General & Others Wano had very few abandoned plot points

#41
There is a difference between a random line of dialogue under influence and the motors for the story mate.

Yes, Zoro said that because he is human and was immediately reminded that its actually Hiyori who has the biggest beef against Orochi.



That's not how story works. In manga, there is the tropes of the dream that realize themself, but in usual stories, when someone say they will do something, the opposite actually happens.

You can actually see a lot of this principle during whole cake.
''In usual stories'' but we are talking about One Piece, not any story and in One Piece stuff happens when it is declared by a character.
You are right though it is not supposed to be what drives the plot, but it is terrible writing on Oda's part as he changed what a lot of people liked about lots of characters.
Luffy as an example was what made him likable pre-ts because he goofs around but when he gets serious and declares something, he follows up, today he just goofs around and throws random statements. Yikes!
 
#43
I see a bit of lies here.
  • Luffy v Big Mom: He fought Big Mom, Then had to split to fight Kaido, but he fought her
  • Caribou weapons: Literally shown at the end that he was leaving in the Sunny, what was Caribou supposed to do in Wano, teleport away?
  • Awakening: YES
  • The low ones are mostly headcanons and theories at best, nto real plotlines
  • Wano citizense beign relevant: Literally when have citizens been relevant in One Piece
  • No greater samurai: YES
  • Theme of betrayal: There was an entire character that betrayed the alliance
  • Zoro plotlines have been shafted in general, but a lot are headcanons.
  • Toki: true dat
  • Big mom pirates: Disappeared
  • Why Wano is important? Maybe Pluton? Not sure here.
  • Opening the borders: We'll see
  • Momo alive: Maybe Toki, we'll see but yeah.
 
#46
This list just proves my point. Hell the Caribou/ancient weapons thing that they claimed was abandoned was explained in Egghead :milaugh:
The Kokeshi doll mystery was explained by Sukiyaki. Others are simply things which were never plot points in the first place like Kaido’s roar or onigashima’s true name (it was empty it never had a name before). These stem from fans misunderstanding the story and throwing crafting being taken as fact for example the Daimyo and the numbers thing was never a mystery

The rest of these such as Kaido’s motivations , opening the borders, Grim reaper, Ryuma and the importance of the Oni race will be explained later and were explicitly not included in Wano by Oda for better or worse not because they were abandoned or forgotten
 
#47
''In usual stories'' but we are talking about One Piece
When I'm talking about "usual stories", I'm also including One Piece. Most of the time when people say something, the opposite happens. That's basic storytelling.


but it is terrible writing on Oda's part as he changed what a lot of people liked about lots of characters.
No. Oda changed nothing about what we like about the characters. people just don't understand the character in the first place.

Take Sanji from example. People were mad that he didn't had a fight during whole cake and fed Big Mom. But those people actually completely missunderstand Sanji as a character.


Luffy as an example was what made him likable pre-ts because he goofs around but when he gets serious and declares something, he follows up, today he just goofs around and throws random statements. Yikes!
I'm sorry.. haven't you read Wano ? If I remember correctly, Luffy said a lot of things very seriously and delivered on ALL OF THEM:

Do you want me to remind you of this scene ?



Everything here is either headcannon or illegitimate fan expectations or plot that was actually followed up by Oda.

You guys are trying to analyse One Piece but you don't know what a plot point is in the first place, that can't work.. So lets analyse them in detail:

- Luffy VS Big Mom : Was actually delivered. Absolutely no narrative was setup for Luffy to win against Big Mom.
- Caribou and the anciant weapon : Actually a real plotline that is still going. You guys don't understand that a plotline starting in Wano doesn't necessaraly need to end in Wano.
- Awakening : Pure fan expectation. There is no reason why every strong character should get an awakening. (plus Kaido's actually awakened at the end of the fight)
- Kaid's victory cry ; What about it ? its not even a plot line.
- Zoro and grim reaper : That was symbolism mate. Learn to understand symbolism
- Onigashima's true name : Nothing was setup so that we should learn its true name.
- Oni race and Yamato : There is absolutely no need to dive into this and this is not a plot line. You confuse subtle worldbuilding with storytelling
- Mystery of Number : There is no mystery. its fan headcannon.
- Wano being called the land of gold : Again, subtle worldbuilding, not an actual plot line. Nothing to be abandonned or to be resolve here.
- The man Hitetsu was waiting for : It was Momo after his 20 y old return
- Kokeshi doll mystery : Not a mystery, a foreshadowing to make you understand that Hitetsu was Sukiyaki. Nothing more, nothing less
- Wano's citizen having participating in Kaido's defeat : Literally the samourai who helped the alliance. No mystery here.
- kaido's comment : A line for a character, not a plot line. Character can be proven wrong. Learn storytelling
- Betrayal in Kaido's word: ACTUAL and ONLY plot line that is relevant in this list. But this is what we call in One Piece a subtle plotline. I talked about it here:
That's not something that needed to be explicited. Oda is always very subtle with his character arc and Kaido doesn't make an exception. Kaido is simply a broken man. Broken by what happened in the Rock Pirates. He implictly mentionned a few times how painfull it is for a pirate to be betrayed and that pirate will always betray the one they are loyal to.

The reason why Kaido and Big Mom made an alliance is specifically because Big Mom was kind to Kaido. Kaido just wanted chaos out of sadness and wanted a way to die. Luffy gave him that.

In One Piece you ALWAYS need to pay a lot of attention to the details, because Oda doesn't have time to explain everything to you, so he will show you.
- Nidai Kitetsu : What about it ? Not a plot line.
- Zoro / Ryuma parrallels: Not a plot line, just basic storytelling to show the importance of Zoro. No mystery there.
- Significance of Zoro's shimotsuki heritage : Not a plot line. Was in fact never setup. Expectation by fan. Was explained in SBS. No mystery here.
- Significance of Toki being from the Void century : Again, this is what we call a foreshadowing. You will understand more by reading the entire One Piece story. Don't expect everything to be resolved at the end of every arc. Most of the time, Oda plants things far in advance.
- Zoro's motivation of Killing Orochi : Not a motivation, just a words and was immediatly ask by hiyori that it would be her that gets the last blow (even if in reality, she got the last "word"). Not a plot line, nothing was unresolved or abandonned
- Big Mom pirates crew presence in the war : Not a plot line, they were just stuck. Its shows that a yonko without their crew can be defeated.
- Why wano was very important to Kaido : Road Poneglyph / Weapon factory / ressources / Man power nothing more to explain here.
- What does opening the border means : It means releasing Pluton and or potentially letting Wano on the open. Momo choosed not to do that. The rest will come later
- Importance Momo being alive to guide the down: That's the plot of Wano dude..
 
#50
This one...lol.
Luffy himself promised to kick her ass.
Which was not a narrative promisse.

She used to be called Carrot 4 Nakama and spent thousands of posts (and blogs and twitter) spamming about Carrot joining the crew AND that whoever contradicted his fantasies was toxic, was a sexist, misogynist and ignorant incapable of understanding storytelling.
Spreading the good words I see

:christnally:
 
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#52
After this, anyone can decide for himself if "absolutely no narrative was setup for Luffy to win against Big Mom."
You are confusing dialogues and narration mate.

The narration NEVER setup Luffy beating Big Mom. Dialogues are here to make the narration organic, sometimes (most of the times) what character say will actually not happen. That's one of the basic principle of storytelling.
 
#54
You are confusing dialogues and narration mate.

The narration NEVER setup Luffy beating Big Mom. Dialogues are here to make the narration organic, sometimes (most of the times) what character say will actually not happen. That's one of the basic principle of storytelling.
One of the basic principles of storytelling It that when the main character vows to beat another one for 3 times, there Is abviously a narrative build up for It.

One can be happy or not happy, but Luffy himsel build It up repeatedly.
 
#55
One of the basic principles of storytelling It that when the main character vows to beat another one for 3 times, there Is abviously a narrative build up for It.

One can be happy or not happy, but Luffy himsel build It up repeatedly.
No it is just dialogue.
Like when luffy says he has abother dream.
Or that he has his friends.
Or when Zoro vows to Kuina while deep in anger and grief.
 
#56
One of the basic principles of storytelling It that when the main character vows to beat another one for 3 times, there Is abviously a narrative build up for It.
No lol.

And no. Luffy didn't build it up. He just said what was in his mind at the time.

The narration builded up Luffy vs Kaido, not Big Mom vs Luffy.


Like when luffy says he has abother dream.
Observe how is treated the dream of Luffy in the narration. This is what a real plot point is.
 
#58
You are confusing dialogues and narration mate.

The narration NEVER setup Luffy beating Big Mom. Dialogues are here to make the narration organic, sometimes (most of the times) what character say will actually not happen. That's one of the basic principle of storytelling.
This is literally set up for Luffy to defeat Big Meme, and dialogue is one of the most utilized ways to setup stuff. Otherwise how would we understand character motives and plot developments if no one spoke?
 
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