Questions & Mysteries Who is the traitor?
- Thread starter Johnny B. Decent
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1. Is there any confirmation yet that the traitor works for Kaido? And not for Orochi? Or both?
As we all know, Orochi is more cunning and cautious than Kaido. Having a traitor to spy on enemies fits Orochi type more.
2. No confirmation about traitor's motive yet. Whether he genuinely works for the enemies, or being forced / threatened to do so.
Carrot was aboard the Sunny. She is the trator, she needs to be lynched or being fed to Big Mom.
1. Is there any confirmation yet that the traitor works for Kaido? And not for Orochi? Or both?
As we all know, Orochi is more cunning and cautious than Kaido. Having a traitor to spy on enemies fits Orochi type more.
2. No confirmation about traitor's motive yet. Whether he genuinely works for the enemies, or being forced / threatened to do so.
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Carrot was aboard the Sunny. She is the trator, she needs to be lynched or being fed to Big Mom.
The Sunny's location is not a secret to the alliance. Robin, usopp, franky and zoro weren't aboard the ship but I'm sure they know where it is.
Oda doesn't have to reveal every information, tama isn't the only one to know its location.
And again she is linked to ace and luffy, we saw her inner thoughts, she is on the alliance side. No doubt about that.
Oda doesn't have to reveal every information, tama isn't the only one to know its location.
And again she is linked to ace and luffy, we saw her inner thoughts, she is on the alliance side. No doubt about that.
The thing is that's not how one piece works... its very hard for weaklings in general to just be super integral to the plot...
Like do you imagine Oda just cutting to a scene where it's revealed faceless goons are just that good and brought down the rebellion just like that
How the hell can this not be an anti climax in your eyes especially when it's been mentioned multiple times that there's a traitor but it just turns out to be random goon number 3
Like do you imagine Oda just cutting to a scene where it's revealed faceless goons are just that good and brought down the rebellion just like that
How the hell can this not be an anti climax in your eyes especially when it's been mentioned multiple times that there's a traitor but it just turns out to be random goon number 3
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just watchedarturs video. Its still hard to see carrot being traitor.
Of course he mentions hidden fourth calamity of kaidos beast pirates when odens castle was burning.
I know its hard to tell. My money is still on kanjuro but carrot looks like a heavy possibility as well.
Same as people didnt think pudding was evil.
I would say kanjuro is still on top.
Other scabbards looks less likely most of them were on run or hiding.
The thing with kanjuro lies the pitfallabout raizos location. Kanjuro would have no idea raizo may have reached there.
We know jack already arrived before them . This looks bummer since it reduces possibility of kanjuru was a double agent.
We know that carrot can smooth talk or act nice to people . Remember she is crazy powerful for her age.
Its really hard to point out on carrot. She was in major arc sailing with straw hats cried for pedro.
Ya nothing really make sense unless someone catches the traitor red handed.
Of course he mentions hidden fourth calamity of kaidos beast pirates when odens castle was burning.
I know its hard to tell. My money is still on kanjuro but carrot looks like a heavy possibility as well.
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Same as people didnt think pudding was evil.
I would say kanjuro is still on top.
Other scabbards looks less likely most of them were on run or hiding.
The thing with kanjuro lies the pitfallabout raizos location. Kanjuro would have no idea raizo may have reached there.
We know jack already arrived before them . This looks bummer since it reduces possibility of kanjuru was a double agent.
We know that carrot can smooth talk or act nice to people . Remember she is crazy powerful for her age.
Its really hard to point out on carrot. She was in major arc sailing with straw hats cried for pedro.
Ya nothing really make sense unless someone catches the traitor red handed.
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I am pretty sure oda will make sad flashback of her being orphan.
I mean even if carrot is traitor we dont know on what dituation she is acting up.
The point is she was allied with big mom . She played with sanji and fooled her love for him untill he smittened her on wedding day.
Well i am on guess hunt here i dont think carrot is evil even if she was traitor.
Also once oden flashback is done i am pretty sure the traitor will soon reveal.
We also know orochi never meet the informant so its just odd . So he was relying the info from beast pirates.
I mean even if carrot is traitor we dont know on what dituation she is acting up.
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The point is she was allied with big mom . She played with sanji and fooled her love for him untill he smittened her on wedding day.
Well i am on guess hunt here i dont think carrot is evil even if she was traitor.
Also once oden flashback is done i am pretty sure the traitor will soon reveal.
We also know orochi never meet the informant so its just odd . So he was relying the info from beast pirates.
M
How did you come to that conclusion? If anything, the traitor is loyal to Orochi and not Kaido.
Afterall, it is Orochi who is receiving Intel from the traitor. Orochi even said that he will handle this without involving Kaido. And remember, Orochi can command the SMILE users (e.g. Kamazou) too. Not to mention the fact that Kyoshiro, who is Orochi's subordinate, can call Queen to send his people for Kyoshiro's cause.
In fact, it seems that none of the plans ever reached anybody except Orochi. So, the traitor is loyal to Orochi.
Afterall, it is Orochi who is receiving Intel from the traitor. Orochi even said that he will handle this without involving Kaido. And remember, Orochi can command the SMILE users (e.g. Kamazou) too. Not to mention the fact that Kyoshiro, who is Orochi's subordinate, can call Queen to send his people for Kyoshiro's cause.
In fact, it seems that none of the plans ever reached anybody except Orochi. So, the traitor is loyal to Orochi.
Alright, after pondering a lot with this dilemma, I'm now confident that the traitor behind all of this is actually Shutenmaru... I wasn't too sure back then, but now I'm dead certain.
And the motives I believe he has for doing so makes so much sense.
Tama isn't the only one who knows of the sunny's location.
Shutenmaru knows as well... why? Because Luffy just casually revealed the location just like that.
And the motives I believe he has for doing so makes so much sense.
Tama isn't the only one who knows of the sunny's location.
Shutenmaru knows as well... why? Because Luffy just casually revealed the location just like that.
I'll be writing an essay on this thread about it, tho' I'll have to re-organize my thoughts on it... :) I tried to briefly elaborate on it but I ended up writing a full blown essay. xD So with Shutenmaru, I'm gonna have to take my time with this... My other suspicion is Shinobu as well, which is easier to explain..
1) In Shinobu's introduction, she says she was one of the Oniwabanshu, and said that she defected coz Fukurukuju switched to Orochi's side. She could be lying, and actually be a spy working for Orochi.
2) She was present in both Kinemon's original plan regarding the moon tattoo, and was also present when Kinemon orchestrated his plan on the raid to Onigashima. She knows the complete plan, the number of troops (robin said this at the same chapter Luffy blurted out the sunny's location: ch 955), etc
3) When Luffy just casually blurted out the location of the thousand sunny, it was to the red scabbards including Shutenmaru. Shinobu was present as well, situated next to Hitetsu, and may have heard it.
4) She chose to stay with Momonosuke, when the red scabbards decide to head for Onigashima.
The tears thing could be fake, and her accusing Law's crew of betraying the alliance is probably a way to distract the alliance into not thinking she was the traitor.
Regarding Shutenmaru, I'm gonna have to say sorry.
I'm really gonna have to take my time with this. xD
1) In Shinobu's introduction, she says she was one of the Oniwabanshu, and said that she defected coz Fukurukuju switched to Orochi's side. She could be lying, and actually be a spy working for Orochi.
2) She was present in both Kinemon's original plan regarding the moon tattoo, and was also present when Kinemon orchestrated his plan on the raid to Onigashima. She knows the complete plan, the number of troops (robin said this at the same chapter Luffy blurted out the sunny's location: ch 955), etc
3) When Luffy just casually blurted out the location of the thousand sunny, it was to the red scabbards including Shutenmaru. Shinobu was present as well, situated next to Hitetsu, and may have heard it.
4) She chose to stay with Momonosuke, when the red scabbards decide to head for Onigashima.
The tears thing could be fake, and her accusing Law's crew of betraying the alliance is probably a way to distract the alliance into not thinking she was the traitor.
Regarding Shutenmaru, I'm gonna have to say sorry.
I'm really gonna have to take my time with this. xD
On this topic, one of my fav Japanese one piece reviewers has been speculating for a while now that Kiku is the traitor and she further built on her theory recently, bringing up something I thought was really interesting, so I'll share it with you guys & girls ^^
In Chapter 959, Tsuru said the following:
In Chapter 921, Kiku said this to Kinemon:
I don't know about you guys, but there's an inconsistency here. In the first panel, Tsuru stated that she had met Kikunojo again, so it's very likely that Kiku revealed her identity to Tsuru, so why did she tell Kinemon that Tsuru doesn't know who she is?
Said, YouTuber speculated that Kiku might have purposely gotten close to Tsuru to get some kinda information on Kinemon.
Some additional points she's made on Kiku being the traitor across her speculation videos are:
1. the fact that Jack was able to find his way to Zou
- Considering Zou is always moving, it'd be impossible to get to it without having one of the scabbards vivre cards. In which case Jack must have gotten Raizou's vivre card from one of the 4 that time traveled, as they were only ones that knew for certain that the dead scabbards were alive. That said, considering Raizou, Kin, and Kanjuro left Wano, it's hard to imagine that one of they somehow returned back to wano and handed one of their vivre cards to the enemy so the prime suspect can only be one person. Kiku, who was left on Wano to gather information.
2. Kiku's presence in Okobore town
Kiku was originally left behind on Wano to gather information, so said youtuber speculated that it's a bit odd that she was in Okobore town and not the capital as it makes more sense for her to be gathering information in the capital. Moreover it was said that Kiku was in Okobore town for about a month, which makes it all the more strange, so she speculated that if we assume that Kiku is part of the enemy ranks, she would've known Doffy was defeated and that Kin and the others were probably heading towards Wano, so decided to stick by Tsuru to gather information.
3. the fact that Kiku wasn't one of the original scabbards
- if y'all remember when Luffy used Conqueror's Haki on Wano, whilst he and the others were going to save Tama, Kiku was surprised and couldn't comprehend what happened till it was explained to her. In contrast, when Shutenmaru saw Luffy use Conqueror's Haki, he stated that Luffy uses the same kinda Haki as Oden, so there's a stack discrepancy there with regards to how much Kiku actually knew about Oden in comparison to older members like Shutemaru, so she suspects that Kiku only joined the scabbards fairly recently
4. the fact that Kiku's face was covered when we got a close up of all the scabbards reactions when they were valiantly sailing to Onigashima in chapter 959.
If any of you guys or girls liked this theory, please be sure to give her videos a like to show your appreciation. I've linked them below ^^
In Chapter 959, Tsuru said the following:
In Chapter 921, Kiku said this to Kinemon:
I don't know about you guys, but there's an inconsistency here. In the first panel, Tsuru stated that she had met Kikunojo again, so it's very likely that Kiku revealed her identity to Tsuru, so why did she tell Kinemon that Tsuru doesn't know who she is?
Said, YouTuber speculated that Kiku might have purposely gotten close to Tsuru to get some kinda information on Kinemon.
In addition, this was something I personally thought off after watching her video but if y'all take a look at this:
When Kaidou appeared in Okobore town, Kin attempted to go an save his wife, but then Kiku stopped him from meeting her and said she would go and save her instead. I personally thought that was a bit suspicious after watching her video.
Also Oda's design for Kin and Kiku is very interesting. Kiku seems to be Kin's disciple and both have conflicting epithets (i.e. fire for Kin and Snow for Kiku ) so it'd be pretty interesting if Kiku does end up the traitor given she has a deep connection with Kin.
When Kaidou appeared in Okobore town, Kin attempted to go an save his wife, but then Kiku stopped him from meeting her and said she would go and save her instead. I personally thought that was a bit suspicious after watching her video.
Also Oda's design for Kin and Kiku is very interesting. Kiku seems to be Kin's disciple and both have conflicting epithets (i.e. fire for Kin and Snow for Kiku ) so it'd be pretty interesting if Kiku does end up the traitor given she has a deep connection with Kin.
Some additional points she's made on Kiku being the traitor across her speculation videos are:
1. the fact that Jack was able to find his way to Zou
- Considering Zou is always moving, it'd be impossible to get to it without having one of the scabbards vivre cards. In which case Jack must have gotten Raizou's vivre card from one of the 4 that time traveled, as they were only ones that knew for certain that the dead scabbards were alive. That said, considering Raizou, Kin, and Kanjuro left Wano, it's hard to imagine that one of they somehow returned back to wano and handed one of their vivre cards to the enemy so the prime suspect can only be one person. Kiku, who was left on Wano to gather information.
2. Kiku's presence in Okobore town
Kiku was originally left behind on Wano to gather information, so said youtuber speculated that it's a bit odd that she was in Okobore town and not the capital as it makes more sense for her to be gathering information in the capital. Moreover it was said that Kiku was in Okobore town for about a month, which makes it all the more strange, so she speculated that if we assume that Kiku is part of the enemy ranks, she would've known Doffy was defeated and that Kin and the others were probably heading towards Wano, so decided to stick by Tsuru to gather information.
3. the fact that Kiku wasn't one of the original scabbards
- if y'all remember when Luffy used Conqueror's Haki on Wano, whilst he and the others were going to save Tama, Kiku was surprised and couldn't comprehend what happened till it was explained to her. In contrast, when Shutenmaru saw Luffy use Conqueror's Haki, he stated that Luffy uses the same kinda Haki as Oden, so there's a stack discrepancy there with regards to how much Kiku actually knew about Oden in comparison to older members like Shutemaru, so she suspects that Kiku only joined the scabbards fairly recently
4. the fact that Kiku's face was covered when we got a close up of all the scabbards reactions when they were valiantly sailing to Onigashima in chapter 959.
If any of you guys or girls liked this theory, please be sure to give her videos a like to show your appreciation. I've linked them below ^^
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