Kid’s portrayal is not enough to put him above Law. PH Smoker? Yeah, that’s fair.


Oda, I’d imagine


I’m sorry, we’re talking about One Piece here, not DBZ.


And do you think people really want to see Luffy fight his backup in the Kaido fight, who Luffy is also already stronger than?


Killer’s one of the pirates in Oden’s prophecy as well.

Doesn’t make him much of a rival to Luffy either.


Luffy will be Yonko level by the time he beats Kaido. We’re going to see him, at some point in this fight, be able to fight Kaido one on one. The gap between Luffy and Blackbeard is closing rapidly.

And what makes Blackbeard the great rival to Luffy is that he is that step ahead. Kid isn’t, he’s miles behind Luffy in the race to be the Pirate King.




I don’t hate Kid. I think he’s pretty strong.

But he’s weaker than Luffy, the two are allies instead of fighting each other, and aside from Killer his crew is crap. That’s why he fails as a rival.


I’m proving that Oda has actually bothered to show Luffy and Blackbeard hate each other and fight each other evenly, while all Luffy and Kid do is play dumb games and fight as allies. That’s why Blackbeard is portrayed as Luffy’s biggest rival.


So? Yeah, Blackbeard’s a step ahead of Luffy. That’s what makes him such a great rival. Compared to Kid, who has been completely overshadowed by Luffy’s accomplishments his entire existence.


It very much does. One Piece since we entered the Grand Line has been the story of Luffy and Blackbeard rising in parallel through the pirate world, going from complete unknowns to being heralded as Emperors, and then in the future fighting to be the Pirate King.




Kid isn’t Luffy’s rival because a fight between the two of them, with all of their powers assembled, would be a massacre in favour of Luffy.

Luffy can bring himself, his nine crewmates, his grand fleet featuring seven fleet captains. Let alone any other allies that could show up like the Scabbards (samurai and Minks), Sabo or Law.
Kid can bring himself, Killer, two dudes that were named in a databook and a load of fodder.

It’s not about Kid’s strength as an individual, it’s about his military power as a pirate. That’s where Luffy completely outmatches him. That’s why Luffy was called an Emperor after WCI. Luffyis capable of taking on an Emperor’s full forces- he might not win, but he’s got enough to give it a shot. Kid would be annihilated. His own first mate this very chapter just revealed to us that he only thinks they have a shot of winning against Kaido because of Luffy.
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Proceeds to do things Luffy’s way anyway

So you base your rivalry with Teach on future events
Then do it also for Kidd

Since both kidd and Luffy will be Yonko level/Admiral level post Wano

Should I remind you that Newgate was a step behind Roger in piracy? Even shiki? Roger had 12+ years headstart and was in prime before WB and Shiki did.
He became Great pirate before WB did
He had a stronger crew even
Yet WB was his rival ! Equal even.

Only Xebec was a step ahead... guess who's the xebec of this era? Teach.
Ahead of Luffy and Kidd

It's not about headstarts or being a step ahead

Oda considers Teach and Kidd as Luffy's rivals
Even Law. Despite being a lackey now

 

[ReggieZoldyck21]

Luffy vs Kid, good fight

That’s all I needed to hear. I’m talking about Luffy vs Kidd. Not Luffys crew, Law, Sabo, Hancock, Scabbards, Minks, and Germa vs. Kidd’s crew. Like I said, you give him all of his friends he’s ever made and he’s beating Blackbeard right now lol.

 

[Jo_Ndule]

But at the same time you claim BB is the true Rival of Luffy.

Strawhats and Grand Fleet and friends vs BB pirates -> ???
You think that would go otherwise than complete annihilation?

He will start mentioning assumptions

Luffy couldn't escape BMP without allies even
Rookie Kidd fought RHP and survived with his own crew... didnt need allies. Went to tottoland and escaped safely.

Rookie kidd has done what Luffy couldn't do : survive against yonko army and not be caught without needing allies

 

[Shimotsuki Fenaker]

"Killer has no faith in Kidd"

he said after he saw luffy << then we have chance of winning >>
before that he thinks he doesn't have a chance to win with kid backing him up
who gave him that faith ? Luffy not kid

Killer is luffy fanboy

 

[imacub]

1. To make Luffy constantly salty at him (even when Kidd isn't paying attention to him) means that he sees him as a true competitor, his strenght is implied in this but anyway Kidd will show it during the progress of the battle
2. I never said that BB isn't the final enemy, I'm the first that thinks BB will be the Laugh Tale antagonist. Kidd will fall before that, in Lodestar

Did you read what I suggested you to?

1. What does being salty has to do with rivalry? Luffy-Kidd dynamic is just the same as Luffy-Law dynamic
2. Well my bad, i thought you're implying BB will be irrelevant. If that's the case, how that justify Current Kidd being equal to Current Luffy?

 

[Pantheos]

he said after he saw luffy << then we have chance of winning >>
before that he thinks he doesn't have a chance to win with kid backing him up
who gave him that faith ? Luffy not kid

Killer is luffy fanboy

Ah, again you, which fakes manga panels to fit his damage controll.

Killer just made fun out of the moment and acknowledged Luffy, like everyone else did. He still wouldnt hesitate to attack Luffy if Kid wants to.

 

[hedera__helix]

You can't tell me that Killer only having faith that they can win against Kaido after seeing Luffy hurt him doesn't make Kidd look bad.

 

[Shimotsuki Fenaker]

Ah, again you, which fakes manga panels to fit his damage controll.

Killer just made fun out of the moment and acknowledged Luffy, like everyone else did. He still wouldnt hesitate to attack Luffy if Kid wants to.

u are just making shit up here though his speech is clear as day no fun no shit lmao he said he has a chance of winning now then before he doesn't even have that faith in that idea with kid backing him up even when kid himself said the last chapter guys u came to see what i will do Killer became a luffy fanboy just before even the fight starts

 

[Garp the Fist]

But at the same time you claim BB is the true Rival of Luffy.

Strawhats and Grand Fleet and friends vs BB pirates -> ???
You think that would go otherwise than complete annihilation?

Of course it wouldn’t. They’d lose, but they’d put up a fight. Just look at the current fight. Who’s being set up to beat Kaido, the Calamities and the TR? The Strawhats. The weakling trio still have a way to go, but Luffy, Zoro, Sanji, Jinbei and Franky are all doing pretty damn well so far, and you’d expect Robin and Brook to join in.

Folks need to realise that after Wano- One Piece is nearly over. Luffy and his crew will be well worthy of being called Great Pirates, that’s why Shanks is finally getting ready to meet Luffy.

 

[Ricassian]

1. What does being salty has to do with rivalry? Luffy-Kidd dynamic is just the same as Luffy-Law dynamic
2. Well my bad, i thought you're implying BB will be irrelevant. If that's the case, how that justify Current Kidd being equal to Current Luffy?

Simple reason that Luffy isn't a salty person, he has this kind of reactions with Kidd only. He feels kinda insecure around him and the other way around
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He still wouldnt hesitate to attack Luffy if Kid wants to.

He for sure wouldn't hesitate, dude is up in front of 2 Emperors. Imagine thinking he would hesitate in going for Luffy head

 

[Pantheos]

Of course it wouldn’t. They’d lose, but they’d put up a fight. Just look at the current fight. Who’s being set up to beat Kaido, the Calamities and the TR? The Strawhats. The weakling trio still have a way to go, but Luffy, Zoro, Sanji, Jinbei and Franky are all doing pretty damn well so far, and you’d expect Robin and Brook to join in.

Folks need to realise that after Wano- One Piece is nearly over. Luffy and his crew will be well worthy of being called Great Pirates, that’s why Shanks is finally getting ready to meet Luffy.

And with Luffy together, Law and Kid will also acknowledged as Great Pirates who took down a Yonko (together). For sure and without any doubt, at the end of story, of even from now on permanently, Luffy will always be a step ahead of Kid. But as comparison, Goku is always a step ahead of Vegeta, but that doesnt change their rivality. Kid wont bow down and accept his step back, he will aim for the lead, no matter what, even tho we know Luffy will get the titel EOS.

 

[Garp the Fist]

And with Luffy together, Law and Kid will also acknowledged as Great Pirates who took down a Yonko (together). For sure and without any doubt, at the end of story, of even from now on permanently, Luffy will always be a step ahead of Kid. But as comparison, Goku is always a step ahead of Vegeta, but that doesnt change their rivality. Kid wont bow down and accept his step back, he will aim for the lead, no matter what, even tho we know Luffy will get the titel EOS.

Kid doesn’t deserve to be a Great Pirate after Wano anymore than Law does. Or Zoro and Killer, for that matter. In the future, sure, Kid and Law can get there. Not right now. Their achievements pale in comparison to Luffy, and being a great pirate (and thus able to meet Shanks again) is something we’ve been waiting since chapter one for Luffy to be. It dilutes Luffy’s achievement if it’s matched by any of the current generation right now.

 

[Pantheos]

Kid doesn’t deserve to be a Great Pirate after Wano anymore than Law does. Or Zoro and Killer, for that matter. In the future, sure, Kid and Law can get there. Not right now. Their achievements pale in comparison to Luffy, and being a great pirate (and thus able to meet Shanks again) is something we’ve been waiting since chapter one for Luffy to be. It dilutes Luffy’s achievement if it’s matched by any of the current generation right now.

And still, they are on the top of the roof together. Or do you claim luffy will take down Kaido solo? Otherwise it will be a Luffy/Kid/Law vs Kaido win and all 3 need to be acknowledged for that!?

 

[Garp the Fist]

And still, they are on the top of the roof together. Or do you claim luffy will take down Kaido solo? Otherwise it will be a Luffy/Kid/Law vs Kaido win and all 3 need to be acknowledged for that!?

It’s not Luffy/Kid/Law that’s fighting them, it’s Luffy/Kid/Zoro/Law/Killer. All of them will play a role in defeating Kaido- but Luffy’s will be the biggest. And it’s Luffy’s crew that is defeating Kaido’s crew, which also counts towards his achievements towards being a Great Pirate. Remember, Luffy didn’t just say he’d be stronger than Shanks- he said he’d have a better crew than him as well. I’m fairly confident in saying that Kid and Law will never do that, no matter how strong they both become.

 

[Tai long]

Luffy has no real rival, he grows to fast. Kidd was never being portrayed as a rival. Kidd and his pirate group can't compare to luffy and the strawhat pirates. Blackbeard was never as weak as pre or post timeskip luffy so the can't be considered rivals. Blackbeard has always being the stronger one of the two.

 

[imacub]

Simple reason that Luffy isn't a salty person, he has this kind of reactions with Kidd only. He feels kinda insecure around him and the other way around
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He for sure wouldn't hesitate, dude is up in front of 2 Emperors. Imagine thinking he would hesitate in going for Luffy head

still doesnt necessarily mean they're equals

Honest question, do you think kidd pirates could put a fight against Luffy+Zoro the WSS+Sanji+Yamato the son of Kaido (possibly)+Jinbe+others?

Let it be current or EoS

 

[Ricassian]

still doesnt necessarily mean they're equals

Honest question, do you think kidd pirates could put a fight against Luffy+Zoro the WSS+Sanji+Yamato the son of Kaido (possibly)+Jinbe+others?

Let it be current or EoS

For what is shown as of now their crews arent' comparable obviously, but there are high chances that Kidd will recruit strong people after the war