Chapter Discussion WGS title once again confirmed to be mainly ''SKILL'' based

[HA001]

Because we don't know how Shanks uses his haki compared to Mihawk.

We know that Shanks has the "strongest haki" and we know that different haki users use the haki differently. We have had tons of examples of that. We even had Shanks use haki on Greenbull without his sword.

Haki is more complex than just "imma grab a sword and hit my enemy with haki".

Maybe Shanks can paralyze Mihawk with his haki and still defeat him, despite him being a weaker swordsman.

We don't know shanks has the strongest haki for shit

It's never once been said


SHANKS DID 0 DAMAGE TO GREENBULL

If he was to actually fight him he'd use his CONFIRMED BURNING SWORD STYLE swordsmanship

 

[CbShadow]

Because we don't know how Shanks uses his haki compared to Mihawk.

We know that Shanks has the "strongest haki" and we know that different haki users use the haki differently. We have had tons of examples of that. We even had Shanks use haki on Greenbull without his sword.

Haki is more complex than just "imma grab a sword and hit my enemy with haki".

Maybe Shanks can paralyze Mihawk with his haki and still defeat him, despite him being a weaker swordsman.

Maybe Mihawk can cut through Shanks haki attacks with his haki. You know, the Pinnacle of swordsmanship. Or maybe Mihawk can block it with a barrier haki similar to when Zoro blocked hakai.

We have never seen Mihawk use his haki once in the manga, except for maybe against Mr. 1. Nobody to say how strong it is or all the different ways he uses it. We do know haki is related to black blade and Mihawk forged a black blade, unlike Shanks, so Mihawk's haki has to be incredibly strong.

 

[[No Name]]

If the official translation speaks of his swordsmanship without explicitly mentioning "skill" then we'll be back to square one, no new information of value will have been given to us; but if "skill" is indeed present then it will be nuancing the issue even more, and I can't understand how those who read the translation mentioning Mihawk's skill (whether correct or not) took it as confirmation of his superiority instead of the contrary. I mean, nuancing rarely confirms anything.

My take won't change indeed, which is a skeptical take because seriously, I'm totally fine with Mihawk being stronger than Shanks (you may not believe it, I wouldn't care), but God do I distrust it just for how, how, how prominent Shanks is as a conqueror. Wasn't for it and I would be more sure, and don't get me wrong because Mihawk is obviously going to be a conqueror's too, but I have my doubts he will be as prominent as Shanks in this regard and the narrative behind his will is very powerful so far (closest to Pirate King in terms of spirit, inspired the main character to achieve his dream of freedom, can intimidate from Yonko commanders to even an admiral just with a blast...). We had Chinjao stating that the Pirate King is the conqueror atop conquerors, Kaidou put Shanks among those of his highest regard as adversaries and he later used Roger as the prime example of how haki stands above; and I find undeniable that the reigning haki is haoshoku, not busoshoku, not kenbunshoku; and so far Shanks has the most hype in this regard.

To put it simple, swordsmanship is never addressed as a trascendental power while conqueror's haki is the mark of kings. Swordsmanship is never addressed as the key to power, but haki is. And being Roger the strongest character we've known so far, plus his title being addressed as that who reigns over conquerors, plus his spirit being closest to Shanks (and now Luffy), plus his overall treatment by Oda (seriously, the guy just intimidated an admiral from miles away), I just find it reasonable to maybe suspect a little bit that this may not turn out as simplistic as "Mihawk has a title, therefore".

Of one the most intelligent posts I've read, you clearly have good reading skills.
You are one of the few who gets portray.

 

[Taylor_]

Y'all zolo pests are too retarded to understand One PIECE if you cannot even read what is written properly. Despite the fact that the official translator has given his word, y'all brainless pests talk out of your own delusion. Get treated in a psychiatric hospital fast before y'all become a danger to yourself and others.

You should not be talking. Your man is carried by Nika.

 

[Pringles]

If the official translation speaks of his swordsmanship without explicitly mentioning "skill" then we'll be back to square one, no new information of value will have been given to us; but if "skill" is indeed present then it will be nuancing the issue even more, and I can't understand how those who read the translation mentioning Mihawk's skill (whether correct or not) took it as confirmation of his superiority instead of the contrary. I mean, nuancing rarely confirms anything.

My take won't change indeed, which is a skeptical take because seriously, I'm totally fine with Mihawk being stronger than Shanks (you may not believe it, I wouldn't care), but God do I distrust it just for how, how, how prominent Shanks is as a conqueror. Wasn't for it and I would be more sure, and don't get me wrong because Mihawk is obviously going to be a conqueror's too, but I have my doubts he will be as prominent as Shanks in this regard and the narrative behind his will is very powerful so far (closest to Pirate King in terms of spirit, inspired the main character to achieve his dream of freedom, can intimidate from Yonko commanders to even an admiral just with a blast...). We had Chinjao stating that the Pirate King is the conqueror atop conquerors, Kaidou put Shanks among those of his highest regard as adversaries and he later used Roger as the prime example of how haki stands above; and I find undeniable that the reigning haki is haoshoku, not busoshoku, not kenbunshoku; and so far Shanks has the most hype in this regard.

To put it simple, swordsmanship is never addressed as a trascendental power while conqueror's haki is the mark of kings. Swordsmanship is never addressed as the key to power, but haki is. And being Roger the strongest character we've known so far, plus his title being addressed as that who reigns over conquerors, plus his spirit being closest to Shanks (and now Luffy), plus his overall treatment by Oda (seriously, the guy just intimidated an admiral from miles away), I just find it reasonable to maybe suspect a little bit that this may not turn out as simplistic as "Mihawk has a title, therefore".

This guy may be the smartest over here.

 

[ConquistadoR]

Folks here widely regard Kaido as the Strongest, even when Shanks has infinitely more CoC hype than Kaido. When asked, it's due to the title & the portrayal that comes with it.

But for Mihawk alone, they backtrack and act as if Shanks' Conquerors makes a difference... the double standards man smh. Either double down and claim that Shanks is the Strongest, even above Kaido, because of his Conquerors or don't use CoC as an argument against Mihawk alone.

 

[Screws Loose242]

Zorofans why are you talking big when you have taken the greatest L ever by Zolo nearly dying to beat a YC1 after he fought Marco and Sanji and talk big about a simple attack of Kaido and Meme that he tried to stop for 0.001 second but could do shit to that and also nearly got killed like a fodder?

 

[Pringles]

Folks here widely regard Kaido as the Strongest, even when Shanks has infinitely more CoC hype than Kaido. When asked, it's due to the title & the portrayal that comes with it.

But for Mihawk alone, they backtrack and act as if Shanks' Conquerors makes a difference... the double standards man smh. Either double down and claim that Shanks is the Strongest, even above Kaido, because of his Conquerors or don't use CoC as an argument against Mihawk alone.

and Shanks may as well have already defeated Kaido once, where is Mihawk in this pic?

 

[Kerkovian]

and Shanks may as well have already defeated Kaido once, where is Mihawk in this pic?

Only Zolotards\ Mihawkcucks see Mihawk in this.

 

[ConquistadoR]

and Shanks may as well have already defeated Kaido once, where is Mihawk in this pic?

"May as well" =/= "Defeated"

Did Kaido meet Mihawk in his lifetime? Where is Big Mom (who Kaido could not beat over 3 days) in this pic? Where is Garp in this pic? Where is Sengoku in this pic?

 

[Sword God Ryuma]

and Shanks may as well have already defeated Kaido once, where is Mihawk in this pic?

Where is it stated Shanks defeated Kaido at all

 

[Pringles]

"May as well" =/= "Defeated"

Did Kaido meet Mihawk in his lifetime? Where is Big Mom in this pic? Where is Garp in this pic? Where is Sengoku in this pic?

Shanks:
- portrayed to have insane haki
- clashed with WB
- had an altercation with Kaido
- is in Kaido's top tier
- hasn't fought Mihawk since he lost his arm (where he was worth +- 1b)

Mihawk:
- "strongest swordsman"

Fans: Mihawk is stronger than Shanks because of his epithet

Maybe, just maybe, this epithet isn't as relevant as you think when the person who holds it doesn't want to fight his biggest rival anymore and there are tons of other reasons to believe that this rival may have surpassed him since then in combat

 

[Mr. Reloaded]

You should not be talking. Your man is carried by Nika.

Preach.

 

[zzShinichi]

Shanks:
- portrayed to have insane haki
- clashed with WB
- had an altercation with Kaido
- is in Kaido's top tier
- hasn't fought Mihawk since he lost his arm (where he was worth +- 1b)

Mihawk:
- "strongest swordsman"

Fans: Mihawk is stronger than Shanks because of his epithet

Maybe, just maybe, this epithet isn't as relevant as you think

Why not. Oda once again reaffirmed Mihawk's status as the WSS by directly comparing him to Shanks, also a fellow Swordman. You people kept saying Law and Kid are stronger than Zoro despte the latter showing COC feats MILES ahead either of them, because they are both potrayed as Captains. But when it comes to Mihawk, nope, tittles don't matter.

 

[gz89]

 

[ConquistadoR]

Shanks:
- portrayed to have insane haki
- clashed with WB
- had an altercation with Kaido
- is in Kaido's top tier
- hasn't fought Mihawk since he lost his arm (where he was worth +- 1b)

Mihawk:
- "strongest swordsman"

Fans: Mihawk is stronger than Shanks because of his epithet

So basically, before Kaido was shown in combat and fleshed out as a character in Wano - his epithet was shit, his portrayal was shit, he was weaker than Shanks even though we know it was wrong?

Maybe, just maybe, this epithet isn't as relevant as you think

So basically, Zoro's lifetime Dream is irrelevant? Because you are uncomfortable with Mihawk being over Shanks?

 

[Sword God Ryuma]

If the official translation speaks of his swordsmanship without explicitly mentioning "skill" then we'll be back to square one, no new information of value will have been given to us; but if "skill" is indeed present then it will be nuancing the issue even more, and I can't understand how those who read the translation mentioning Mihawk's skill (whether correct or not) took it as confirmation of his superiority instead of the contrary. I mean, nuancing rarely confirms anything.

My take won't change indeed, which is a skeptical take because seriously, I'm totally fine with Mihawk being stronger than Shanks (you may not believe it, I wouldn't care), but God do I distrust it just for how, how, how prominent Shanks is as a conqueror. Wasn't for it and I would be more sure, and don't get me wrong because Mihawk is obviously going to be a conqueror's too, but I have my doubts he will be as prominent as Shanks in this regard and the narrative behind his will is very powerful so far (closest to Pirate King in terms of spirit, inspired the main character to achieve his dream of freedom, can intimidate from Yonko commanders to even an admiral just with a blast...). We had Chinjao stating that the Pirate King is the conqueror atop conquerors, Kaidou put Shanks among those of his highest regard as adversaries and he later used Roger as the prime example of how haki stands above; and I find undeniable that the reigning haki is haoshoku, not busoshoku, not kenbunshoku; and so far Shanks has the most hype in this regard.

To put it simple, swordsmanship is never addressed as a trascendental power while conqueror's haki is the mark of kings. Swordsmanship is never addressed as the key to power, but haki is. And being Roger the strongest character we've known so far, plus his title being addressed as that who reigns over conquerors, plus his spirit being closest to Shanks (and now Luffy), plus his overall treatment by Oda (seriously, the guy just intimidated an admiral from miles away), I just find it reasonable to maybe suspect a little bit that this may not turn out as simplistic as "Mihawk has a title, therefore".

Shanks:
- portrayed to have insane haki
- clashed with WB
- had an altercation with Kaido
- is in Kaido's top tier
- hasn't fought Mihawk since he lost his arm (where he was worth +- 1b)

Mihawk:
- "strongest swordsman"

Fans: Mihawk is stronger than Shanks because of his epithet

Maybe, just maybe, this epithet isn't as relevant as you think when the person who holds it doesn't want to fight his biggest rival anymore and there are tons of other reasons to believe that this rival may have surpassed him since then in combat

Learn how to read it might help you

 

[[No Name]]

Folks here widely regard Kaido as the Strongest, even when Shanks has infinitely more CoC hype than Kaido. When asked, it's due to the title & the portrayal that comes with it.

But for Mihawk alone, they backtrack and act as if Shanks' Conquerors makes a difference... the double standards man smh. Either double down and claim that Shanks is the Strongest, even above Kaido, because of his Conquerors or don't use CoC as an argument against Mihawk alone.

I actually put Shanks above Kaido since again, I don't care about titles, I do care about hype and portray.
This chapter proved I was wrong about Mihawk overall, I thought he was a Low Top Tier, but now I definetely put him on the same ballbark of Shanks, I just still see Shanks as stronger for the reason @Charlotte Horchata gave.
I am fine with Mihawk being stronger than him, Just can't see It for the reasons Charlotte explained.

 

[ConquistadoR]

I actually put Shanks above Kaido since again, I don't care about titles, I do care about hype and portray.

Titles are portrayal. And you are factually wrong, since Kaido met Shanks in-person and then tells Luffy that "There is no one in this world who can beat me!".

This chapter proved I was wrong about Mihawk overall, I thought he was a Low Top Tier, but now I definetely put him on the same ballbark of Shanks, I just still see Shanks as stronger for the reason @Charlotte Horchata gave.

I am fine with Mihawk being stronger than him, Just can't see It for the reasons Charlotte explained.

Which is flimsy at best since all of Shanks' CoC hype FACTUALLY placed him below Kaido who does not have a fraction of Shanks' CoC hype.

So there is no excuse to place him over Mihawk because of his Conquerors, that's just bad faith debating considering the fact that Kaido can exist.

 

[Pringles]

So basically, before Kaido was shown in combat and fleshed out as a character in Wano - his epithet was shit, his portrayal was shit, he was weaker than Shanks even though we know it was wrong?


So basically, Zoro's lifetime Dream is irrelevant? Because you are uncomfortable with Mihawk being over Shanks?

1. Being the strongest creature doesn't mean you are invincible. Luffy defeated Kaido, does it mean Luffy has become the strongest creature? I'm sure you can apply this reasoning to Shanks being stronger than Mihawk. You can surpass someone without surpassing their epithet. Shanks can be above Mihawk without being a stronger swordsman, like Luffy is above Kaido without being stronger.

2. Zoro's lifetime dream is to get Mihawk's epithet, not to simply defeat him. Otherwise, he would have eaten a devil fruit or just eaten Mihawk himself. We don't know what it requires to be the world's strongest swordsman.

You are acting as if I cared that Mihawk could be above Shanks. In fact, they are relatively similar like Zoro and Sanji, or like King and Queen. This discussion in the first place is irrelevant considering how similar they are and we both acknowledge that.

However, Shanks is superior than Mihawk in my opinion and that epithet of yours is irrelevant in that comparison.