Versus Battle Tobirama vs Ay

[Xione]

Tobirama has by hype stronger Suiton than Kisame. This includes jutsu far superior to Gengetsu's water gun (which made Gaara's sand, in a fucking desert, look like pussy shit), Kisame's thousand feeding sharks or that jutsu he used vs 6th gate Gai


Tobirama also has that Jutsu of INFINITE summoning and exploding tags - like, think Konan vs Obito, but rather than prep time, Tobirama can literally trigger one jutsu and it will have the same effect. That also totally destroys not only Ays armour, but probably just about every defence that ever existed aside from maybe perfect Susano'o and Itachi's due to Yata Mirror.

Ignoring this, Tobirama has Edo Tensei, so he has whole other characters to summon - we dont know who he could summon for this fight though

PLUS he has a mastery of Genjutsu. Ays only way to avoid Tobirama's sound based Genjutsu is to try and overpower the guy in terms of chakra surges. Not going to lie, but there's very few people who have more powerful chakra than the second strongest known Senju. Despite Ay being incredible in this regard, he still is not on the same level in this respect either

Tobirama clearly has a number of ways to respond to Ays armour, plus we also have the fact that Tobirama is a genius and Ay is not, so even if Ays armour was 10x as strong as it is, Tobirama would devise a plan. Tobirama is simply ridiculous. No two ways about it. I'm not kidding when I say he was probably on the same tier as Hashirama and Madara if we ignore SM and Rinnegan

Right but that's hype, I'm talking about strictly on-panel feat. If we're going by just hype, Ay can't even be mentioned in the same realm as Tobirama.


Hiruzen hyping him up himself, "Those two of all people!!"

Spoiler

The guy was considered the ultimate shinobi in Konoha, along with his brother, even after Minato & Hiruzen.

Spoiler

Then we have Madara talking about him not being able to regain his full power, due to which he's got the edge now. Implying had Tobirama been at full-power he would've posed a threat to Madara.

Spoiler

Then if we go by the Databook he created many other Jutsus that were on par with FTG & Edo Tensei, implied to have Dan's technique of soul transfer being one of them.


If going by just hype, only Hashirama & Madara stand above the guy from how I see it when it comes to normal ninja and his arsenal is stacked as hell. Especially when you look at the fact only him & his brother were the only individuals in the manga to not have been revived by the Edo Tensei at full power, both times. BUT the guy has barely any CQC feats, he's so far on-panel used Hirashin & shunshin, He's showcased the water slice attack, and the water needles from the mouth (not counting the Edo Tensei related Jutsu). The FTG & Shunshin feats are enough to say he low-diffs though.

 

[L o g i a]

If going by just hype, only Hashirama & Madara stand above the guy from how I see it when it comes to normal ninja and his arsenal is stacked as hell. Especially when you look at the fact only him & his brother were the only individuals in the manga to not have been revived by the Edo Tensei at full power, both times. BUT the guy has barely any CQC feats, he's so far on-panel used Hirashin & shunshin, He's showcased the water slice attack, and the water needles from the mouth (not counting the Edo Tensei related Jutsu). The FTG & Shunshin feats are enough to say he low-diffs though.

Great post dude

But to add to this:
He has CQC feats. His weakened edo in CQC was getting the better of Enma for the short time they scuffled. Furthermore, as the "fastest ninja ever" (until Minato), this implies he was the greatest Taijutsu master, since speed is one of its key proponents: this places his Taijutsu above Madara and Hashirama. To support this, Hashirama was incapable of even reacting to Juubito, same for BM Naruto. HOWEVER, Tobirama was actually able to dodge Juubito's attacks unaided - this was probably helped by his sensory abilities, but damn was this guy exceptional just based on that feat alone. That panel was after Madara got the better of Tobirama in taijutsu, as I'm sure somebody would point out but what they wouldnt point out was Madara was using both Senjutsu and the Rinnegan (Human Path = near perfect taijutsu by rite of existence) in combination.

I also forgot he mentioned he could transport his soul to the battlefield when he was talking with Sasuke etc. - so perhaps he could use Dan's jutsu. The more this goes on, the more obvious it becomes that Tobirama was a monster.

I agree, as far as normal shinobi goes, he's third - by this, at least I mean: non-jinchuuriki, non-edo/modification, non-Ohtsutsuki.

The guy, without the Rinnegan, mastered all five natures according to the databooks. This shows a level of talent on par with Nagato. Perhaps even greater since Nagato had the Rinnegan to help with this.

This guy is the greatest sensor ever too. His sensor feats are superior to Rikudo BM Naruto's ffs

So with these speed feats and the information that we have from databooks - I fail to see how anyone can even consider this a fair matchup regardless of feats. The only thing keeping Tobirama from reaching the level of Madara and Hashirama is the sheer scale of Ninjutsu, but even then based on his chakra strength, I wouldn't be surprised if that filler where he could flood an entire battlefield with hundreds/thousands of Shinobi from one single one-handed seal was something perfectly within his canon capabilities.