Chapter Discussion Oda not only ruined Nami’s 1v1 this arc, but he also ruined her fighting style in the span of half a chapter.
- Thread starter Lion of Olympus
- Start date
The whole Zues disobeying Big Mom is a retcon because it was already established in WCI that souls from Big Mom aren’t allowed to disobey her which was the whole point of the Big Mom vivre card. Oda is not even proof reading his own work.
To be honest idk how Big Mom hasn’t been pirate king yet if all it takes for her is to create a soul as strong as a Tobi Robbo than why not create thousands of them.
To be honest idk how Big Mom hasn’t been pirate king yet if all it takes for her is to create a soul as strong as a Tobi Robbo than why not create thousands of them.
What are you talking about? Kalifa used Rokushiki throuhout the fight with Nami.
And actually drew blood, had her dodge, had some tactics, all the things that were notably missing from Nami vs Ulti
And actually drew blood, had her dodge, had some tactics, all the things that were notably missing from Nami vs Ulti
But I at least see what you mean, I would've actually liked to SEE Nami getting hurt as well. But dodging Ulti's attacks - someone who managed to even surprise Luffy - would've seemed unrealistic. The way it played out made sense and was still entertaining to me.
Also, Ulti was a very different opponent from Miss Doublefinger and Kalifa. There were no tactics from her side, just brute straightforward strength, so I'm fine with the fight also being different.
I found the fight and it's conclusion underwhelming, but i don't see how Nami's fighting style is ruined.
Pretty much every fight she's had has been won with gimmicks, she's no martial artist, and her fighting style has just been intelligently using weather attacks and lightning.
Zeus is just the latest gimmick, one that increases her AP substantially so her damage can be considerable going forward, but still keeps her the same frail human girl that uses weather tricks to win.
My only concern is that it could remove all of Nami's wit and quick thinking skills, but i think that's more of a problem of how this fight in particular was handled than a sign of her winning everything with lightning bolts in the future.
Pretty much every fight she's had has been won with gimmicks, she's no martial artist, and her fighting style has just been intelligently using weather attacks and lightning.
Zeus is just the latest gimmick, one that increases her AP substantially so her damage can be considerable going forward, but still keeps her the same frail human girl that uses weather tricks to win.
My only concern is that it could remove all of Nami's wit and quick thinking skills, but i think that's more of a problem of how this fight in particular was handled than a sign of her winning everything with lightning bolts in the future.
Literal flames are coming from that Pre-TS attack.
Both attacks are from the Diable Jambe series.
It is still the same power. Lel.
Both attacks are from the Diable Jambe series.
It is still the same power. Lel.
Yes, heat can cause flames. There's a difference between that and Sanji summoning flames all by himself. You see how I didn't need to circle Sanji summoning flame around his leg to show it?
Or are you pretending that Sanji was summonimg flames before Fishman Island. Do you need the Vivre Card where we are explicitly told: "Sanji heats up his leg with friction" on Pre TS and "Sanji uses the power of spontaneous combustion" Post TS? Or the fodder saying 'his leg is red' Vs epost TS "he's on fire".
Do you really think P1 is done for good? I think he will get up later and go berserk when he sees Ulti defeated. It wouldn’t make any sense for both him and Usopp for that BM punch to be the end of him. P1 hasn’t done a single thing at Onigashima besides be Ulti’s bitch boy, and the most notable thing Usopp has done so far is capture Bao Huang, a fodder. It would also be rather stupid if a nameless ACoA punch from BM was that much stronger than a combined attack from all 3 of her Homies. Why even have the Homies if all 3 of them combined can’t even match the AP of a random punch?
the only thing I can say is that battle that takes place from now on isn't on the level that used to be. If getting a certain PU is ruining a character then Oda ruined every single one of SHs time and time again.
Luffy- FS, AdvCoA + AdvCoC
Zoro- Enma
Sanji-RS
Usopp-CoO Advanced one too
Robin-Giant Limbs
Chopper-can stay in Monster Point longer
Franky- Vegapunk tech
Brook-????
Nami-????? (Zeus)
Nami didn't have any big PU while returning after TS. She just had better knowledge of how to. It was Usopp who updated her climatact according to her instruction/ she needed a help.
Now with the addition of Zeus, she is independent. Zeus may look like he is a complete fighter on is own but we've seen how he operated before under Big Mom. Nami can utilize her arsenal more efficiently with her own personal cloud and not having to rely on the weather being favorable to her. Isn't that the satisfying for the fans who waited years. Nami being able to hold off and take on bigger-badder opponents on her own and not having to rely on some plot.
And the pre TS fights of Nami were all had cheats on her in the name of mirage tempo. She could fool her opponents then by creating her fake images while she could think of her next attack and even pull off a sneak attack. In the New World, it has been rendered useless due to the element of Haki. Which is why oda hasn't shown that technique.
Just casue Oda showed us Zeus being a formidable foe doesn't mean Nami will get to shine on her own. Just think of him as a Zarvis or Friday from MCU.
Luffy- FS, AdvCoA + AdvCoC
Zoro- Enma
Sanji-RS
Usopp-CoO Advanced one too
Robin-Giant Limbs
Chopper-can stay in Monster Point longer
Franky- Vegapunk tech
Brook-????
Nami-????? (Zeus)
Nami didn't have any big PU while returning after TS. She just had better knowledge of how to. It was Usopp who updated her climatact according to her instruction/ she needed a help.
Now with the addition of Zeus, she is independent. Zeus may look like he is a complete fighter on is own but we've seen how he operated before under Big Mom. Nami can utilize her arsenal more efficiently with her own personal cloud and not having to rely on the weather being favorable to her. Isn't that the satisfying for the fans who waited years. Nami being able to hold off and take on bigger-badder opponents on her own and not having to rely on some plot.
And the pre TS fights of Nami were all had cheats on her in the name of mirage tempo. She could fool her opponents then by creating her fake images while she could think of her next attack and even pull off a sneak attack. In the New World, it has been rendered useless due to the element of Haki. Which is why oda hasn't shown that technique.
Just casue Oda showed us Zeus being a formidable foe doesn't mean Nami will get to shine on her own. Just think of him as a Zarvis or Friday from MCU.
Bruh, the argument was never about how Sanji produces fire, only that he could do so Pre-TS.
Topi's original quote regarding Pre-Sanji's flame powers.
"Producing fire". Not how he produced fire, not the method that he produced fire, just that he was capable of doing so.
Your counterclaim.
"Pre timeskip Sanji didnt have fire powers." Nothing about how Pre-TS Sanji did it differently compared to Post-TS Sanji, just that he had none.
Which is blatantly incorrect.
You can split hairs over what the source of Sanji's flaming ability is but the fact remains that Sanji was capable of producing flames both before and after the Time Skip, contrary to this claim.
Topi's original quote regarding Pre-Sanji's flame powers.
"Producing fire". Not how he produced fire, not the method that he produced fire, just that he was capable of doing so.
Your counterclaim.
"Pre timeskip Sanji didnt have fire powers." Nothing about how Pre-TS Sanji did it differently compared to Post-TS Sanji, just that he had none.
Which is blatantly incorrect.
What was this then? 
Literal flames are coming from that Pre-TS attack.
Both attacks are from the Diable Jambe series.
It is still the same power. Lel.
Both attacks are from the Diable Jambe series.
It is still the same power. Lel.
You mentıoned Sanji .
Which character of SH dıd take neccessary plotting after time skip. Noone. Just Luffy.
After Posttime skip , we just seen law and luffy.
zoro faced just one strong opponent before wano (pica . (monet , fishguy not even close zoros level )
sanji entered a couple shot versus constntly.
nami - chopper - franky gentleman guy .d.d brook hang out BM no versus Robin no versus
Why split up SHs dros and wcı ? instead writing bullshit character (pedro carrot contender of dros champioship ) oda can bring all crew same where. his writing ability is getting collapse day by day. main reason is he try to deal with more character.
One piece reader just want to see cool , hype , consistent SHs moment.
But in reality what did we see ? we have seen :
every arc , do we have to connect Ace ? he created yamato why ? purpose ? tama must be chimney. not main role.
Oda put flying six . we are exciting. result : BM mother feelings goes to ulti and nami defeated ulti (reality zeus ) . nami dont even know how to defeat.
why all war depends on child character ? bullshit.
Oda preferred to plot other character anymore. he is ignoring SHs .
Which character of SH dıd take neccessary plotting after time skip. Noone. Just Luffy.
After Posttime skip , we just seen law and luffy.
zoro faced just one strong opponent before wano (pica . (monet , fishguy not even close zoros level )
sanji entered a couple shot versus constntly.
nami - chopper - franky gentleman guy .d.d brook hang out BM no versus Robin no versus
Why split up SHs dros and wcı ? instead writing bullshit character (pedro carrot contender of dros champioship ) oda can bring all crew same where. his writing ability is getting collapse day by day. main reason is he try to deal with more character.
One piece reader just want to see cool , hype , consistent SHs moment.
But in reality what did we see ? we have seen :
every arc , do we have to connect Ace ? he created yamato why ? purpose ? tama must be chimney. not main role.
Oda put flying six . we are exciting. result : BM mother feelings goes to ulti and nami defeated ulti (reality zeus ) . nami dont even know how to defeat.
why all war depends on child character ? bullshit.
Oda preferred to plot other character anymore. he is ignoring SHs .
its not splitting hairs.
Sanji, Pre TS, has a process. He spins in place and heats up his leg to the point where he can cause things to burn from the extreme heat when he kicks them. That is physics, cartoon physics mind you, but it is not superpowers. Otherwise your logic would dictate that anyone capable of using a matchbox has firepowers.
And if you want to split hairs on "producing fire", then yes, child Sanji could do that. It's called turning on the cooker. That's not the point.
Sanji, Post Timeskip. Can summon flames from nowhere. The flames are not an effect of the heat, he is creating the flames to heat up his feet. One is fire powers. The other is not.
TL:DR, someone swiping a match on a matchbox and it ignites =/= not super powers. Someone holding a fire stick and causing it to ignite? Superpowers.
Sanji, Pre TS, has a process. He spins in place and heats up his leg to the point where he can cause things to burn from the extreme heat when he kicks them. That is physics, cartoon physics mind you, but it is not superpowers. Otherwise your logic would dictate that anyone capable of using a matchbox has firepowers.
And if you want to split hairs on "producing fire", then yes, child Sanji could do that. It's called turning on the cooker. That's not the point.
Sanji, Post Timeskip. Can summon flames from nowhere. The flames are not an effect of the heat, he is creating the flames to heat up his feet. One is fire powers. The other is not.
TL:DR, someone swiping a match on a matchbox and it ignites =/= not super powers. Someone holding a fire stick and causing it to ignite? Superpowers.
People want to see the fruit of the labors of the SH training for 2 yrs, but we are not getting that. Only Luffy has truly shined post TS and it is becoming infuriating. Wano was the perfect setup to see the SH other than Luffy struggle to a win with what they learn during the timeskip and we are not getting it.
Some people are saying that Nami can't defeat a healthy Ulti. Nami also wasn't suppose to beat Ms Doublefinger and Kalifa, but she found a way to persevere. We did not get that here.
Some people are saying that Nami can't defeat a healthy Ulti. Nami also wasn't suppose to beat Ms Doublefinger and Kalifa, but she found a way to persevere. We did not get that here.
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