General & Others The Misunderstood Greatness of Charlotte Katakuri

Senfret · Apr 23, 2020

Nani??!! Lee is about to make a Thread that isn't about Power Levels? TF is this?

Yeah yeah yeah, don't blow a gasket...Lol

So this is actually a post I've wanted to do for a long time now, and being inspired by the new Katakuri threads that were created just recently, I figured I would take a crack at this now. On spoiler day. Genius amirite?

I've seen a lot of people in this community spreading the idea that Katakuri is a poorly written character. I've seen this sentiment take on a few different forms and I've been on and off with these ideas myself (even as Katakuri has occupied a Top 5 spot in my personal favorite OP characters list), but since I've been seeing the regulars here saying he's poorly written, I decided that I would give it my earnest to look at Katakuri as a character and determine for myself whether or not he was actually objectively well written or not. After truly taking a look at Katakuri's life and character, I came to the conclusion that he is one of the best characters that Oda has ever written, and that his fight with Luffy really is one of the best Shonen fights I've ever read. Truly a worthy addition to anyone's top 5 favorite OP character list.

"That's a big statement" you might be saying to yourself, which is good, because if you are thinking this, then you are exactly the type of person I am targeting with this post.

So first off, a question that I feel it is necessary to answer before we even start: Sure Katakuri may have been overlooked by our Fandom as a whole, but...why is a big post like this even necessary? Surely anyone reading this post can just go back and reread the fight if they want to, right? If Katakuri is such an objectively great character, then it shouldn't take a giant essay like post to convince people of that, right? They should just be able to read the Manga and come to that conclusion on their own.

Well, yes and no.

You see, I think this thread is necessary for two reasons:

1. Katakuri is a pretty complex character by Shonen standards, and his underlying motivations and character arc are not easy to understand, even as someone who has read his fight with Luffy and looked over his panel time repeatedly, and as someone who enjoys analyzing fictional characters lol.

2. Oda doesn't actually make it super obvious what Katakuri's character arc even is, or even what his motivations are. So much so that even when I fully thought I understood Katakuri's character the first time reading the Luffy fight through, Chapter 902 came out and pretty much obliterated what I thought I believed about him lol.

So, adding these two points together, and in other words: Katakuri's character and arc are really easy to miss or not notice since Oda doesn't really elaborate on what is actually happening with the Dawg over the course of the fight. Hence, this thread lol. I'm not going to elaborate on the criticisms levied against him, instead I wanted to delve into his psyche and motivations and see exactly what makes him so memorable to myself and many others. With hindsight being 20/20 (pun intended?) I figured now was a great time to take another look at him.

So, let's do this! And thank you all in advance for taking some time to read this gargantuan post lol.

Part I: Core Character and Motivation
So first up, let's look at Katakuri when he was a child, because his motives as a child give us heavy insight into the man he grows into:

From a young age, Katakuri was actually very sensitive to how others thought of his appearance. His looks didn't bother him personally, but he seemed to care so seriously about what others thought of him that he threatened to beat up anyone who laughed at him.

This insecurity gets redirected very quickly:

When instead of coming after him, his "enemies" went after his sister. This has a pretty severe effect on him, as he covers up his actual appearance in order to ultimately protect his family from being harmed because of the way he lives:

This becomes the running theme for Katakuri later in his life. He essentially decides to become something that he is not, IE "the perfect invincible man" in order to protect his family from harm. "Covering up your true self" isn't something exclusive to Kata within the Big Mom Pirates, there are several of his siblings who have designs that show how they cover up who they really are for one reason or another, the most obvious examples I can point to are Pudding:

Who covers up her third eye because she was made fun of for it (even by her own mother) And Cracker:

Who covers up his true appearance because he hates pain. The idea of covering up who you truly are underneath and putting on an external facade is actually one of the core themes of the Whole Cake Island Arc. On the surface, the Big Mom Pirates appear to be a giant family, as they are a giant Pirate crew related by blood and marriages and such, but underneath, their are several moments in the arc where they directly or indirectly harm one another, and otherwise show a lack of caring for the wants and needs of their family. While the Straw Hats on the other hand on the surface appear to be a simple Pirate Crew, a rag-tag group of individuals bound together by nothing, but underneath it is their deep seeded caring for one another and willingness to make huge sacrifices for each other that ties them together, making them a true "family." At least, this is what Oda was going for lol.

The reason that Katakuri covering up his true self is important, is that Katakuri's character design actually changes over the course of the fight, and this change in design is symbolic of Katakuri shedding the identity that he created for himself and revealing who he truly is underneath. This change wouldn't be possible without Luffy, but before we get into that, let's look at another crucially important aspect of Katakuri's Character, the hype surrounding the images of himself that he created.

Part II: Becoming the Hype
There are a few different examples of Katakuri being hyped into oblivion by his own family, whether it be Brulee, Oven, Flampe, the Chefs, the soldiers that accompany him to fight Luffy, etc. But the best moment of Katakuri being hyped into oblivion is this one:

And the reason that this moment is the best is because we see Katakuri's actual reaction to the hype. From his words that are drowned out by Brulee hyping him up, as well as his sigh, we can infer that Katakuri actually doesn't like hearing the own hype that he has decided to embody repeated back at him.

This is interesting because it shows us the conflict within him. On the one hand, he wants to embody the hype in order to protect his family. On the other hand, he doesn't want to embody the hype because it's not who he is as a person.

Having both of these two sentiments present at the same time creates a feeling of pressure-Katakuri wants to be himself, but he can't, as he feels that the best way to keep the people he cares about safe is to have his enemies be terrified of the hyped up version of himself that he has created. He may also consider his true self, the true self we discussed earlier, to be what will ultimately lead to his family suffering harm.

This is probably the ultimate reason that Katakuri has his Merienda every day, as it's a time where he can isolate himself to relieve all the pressure that he himself and his family put on him, and just let lose. It's a time where he can let down all of the weight that he carries on his shoulders:

And just relax for a while.

I love this moment. It's just really funny to me:

Lord Dogtooth is conversing with the "War Spirits" other translations have said the "War God" and no one is to interrupt this "Sacred Ritual." The level of hype here is so ridiculous that it's actually comedic, and it also contributes to the rhetoric of his hype.

Now, just to sum up who Katakuri is, Katakuri is a man who essentially created a false identity for himself because he believes that the perceptions around him will allow him to keep his family safe. Katakuri simultaneously wants to hold up this perception of himself (because it protects his family) but simultaneously doesn't like this perception because the pressure that he's putting on himself to embody the perception is enormous, and on top of that, he likes who he actually is underneath rather than who he pretends to be.

Now with that said, it's time to look at how his fight with Luffy causes him to evolve past himself.

Part 3: Character Arc and Development
Katakuri spends the early portion of his fight with Luffy completely trolling his opponent:

Literally just making moves up on the spot and still overwhelming him

The important part of the early fight is that I don't believe that this Katakuri, the Katakuri who trolls Luffy, is actually who Katakuri is as a person. There are two reasons I don't believe this:

1. Katakuri is still both metaphorically and literally covering his true self up. He is still "playing the part" of the invincible man that he's hyping himself up to be, and his true appearance is still covered up by his scarf, which is symbolic of how he is hiding his true self from the world by the false hype he created for himself.

2. Katakuri is literally making up moves and attacks here. These aren't really a part of his actual fighting style, these are just moves he's creating to troll Luffy. Quite literally, Katakuri is not being who he actually is by using this fighting style.

Katakuri continuously mocks Luffy through the early phases of the fight:

There could be a number of reasons for this, but I like to think that the main reason Luffy has not earned Kuri's respect is how erratic and imperfect Luffy's fighting style actually is. Katakuri is repeatedly knocking Luffy on his ass, and Luffy continuously gets up to keep fighting, while Luffy hasn't made Katakuri's back even touch the ground one time. Katakuri probably sees such an ungraceful/barbaric fighting method as the opposite of his own fighting method, and I think Oda did this on purpose. Having Luffy fly and flail around like an ungraceful monkey, while Katakuri stands tall and gallant throughout the entire fight.

However, it doesn't take too long for Katakuri's actual motivation to shine through:

As Luffy starts to attack his siblings. In the same way that Luffy is fighting Katakuri to protect his crew, Katakuri is also fighting to protect his family, both directly and indirectly. Indirectly by fighting the Straw Hat Captain while his siblings face the rest of the crew, and Directly by stopping Luffy from actually physically attacking his siblings. This is one of the many ways that Katakuri and Luffy "Mirror" each other this fight, but honestly the "mirroring" between Luffy and Katakuri and this fight in general deserves a thread of it's own lol. Maybe I'll do that some day, who knows.

However, as the fight progresses, Kuri begins to grow respect for Luffy:

But even more important than Katakuri's growing respect, or really fear initially, for Luffy is the fact that Luffy actually sees who Katakuri actually is when he finds Katakuri during Merienda. Now the fight has really changed, because not only is Katakuri growing respect towards his enemy, but Luffy is both literally and metaphorically (and accidentally lol) shattering the perception that Katakuri has created around himself:

This moment here in particular, of Luffy kicking Katakuri's mouth out of his scarf, is very symbolic of how Luffy is (accidentally) exposing who Katakuri truly is from the facade that he created.

Katakuri's respect continues to grow for Luffy, especially right here:

And especially here, where Luffy starts to pick up on Katakuri's own Future Sight:

Katakuri would state that he was even beginning to acknowledge Luffy's strength (meaning that he didn't consider Luffy a worthy opponent before):

But the important thing to note is that Katakuri is not yet ready to shed the facade that he has adopted for himself, as the only time Luffy almost knocks him onto his back:

Katakuri shows us that he is not ready to drop the act just yet.

But things go on, and we meet this little shit:

Who is probably the walking embodiment of the big hypocrisy behind Katakuri's actions: the fact that most of his family (the younger siblings and probably most of Tottoland in General) don't actually appreciate him for who he truly is, but rather only care for and idolize the facade that he's created for himself.

So when Katakuri pulls this:

We as the reader can see that the facade is what the majority of Tottoland would prefer to who Katakuri actually is underneath, his core character. I will mention here, this is where Katakuri lost a lot of readers. A lot of people thought that this moment was out of the blue. And could Oda have done a better job at preparing or foreshadowing this? Absolutely yes.

However, the reason I don't think this moment ruins Katakuri as a character, is because when we take a look back at the fight from start to finish, as well as Katakuri's brief childhood backstory...This is really who he actually is as a person. This is probably the most important thing I will type in this entire thread: The Katakuri who fans thought we had come to know before this point, is just the facade. This Katakuri is who he actually is underneath the act that he created for himself. And it is as a direct result of Luffy's actions in the fight, as well as the steadily improving perception that Katakuri has had for him, that this side of Katakuri is revealed to Flampe.

This is why Oda chooses now to have Katakuri remove his scarf. He is both literally and metaphorically shedding the facade and embracing his actual identity. And what do we find underneath his Scarf?

On the back of his jacket, the name "Charlotte." The symbolic meaning behind the word "Charlotte" on Katakuri's back should be pretty obvious, but what's a bit more subtle is about how Katakuri carries his family name underneath his scarf, which is meant to hide himself from the world. Yeah, we literally cannot see the word Charlotte on his back until after he takes his scarf off. On a deeper level, this is a visual representation of how the underlying motivation for Katakuri's Facade (the scarf), and thus how seriously he values the well-being of his family, is the conviction that he has for keeping his family safe. Hence, the family name being literally hidden under his scarf. This is what a brilliant character design looks like (though I won't go off on a tangent on why I love Kuri's overall design here.)

It is not a coincidence that we discover this about Katakuri when we do, as this happens just after Flampe reveals how little her blood connection/familial ties to Katakuri are actually worth:

As all it took was one look at his true appearance, his true self, for her to throw away all of her previous idolization of him. Very literally, Katakuri sighing in the panel that we see his family name on his jacket, is the moment where Katakuri realizes the hypocrisy of covering up his true self in order to protect his family, a family that doesn't value him for who he truly is in the first place.

This complete and utter lack of respect was not reciprocated by his enemy, as Luffy blames himself for not being able to dodge Kuri (even though it clearly wasn't his fault), while simultaneously not caring in the slightest about Katakuri's true appearance, only concerned with his strength:

And then, the culmination of Katakuri's slowly improving perception of Luffy:

From a narrative perspective, the absolute best way of Oda showing two characters as equals, not necessarily in strength, but equal in ambition/stature/worthiness/whatever, is an equal clash of Conqueror's Haki, and this is exactly what we get. It is now that Katakuri sheds his jacket and shows us that beautiful Mochi Phi$ique, and the timing of this moment could not be more perfect. On a symbolic level, Katakuri tossing the jacket off of his back shows that he has found something that he considers more important than protecting a family who doesn't value him the way he values them: a fight the likes of which he has never faced in his life, a fight against an opponent who sees him and his true form for what he is actually worth.

This moment right here, to be exact, is the moment where Luffy has fully earned Katakuri's respect:

It's from this point on where things get very interesting. This is not only the point where Katakuri stops trolling Luffy fully, but this is also where Katakuri starts to show the same amount of passion in the fight that Luffy himself does:

And then we get Katakuri Vs Snake Man, which is really the only time in this entire battle where both Luffy and Katakuri are actually fighting an opponent to which they are virtually equal to in strength. From a characterization standpoint, there is not much else to say about Snake Man vs Katakuri than that, but I will say that I absolutely love the climax of this fight. First off, this double spread:

Is just, in my opinion, one of the coolest pages in Manga ever. And I don't say shit like that lightly.

Secondly, I've seen people say that the culmination of Luffy vs Katakuri was disappointing to them, as we didn't get a "big finisher" like Luffy vs Doflamingo or Luffy vs Cracker. However, I'd argue we actually got something better: A truly meaningful character moment that solidifies and culminates Katakuri's entire character arc.

Firstly, note that as things end, Katakuri still maintains his stance:

This is Oda's final display of Katakuri maintaining the hype around himself, his back hasn't touched the ground since birth, and just when we thought he was defeated, he appears before us on his feet again. Luffy and Katakuri exchange some words, and then:

Katakuri finally falls on his back, and Luffy covers his mouth as a show of respect. The important thing to note here is that Katakuri falls on his back on purpose, and also openly tells Brulee that the Facade he adopted for himself was a lie:

To which Brulee responds that she already knew but she idolized him anyway, which is a great little way of Oda letting Katakuri finally find some peace in all this.

But that's all I've got to say for now! Hopefully I did the Dawg some justice, and hopefully I was at the very least able to help some people who maybe didn't think to highly of Katakuri before see him in a different light. All hail.

What do you guys think? Is Katakuri steaming hot donkey trash? Is Katakuri amazing? Or is he just the most average character of all time?

Share your thoughts, and thank you for reading :)

@Owl Ki @Jiihad @Blackbeard @TheAncientCenturion @Light D Lamperouge @HA001 @Den_Den_Mushi @playa4321 @Sentinel @silverfire @Cinera @Shura @MarineHQ62 @Kiwipom @Chrono etc etc etc etc etc etc

This is really very well written sir, I totally agree, but Idk if you missed it on purpose, don't you think guys that Katakuri has been his whole life afraid of losing a familily member by his own demential mother and somehow he's been waiting to find someone rightful and strong enought to ally with to beat his mother and save his siblings? I truly believe that Katakuri started to feel that Luffy was somehow respectable when he decided to fight him to save his crew and instead of just trying to kill him as he would do with any other enemy, he decided to test his will.

Lion of Olympus · Apr 23, 2020

My main problem with Katakuri is that supposedly wants to protect his family and crew, but then proceeds to kill some just because the saw his face :namiriously:

Elder Lee Hung · Apr 23, 2020

Inflamed Haki said:

The Chefs aren’t included in the “family” he wants to protect imo, he’s likely only concerned with the wellbeing of his siblings.

Shuyaku · Apr 23, 2020

He’s only concerned with the well being of his family, he was never portrayed as a saint, he even killed a priest at the wedding lol.

silverfire · Apr 24, 2020

Gave him a 7. Unfortunately, Oda was nowhere near as meticulous with his character as you were with your OP. The conflict within himself and him being a foil to Luffy is interesting and had potential, but Oda's execution was hamfisted, rushed, and wrought with contradictions.

Owl Ki said:

The entire arc didn't flow well at all. The fight, and even Katakuri's character, sorry to say, feel like they were thrown in there by Oda specifically to give Luffy an "epic fight" for that arc, and give the readers the satisfaction of him beating an honorable, very powerful opponent and growing in the process. The odd thing is that both of them seemed throw away what they truly cared about (for Luffy, his crew, for Katakuri, his family) for the sake of the bromance they developed during the fight.

He's still the best character in the Charlotte family, but he could've been a lot better.

ShinmenTakezo · Apr 24, 2020

I agree fully, it´s actually "not that hard" to understand his character arc, but people assume thing falsely or too quickly before thinking through.
Most fatal assumption is Katakuri has to act as perfectly reasonable and consistent character, but his inconsistent behavior at times in regards to Luffy is literally the exterior expression of his interior contradiction and conflict.

1) Katakuri covered his mouth because it was an external sign of weakness that bullies tried to exploit. Instead he adopted the supposed perfect facade, coupled with being strong, to be a warning to anyone who tries to challenge them.
Leaving them alone does not work, neither only being strong, because people, especially children, are irrational beings.
These little shits were literally like Flambe, whose actions were straight out stupid, considering the revelation of Katakuri´s actual appearance was not a detriment to his strength, but these idiots still kept on mocking him, suddenly disregarding his strength, and that´s not unrealistic since some people simply do not know when to stop.

2) In addition, and this was touched upon, Katakuri´s facade is supposed to be a pillar for his siblings not only against outside the family, but especially because their mother is a cutthroat person who only looks at her own benefit in regards to relationships.

3) Luffy vs Katakuri had two layers in regards to Katakuri, obviously to stop Luffy, someone who might become a threat in the future, but even more importantly, it was a internal clash between Katakuri´s perfect facade and his actual personality and how he wants to be.
Luffy represented the latter for him, someone who does not care even remotely how he is perceived, someone who would do anything some people might perceive as disgusting or lower, and it was a fight to see whether Katakuri made the right choice of adopting such a facade, or whether he could express and show himself like he wants to.
That´s the reason why he goes out of his way to show his superiority against Luffy and used similar attacks to better effect to reassure himself he is doing the right thing and made the right choice.
But at the same time, he wanted to see whether Luffy could actually grow to the challenge, because his inner desire is to be like him as well, not to care about the facade and show his real character.
That was the central conflict of Katakuri´s character, some people seemed to have missed, hence the mixed reaction to his arc, and it was a contradicting conflict, that was the whole point.
And the moment he saw Luffy as someone respectable, which also entails that his actual personality can also be respected, he almost completely sheds the facade, but the ultimate shedding happened when he lost.

4) The only criticism i can accept is him overshadowing Big Mom in her own arc, but considering how Meme was treated besides that, it´s already a lost cause.

5) In regards to Luffy seeking out the fight, it´s literally the major change of him compared to pre-TS, which is a result of both his experiences in regards to crew and Ace, and also Rayleigh´s teachings (Haki blooms in extreme fights).
Pre-TS he was already interested in fighting (he was interested in Crocodile when he heard he is a Shichibukai) but nevertheless, he was mostly a reactionary character in that regard, the crew got into danger, and someone needed to be beaten in order to get out of the danger.
Post-TS, and that´s literally stated when Luffy attacks Fujitora despite there being no reason to, he actively seeks out the challenges in order to grow the strength he needs to become PK.
Pre-TS strength was mostly a by-product of traveling the seas and to keep traveling the seas, now strength is literally the goal, because you can not be the most free if you do not have the strength to back it up when needed.
So you can call it irresponsible as criticism, to make such a decision in that highly precarious situation (then again, what decision pre-TS was not reckless? To confront a Shichibukai after seeing Mihawk in Baratie? Or risk death by following a myth of an island in the sky....), but inconsistent? That´s literally the point.

ShinmenTakezo · Apr 25, 2020

Cinera said:

Goddamn you're simply amazing. I've never before seen such an in depth character study before (@TheAncientCenturion has tried for Doflamingo and is IIRC what made Doffy my third favourite character, @Den_Den_Mushi and @Light D Lamperouge have tried for Mihawk, but they simply don't measure up). This? This took my breath away. It was a little too much to read in one sitting (hence the late reply), but I'm glad I went through the entire post.

You've truly outdone yourself Major.

S for effort, S for delivery, S for persuasiveness.

I've finally seen the light of Katakuri's greatness. I can't bear to read WCI properly, so I guess I'll just watch Luffy and Katakuri's fight. I now think he's been grossly slandered and under appreciated as a character.

Old Ray still mid diffs him though. :kata:

There are probably compilations of every interaction with Luffy and Katakuri scene in general.
Katakuri was the saving grace of WCI.

Red Admiral · Apr 25, 2020

yeap

Katakuri for a SHONEN character is really well made (ignoring top shonens like Hunter Hunter who have a bar of his own)
he have a legit deep and interesting personality where the readers can respect him
but he lack a good story arc ... in fairness he didn't had a big role plot wise or much screen time ... so I can't expect much ...

but over all ..
character wise ... Katakuri was the best thing that happened to one piece ever since the new world ... well ... top 3

in reality ... even for shonen when we have some one like Meruem ... calling Katakuri a 5 is too much ...
but for majority of shonen ... 8/10 (+ I like him ... so who give a fuck)

TEACH D TEACH · Apr 25, 2020

Owl Ki said:

@Admiral Lee Hung fantastic post with a great eye for detail. :kata:

I am still on the fence about Katakuri himself. I read your post and think “Those are some good points”. Then I see posts from the likes of Den Den and dizzy and think “Those are also some good points”.

Considering that we can get wildly differing opinions on opposite sides of the spectrum regarding the quality of Katakuri’s character then perhaps it is fair to say that Katakuri is a good character with a compelling thematic concept that was executed poorly?

I remember at the time, the three things that turned me off Katakuri were;

I) His presence completely undermined Linlin’s status as the arc antagonist.

An antagonistic character should be someone that opposes the protagonist in a meaningful way, usually through opposing or differing morals, ideologies, outlooks on life, principles etc. etc.

Katakuri clearly had a far more developed role as an antagonist than Linlin which is honestly astonishing since Linlin is a major series antagonist that was revealed all the way back in Water 7 as one of the greatest pirates of the current era and to have ever lived.

In comparison, Katakuri was practically introduced at the last possible moment, being introduced during the beginning of WCI Arc’s climax. For him to outshine Linlin is completely unprecedented and would be akin to Mr 7 and Miss Father’s Day outshining Crocodile.

It is not like Linlin had no opposing ideology to Luffy either. For starters, their views on family and loyalty are chalk and cheese. Lol.

I know one could say that Linlin could shine later in the story (fat chance, pun intended) but it is the first impression that is always the strongest when it comes to story telling and Linlin’s first impression was completely undermined by Katakuri.

II) The reasons for the fight to occur in the first place were nonsense and undermined Luffy’s previously established character.

Luffy was never someone who started conflict with any major arc antagonist. It was always an antagonist that started shit and blocked all options off to the point where Luffy had to confront them for a logical reason (e.g. Crocodile and Alabasta, Enel putting the SH crew on trial, Moriah trapping the crew, CP9 capturing Robin etc.).

Luffy was always more concerned with the safety of his crew and adventure. Deliberately picking fights for no reason was not in his nature. Just look at his interactions with Bellamy during Jaya Arc. Luffy had no interest in an ego contest with Bellamy because such things are meaningless, a lesson he learned from Shanks all the way back in Chapter 1.

Compare that to Luffy abandoning his crew (which is down to 1/2 it’s usual numbers) to a literal Yonko in order to have a fight with Katakuri for the sake of fighting and it suddenly feels less like Luffy vs Katakuri in One Piece and more like Rubber Goku vs Demon King Katakuri in Dragon Ball Sea.

The old Luffy would have prioritised the safety of his crew above all else. Luffy has the chance to either trap Katakuri in the Mirror World by dumping him in there and taking Brûlée hostage or just straight up dumped Katakuri in the ocean. Then he would have protected his crew from the rampaging Yonko Linlin.

Before I hear some objections about how Luffy is not “underhanded”, this is the same Luffy who regularly used people as meat shields since Pre-TS and who was fine with partaking in the assassination of a 68 year old granny by directly triggering a catastrophic mental breakdown.

Seeing such a core aspect of Luffy swept aside just to have a cool fight was utterly disappointing.

III) The entire fight happened during the worst portion of WCI Arc, if not the worst portion of the entire manga. To this day, I am still of the opinion that WCI should have just ended after the Tea Party finished.

So in short, I found it difficult to get invested in Katakuri’s character due to the fact that his fight (the entire source of his character development) happened because of nonsensical circumstances, his development came at the cost of two other characters outright regressing and it happened during a terrible portion of the manga that could have been cut and still changed nothing in regards to the plot.

I agree with most and especially the bolded. But it was also necessary, since Oda wanted his yonko to be in another stratosphere compared to the rest, so he has no choice than to put Luffy through fights like this and close the gap through them. It started earlier though, when his strongest forms from pre TS (on a now much stronger Luffy who can use 3 types of haki efficiently) were nothing more than a joke in the eyes of a mere shichibukai. So instead of focusing on all the Strawhats and their dreams, growth, interactions, you get them separated all over the New World and a Luffy centric story, where he goes through avoidable fights in order to better his strength, DF usage and haki to catch up to the yonko.

Gol D. Roger · Apr 25, 2020

TheAncientCenturion said:

It's very startling to see people who overreact to Katakuri's liberation in Tottoland. From the beginning of the fight, we were essentially told how it would play out. Luffy and Katakuri, two characters with visually similar powers, fighting alone in the Mirror World. Katakuri was symbolically looking at his reflection and growing frustrated with the carefree attitude and shameless nature of Luffy. To a man who burdens himself with image for the sake of family and pride, someone like Luffy is so threatening to his false life style.

The change wasn't abrupt or a left turn. Oda had it displayed in front of us, letting us reach that conclusion long before the finale of the battle hit us. One of the worst cases of bad reads is people who criticize Katakuri for his "honorable, mans duel" comment. It is evident to even the blind that Katakuri only wants this to be a solo duel because of the promise Luffy shows, the potential for a new (or old) way of life for Katakuri himself. He's entrapped in the young pirate's ambition and attitude. Cutting it short would be like closing off any chance for Katakuri to be himself again. This is his last opportunity to make up for his many years playing a role rather than being himself.

He's looking for answers in Luffy's battle, not to win for the family or for reputation. It's more important that Katakuri knows if it's okay to be Dogtooth and not Charlotte Katakuri the Invincible Man. An added note on design; I love how Oda immediately separates Katakuri from the rest of his family via attire. Every Charlotte family member and most allies wear goofy, flamboyant dresses and outfits that highlights some of their personality or devil fruit powers. No one in this crew makes an effort to hide themselves, they're peacocks and flamingos in the wild. Yet at the Tea Party, the only character who looks threatening is Katakuri. A biker vest, tight leather pants, a covered face for mysterious effects and he even has god damn spurs!

His silhouette and image is meant to stand out against his kin and family member. And it's really clever how Oda does this, too. Because we immediately notice it as "Oh shit, this guy's tough!" due to his Biker from Hell getup. But once the Mirror World hits, it really becomes clear why he stands out. It's not because Oda wants us to think Charlotte Katakuri is tough, but because he wants us to look at Katakuri as the oddball. The only person who restrains himself in the family. Hidden behind the veneer of perfection and power, Katakuri's design itself tells us so much about who he is.

And like you said in your thread, his design changes over the fight. Stripping down the outfit parallel's Katakuri stripping away the act, looking back at the mirror of himself and seeing a bit more of who he truly is. The mouth, the Charlotte embroidery, and the Mochi-enhanced musculature are all examples of this.

It's evident that Oda put a lot of thought into Katakuri, and those who claim he's a last minute arc edition need to reread Tottoland. We get different interpretations of the manga reading in bulk via weekly. The latter allows for better discussion but the former a greater understanding of what Oda's doing. Katakuri and his changing design doesn't represent Oda's time table. For all we know, that was early Dressrosa designs Oda had under consideration. Since Pekoms and Baron Tamago showed up at Dressrosa, we've known that Oda intended them to go to Tottoland. So that large scale planning would make sense, given the complexity of Katakuri's character.

Good thread Major. It was a long read but a good one. And I love how Oda portrays the strong. Perospero yaps on about his bounty, but the truly powerful have no care for it. It's a good distinction in mentality of those worthy of our respect.

Never know you respect Katakuri so much. That was touching :pepemy:

Sentinel · Apr 25, 2020

As I said on your profile, @Admiral Lee Hung, this thread is really 10/10, I couldn't have described it any better.

People can say and think whatever they want about Katakuri's character whether it was handled poor or even well. They can also criticize it as much as they want and yes: all of their criticism, okay at least most of them, are not farfetched at all.

Buuuuut: Don't you think this actually makes Katakuri's character development that great? His character development wasn't really highlighted but that's exactly the key how to make a character interesting.
Many people have their different view about him and Oda managed to make something which people still do nowadays; discussing about Katakuri's character or; discussing about his greatness. It's not the usual "He's trash", "Kata's gay" bashing - on this thread, we can actually see very well written analysis about his character, completely rational and objectively. Whether they describe positive or negative aspects of his character.

And to answer some critics:

Katakuri tried to kill Luffy at first but later, he suddenly worshipped the character who tried to kill his mother.

I can understand these arguments, after all, Oda did not really elaborate Katakuri's determination throughout the fight, I have to admit that.
Nevertheless, let's not forget that Katakuri kept fighting against an opponent for 9 hours, the opponent's fighting style was brute, messy and he did not hesistate to leave the place mid-battle.

But why did Katakuri begin to acknowledge Luffy as a worthy opponent, respecting him in result? It is because Luffy is the exact opposite of Katakuri's faked personality, his empty hype and also his hypocrisy. Luffy stands up for his goal, he does whatever he want, his determination is the amazing thing about him.

People say "Why did Katakuri respect an opponent who left the battle and kidnapped his sister?" but that's not an inconsistency. This is one of Luffy's own character, his freedom as an individual to do whatever he wants, whether people like it or not about him. And besides, Luffy freely chose to fight Katakuri again despite being trashed from left and right before. Luffy could just leave Katakuri behind in the mirror world and would have joined his subordinates but now, he decided to fight Katakuri again. Not by trying to wear him down. Not by trying some unfair moves against him. Luffy simply wanted to surpass the 1 billion man by improving himself with the ability to see in the future.

At the beginning of round 2, Katakuri said "I wouldn't blame you if you left this place. It's not a shame to lose against me." and actually made clear the differences between him and his opponent which was seen throughout round 1 but Luffy did not hesistate to challence Katakuri once again.
Afterwards, Katakuri saw how much Luffy tried to learn the same ability like his despite being bitchslapped from left and right like in round 1 until Luffy showed first successful tries of FS by dodging and blocking Katakuri's own attacks.
That's the point when Katakuri began to respect Luffy, both him as an individual and a worthy opponent.

And Flampe intercepting a very important moment which would have decided the outcome of this match because Luffy would have dodged that fatal blow was just the key moment for Katakuri to fully respect Luffy.

Pre-TS Luffy just fought opponents who opposed his friends, otherwisw he never looked for a fight directly.

Yeah, PRE-TS Luffy and that's the entire point! Luffy had a character development throughout this manga! He acknowledged that he can't be the freest man alive by doing nothing. He saw that by losing against Aokiji and the CP9 but the key moment was Marineford in which Luffy lost his brother because of his lacks of strength.

Jinbe's motivation speech did not only gave Luffy's willpower back, he also managed to force a certain development on Luffy's own character since Luffy recognized that he still has his friends but at the same time, he also recognized that he would lose them again if he's still that weak.
Therefore, Luffy began his training 2 years ago, Rayleigh taught him the basics of Haki, the animals were powerful foes in which Luffy could invent new techniques and a new gear.

Post-TS: Luffy openly challenced Fujitora for a fight whilst Pre-TS Luffy wouldn't dare trying the same thing without a valid reason. It is clear that Luffy declared his goal towards Fujitora; to become the next PK, he has to surpass all Yonko and Admirals. That's the moment in which Luffy even included Shanks, his role model.

Hence Luffy challenging Katakuri for similar reasons is definitely not an inconsistency, it perfectly proves his character development.

Thus Luffy simply changed his determination throughout the manga. And this was not a sudden change since he made his determination even in Pre-TS clear, just before he went for his timeskip training.

Katakuri tried to hide his face to protect his family but why did he kill the chefs who saw his face?

As you guys said, Katakuri tried to protect his family, not other people. These chefs are nothing but some subordinates for Katakuri and thus, in order to keep his hype alive and to keep the safety of his siblings, he decided to kill these chefs.
Luffy was not an exception either since Katakuri also tried to kill him as well.

But could we say that Katakuri was reasonable at that moment? Totally not! But that's exactly how Katakuri was portrayed: Imagine keeping this secret for decades to protect your siblings but suddenly, your secret was exposed by the same unworthy opponent at the most inconvenient moment.
Face like a pelican eel? Check. Lying on his back (remember, apparently Katakuri never lied on his back!)? Check. Eating at an inelegant way? Check. There was no "war god" or something like that in which Katakuri held his godly ritual? Check, dude was just eating his donuts while singing a donut song.

Thus, Katakuri killing the chefs was pure desperation. Rationality? Not found but as I said, that's how Katakuri was portrayed. He is by no means a perfect individual, he has his weaknesses but also his strength - his weaknesses were extremely exposed.
And for this moment, Katakuri forgot everything about his faked personality, killing the chefs brutal, trying to fight Luffy like a brute, trying to BLOCK attacks which were obviously too powerful to be blocked anyway!
Katakuri did not only lose his FS... No, losing his FS was exactly the key point to show that Katakuri's faked personality crumbed in several pieces. Calm? No. Fighting elegant? No. Using your brain on a fight? No.

In conclusion, Katakuri's hypocrisy and his inconsistent moves during the fight should exactly demonstrate how Katakuri is confronted with his usual self or his faked personality; his faked personality is an inconsistency itself, that's why Katakuri was inconsistent throughout the battle.

The Katakuri at the end of the battle, that was the REAL Katakuri who acted like he wants, who threw his pride away, he threw his scarf away, his jacket (on his back, as @Admiral Lee Hung showed, there's written "Charlotte") since he saw that even his family - also a bunch of twisted motherfuckers - doesn't respect him who he is. The same family whom Katakuri tried to protect made fun of his true appearance - the contradiction itself is hilarious but great.

Katakuri outclassed Big Mom as an antagonist on her own arc.

Yeah, it is surprising? No, Big Mom was a failed character from begin with. It's not Katakuri's fault that she is an utter mess, lol. I mean, I can understand that Big Mom was underwhelming for the people in WCI but she was even absolutely underwhelming on the current arc. Heck, a flying six girl with a trash talking attitude is already more interesting than Big Mom, lmao.

I think that's all I wanted to say about Katakuri's greatness.

Btw, GOATakuri FTW!

Owl Ki · Apr 25, 2020

Sentinel said:

If you are talking about what I said, then I should probably clarify my position.

When I said Luffy, I did not mean Pre-TS Luffy, I meant Luffy in general.

Yes, even with his intention of taking down the four Yonko (which Pre-TS Luffy would have accepted as necessary to achieve his goal of becoming Pirate King) it is still antagonists that start beef with him.

Linlin threatened Fishman Island and sent minions to kidnap Sanji.

For Kaido, well Momo is New World Vivi so there is that. Caesar and his allies were intent on killing everyone on the island. Defeating Caesar and destroying the SAD factory meant pissing off both Doffy and Kaido anyway.

If I recall correctly, Fujitora actually confronted the Straw Hats. To be fair to Luffy, Fujitora came by just himself and his AoE capabilities would have just sunk the retreating ships. If Fujitora was serious about killing them then retreating would have been impossible anyway. Challenging Fujitora certainly did not put the crew in anymore danger than they were already in.

This brings me to my biggest problem with Luffy vs Katakuri.

Even if I were to fully accept that Luffy has changed into an individual that seeks direct conflict and confrontation (despite Shank’s teachings and the fact Ace died for that exact reason so gg those lessons), I refuse to accept that it is inherently in Luffy’s nature to deliberately endanger and/or abandon his crew just to cobble someone who never actually did anything to Luffy or his crew and who could have been dealt with by Luffy easily (e.g. trapped in Mirror World or drowned) so that Luffy could then protect his crew from the literal rampaging Yonko (who for all his Post-TS big talk, Luffy had no problem running away from).

On a side note, I also fully accept that my other two points (as well as this point) as pointed out by @Admiral Lee Hung are not direct criticisms of Katakuri.

Fair enough but like I said they do affect my enjoyment of the character. After all, the one thing I do not enjoy is when a character shines at the expense of others.

Considering I see legitimate objective criticism for and against Katakuri, it does make think of Katakuri as a character was a good idea that (like everything else in WCI) was at best not executed to it’s fullest potential or at worst executed poorly.

If Katakuri had to be someone necessary that Luffy needed to face (I suppose this addresses what @TEACH D TEACH was saying) then Oda should have just made Katakuri the big bad at the end of arc and invented some reason for Linlin to be out of action (any reason is better than that stupid cake chase sequence) or hell, just have that assassination plan of Bege’s work. That might have made folk actually take the Supernovas seriously.

Have Katakuri be the main threat that Luffy needs to face. That way Luffy is saving his crew, not abandoning them. Make Katakuri the reason that Luffy cannot leave the Mirror World. This would have fixed a lot of problems.

Elder Lee Hung · Apr 25, 2020

Cinera said:

Damn my man, thank you very much! I’m glad I was able to improve your perception of Katakuri so much. And yeah, I truly think the Dawg is one of the most underrated characters by our fandom in every aspect. Like I told @Dragomir in discord, he is already my favorite pirate in the manga and absolutely has potential to become my all time favorite One Piece character depending on what his future role and actions in the plot are.

I guess now is a good time to elaborate lol,

I’ve seen a lot of people say they would like it if he became the captain of the Big Mom pirates after her possible death. While I think this would be cool, what I’d really like to see from the Dawg, and this is just me personally, is I’d like to see him leave his own crew for a time, and in some way, shape, or form, fight alongside Luffy in the final war. Oda foreshadowed Kuri’s own respect for luffy over most of his family at the end of WCI, and I personally don’t think Big Mom will die, and rather I think she’ll probably end up taking over the Beasts Pirates after Kaido’s death which seems inevitable to me.

What I really want to see from Kuri, is for him to almost be one the post TS Nico Robin, a Major antagonist who comes and joins the Straw Hats (maybe not as a formal crew member but more like an Oden/Vivi type, just sailing with the crew for a while). Though I wouldn’t complain if he became the BMP captain, I think his own character arc would be more meaningful if he truly evolved past blaming himself for what happened to Brulee, which would mean leaving his crew and family to protect themselves in order to follow the only man who ever showed him true respect, and earned his in return.

Cinera said:

Ayyyy one crisis at a time lmfao. Maybe I’ll do a thread on why I consider his strength underrated but a thread like that could quickly and easily turn into a facade for Zoro vs Luffy or Zoro vs Sanji lmfao.

Jo_Ndule · Apr 25, 2020

I remember people used to say "who cares to bully Yonko children"

Well, BM wasnt Yonko until 24-20 years ago!

So it makes sense why the other citizens and pirates were bullying brulee or attacking Kata coz BM was busy sailing with Rocks till 38 years ago, after that it took BM 12-3 years to be Emperor level

Owl Ki · Apr 25, 2020

Admiral Lee Hung said:

Luffy is the mc · Apr 25, 2020