Questions & Mysteries To those who think Zoro's Advanced CoC power-up was an asspull, which would you have preferred?

cleanmrpostman

cleanmrpostman

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#1
#1
I've seen quite a lot of people still claiming that Zoro's awakening of Conqueror's coating is an asspull, he didn't train it, it makes no sense. He went from being unaware that he's a conqueror to using advanced conqueror's in no time at all, while Luffy needed 2 years of training and many high-level fights post-ts to justifiably be at the level he is right now. It doesn't seem fair, right?

But my question is, how else could Oda have done this in your opinion? If we go by two rules:

1) Zoro is, as Luffy fans like to say, not the main character. This means Oda wouldn't/couldn't give Zoro nearly as much screen time as Luffy, preventing him from getting the same satisfying but smaller achievements such as basic CoC, Boundman, Snakeman, advanced CoO and finally advanced CoA.

2) Despite not being the MC, Zoro is a character who needs to surpass Mihawk's rival Shanks, who as we know is a very strong Conqueror, a Yonko. Zoro needs to reach Yonko level and we've known this for a long time.

We end up with a contradiction. If Zoro awakened CoC pre-ts and trained it for 2 years, fans would be pissed that he's stepping on the MC's spotlight as a conqueror. The same would happen if Zoro got as much screen time as Luffy, and fought the same tier of 1v1 every arc and progressed at the same rate.

One minute it's "Zoro doesn't need (insert feat here) or more screen time etc because he isn't the MC". Then when he gets stronger as we know he needs to, it's "How can Zoro have this feat without spending more time and achieving more feats to make it satisfying?". You can't have it both ways.
 
Welkin

Welkin

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#3
#3
With the way ACoC works idk if there's a good way Oda really could've handled it

The way Luffy got it was dumb and the way Zoro got it was even worse

If I were Oda I would've set some time aside after the war or during Elbaf to have Zoro kind of realize and master this new ability (CoC) that he has. It's a little silly that Zoro isn't even capable of using the basic version at will but is magically capable of using an ability only a few among the strongest possess

The "not the MC arguments" don't mean Zoro and other strawhats don't deserve their own training chapters. Usopp not even practicing his CoO after unlocking it in Dressrosa is horrible
 
cleanmrpostman

cleanmrpostman

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#4
#4
Luffywankishere said:
With the way ACoC works idk if there's a good way Oda really could've handled it

The way Luffy got it was dumb and the way Zoro got it was even worse

If I were Oda I would've set some time aside after the war or during Elbaf to have Zoro kind of realize and master this new ability (CoC) that he has. It's a little silly that Zoro isn't even capable of using the basic version at will but is magically capable of using an ability only a few among the strongest possess



The way Luffy got it was dumb and the way Zoro got it was even worse

If I were Oda I would've set some time aside after the war or during Elbaf to have Zoro kind of realize and master this new ability (CoC) that he has. It's a little silly that Zoro isn't even capable of using the basic version at will but is magically capable of using an ability only a few among the strongest possess

The "not the MC arguments" don't mean Zoro and other strawhats don't deserve their own training chapters. Usopp not even practicing his CoO after unlocking it in Dressrosa is horrible
Click to expand...
Maybe Oda's planning for Zoro to need conqueror's coating sooner than we think
 
bennbeckman

bennbeckman

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#5
#5
Luffywankishere said:
With the way ACoC works idk if there's a good way Oda really could've handled it

The way Luffy got it was dumb and the way Zoro got it was even worse

If I were Oda I would've set some time aside after the war or during Elbaf to have Zoro kind of realize and master this new ability (CoC) that he has. It's a little silly that Zoro isn't even capable of using the basic version at will but is magically capable of using an ability only a few among the strongest possess

The "not the MC arguments" don't mean Zoro and other strawhats don't deserve their own training chapters. Usopp not even practicing his CoO after unlocking it in Dressrosa is horrible
Click to expand...
Both of them getting it was terrible and as a Zboi I actually agree it's a lot worse for Zoro at least Luffy understood it in some form of a concept.

Zoro's I quite dont understand along with him being able to instantly master it too
 
Welkin

Welkin

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#7
#7
cleanmrpostman said:
Maybe Oda's planning for Zoro to need conqueror's coating sooner than we think
Click to expand...
If the series is really ending soon then I can see why but that still doesn't make it good. Luffy got hit by Kaido a few times and just figured it out. Doesn't make any sense either but you can use Luffy's experience with CoC as an excuse ig

Zoro unlocking ACoC is horrible though. The foreshadowing is there anyone that's not blind could tell that he was going to unlock CoC and ACoC eventually but the way it was handled was just not good

Luffy unlocked base CoC and had to put in the time to master it which then led to him learning the advanced application... by getting hit. Weird but still slightly better

The chapter where Zoro tested out his new blade was a good setup chapter for Zoro that he should've also had for CoC imo
 
bennbeckman

bennbeckman

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#8
#8
Luffywankishere said:
If the series is really ending soon then I can see why but that still doesn't make it good. Luffy got hit by Kaido a few times and just figured it out. Doesn't make any sense either but you can use Luffy's experience with CoC as an excuse ig

Zoro unlocking ACoC is horrible though. The foreshadowing is there anyone that's not blind could tell that he was going to unlock CoC and ACoC eventually but the way it was handled was just not good

Luffy unlocked base CoC and had to put in the time to master it which then led to him learning the advanced application... by getting hit. Weird but still slightly better

The chapter where Zoro tested out his new blade was a good setup chapter for Zoro that he should've also had for CoC imo
Click to expand...
This is why I preferred Law, Kidd, and Luffy take down Kaido in a 3v1
 
Welkin

Welkin

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#9
#9
bennbeckman said:
Both of them getting it was terrible and as a Zboi I actually agree it's a lot worse for Zoro at least Luffy understood it in some form of a concept.

Zoro's I quite dont understand along with him being able to instantly master it too
Click to expand...
I just wish there was a bit more to it for both of them. Like we should've seen panels of Luffy thinking about Thunder Bagua and how to replicate the effects before or even during the fight

I also don't see what's so difficult with establishing Zoro as a new CoC user and giving him a chapter or 2 to develop his new abilities before the raid. I don't think anyone would've complained
 
uyuu

uyuu

‎
#10
#10
cleanmrpostman said:
I've seen quite a lot of people still claiming that Zoro's awakening of Conqueror's coating is an asspull, he didn't train it, it makes no sense. He went from being unaware that he's a conqueror to using advanced conqueror's in no time at all, while Luffy needed 2 years of training and many high-level fights post-ts to justifiably be at the level he is right now. It doesn't seem fair, right?

But my question is, how else could Oda have done this in your opinion? If we go by two rules:

1) Zoro is, as Luffy fans like to say, not the main character. This means Oda wouldn't/couldn't give Zoro nearly as much screen time as Luffy, preventing him from getting the same satisfying but smaller achievements such as basic CoC, Boundman, Snakeman, advanced CoO and finally advanced CoA.

2) Despite not being the MC, Zoro is a character who needs to surpass Mihawk's rival Shanks, who as we know is a very strong Conqueror, a Yonko. Zoro needs to reach Yonko level and we've known this for a long time.

We end up with a contradiction. If Zoro awakened CoC pre-ts and trained it for 2 years, fans would be pissed that he's stepping on the MC's spotlight as a conqueror. The same would happen if Zoro got as much screen time as Luffy, and fought the same tier of 1v1 every arc and progressed at the same rate.

One minute it's "Zoro doesn't need (insert feat here) or more screen time etc because he isn't the MC". Then when he gets stronger as we know he needs to, it's "How can Zoro have this feat without spending more time and achieving more feats to make it satisfying?". You can't have it both ways.
Click to expand...
Make Zoro trained in special branch of CoA during the timeskip, achieving special CoA instead of asspulling him getting conscious CoC control and also AdvCoC in the same minute. Oda can always make that special CoA powerful enough to beat King.
 
R

Robin swan

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#11
#11
It's dumb but learning adcoc seems easy if you already know how to flow your haki. It's flowing your haki just with CoC instead of CoA and most of the world can't flow their haki. I think it's a bad awakening to a pu because any CoC user should easily be able to get it if they learned adcoa but only the strongest of the strong are supposed to have the ability. Luffy getting it was him realizing he could also flow CoC while Zoro got it just by flowing his CoC. It's not some crazy pu where you need years of training and mastering CoC to awaken it but simply understanding you can flow your CoC. It's bad how Zoro got just as bad as Luffy but the simple logic is you can just flow your haki and if you already know how to do that you can with CoC.
 
RoronoaZorro

RoronoaZorro

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#12
#12
To be fair, his talent is already very high. He also has status as heaven's chosen. People like this has extremely high affinity on something or even everything. Whether we like it or not, talent is (almost) everything.
 
H

humanbeing

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#13
#13
how is that an asspull , we are at the end of the story, any power up needs perfection, Zoro got Enma and CoC arc this arc but still he cannot use freely , it would be an asspull if he get that in a later arc and just like that he use them perfectly.
 
H

hk1992

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#14
#14
Zoro has Always been a Haki genius. His Iron cutting technique is just pure ryo. He is the most proficient in flowing his Haki before wano. So he just had to figure out he had COC and flow it. Also notice that zoro is the oldest character who awakaned coc, however with his long battle experience, its natural for him to unlock acoc not long After or at the same Time (because of experience). Luffy awakaned basic coc pre ts, however he was not a first class fighter, the gap of mastery to master acoc was high (required progiciency in acoa at least),
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If Sanji ever had COC, i assume he will get acoc soon. For eustass kid, idk, this Guy lacks basic haki
 
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