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Fanclub Temple of The Grandmaster Zoro
- Thread starter Guan Yu
- Start date
- Tags #zoro bodies your fave #zoro is unparalleled in all existence 110 cm all hail peroroncino chopper solos cruzeiro cruzeiro cryyyys kings titties > zoros nik belongs in an asylum pero a bitch weakling what happened to the good tags? woro carries mid piece zoro zoro > luffy zoro > your fav
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Lmao watch him come up with a copout explanation that doesn’t make much sense, because with the shit he set and showed you can’t say that Roger ain’t a swordsman without trying to find alternatives that don’t hold much weight ( the gun).
Besides I don’t think Roger seemingly being a swordsman can be used to say Zoro will surpass him when Zoro’s goal is about surpassing Mihawk. Roger was never mentioned/not even supposed to be under the same context.
Besides I don’t think Roger seemingly being a swordsman can be used to say Zoro will surpass him when Zoro’s goal is about surpassing Mihawk. Roger was never mentioned/not even supposed to be under the same context.
You are mistaken.
Zoro's goal is not to surpass Mihawk, his goal is to be the strongest swordsman of all time. That is the promise he made with Kuina.
If Mihawk is the GOAT swordsman then Zoro's goal will be accomplished otherwise, if Mihawk is not the GOAT and is just the wss of the current era then no, Zoro's goal will not be accomplished.
It is similar to how Luffy wants to be pk to show that he surpassed Shanks. If Luffy makes a crew that surpasses Shanks but he doesnt become pk then his dream will not be accomplished. However, if he becomes pk without ever defeating Shanks, his crew automatically surpasses Shanks crew.
Zoro's goal is not to surpass Mihawk, his goal is to be the strongest swordsman of all time. That is the promise he made with Kuina.
If Mihawk is the GOAT swordsman then Zoro's goal will be accomplished otherwise, if Mihawk is not the GOAT and is just the wss of the current era then no, Zoro's goal will not be accomplished.
It is similar to how Luffy wants to be pk to show that he surpassed Shanks. If Luffy makes a crew that surpasses Shanks but he doesnt become pk then his dream will not be accomplished. However, if he becomes pk without ever defeating Shanks, his crew automatically surpasses Shanks crew.
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The thing with Roger is though he’s not a swordsman in the same vein as Mihawk and Zoro, if that was the case it would have been made clear from day one.
With what we got, Roger wasn’t known for his swordsmanship he was known more as the guy who did the impossible by finding Raftel, matching someone like Prime Whitebeard in battle etc.
Swordsmanship is not something that comes up in the grand scheme of Roger’s character. One panel showing him displaying some swordsmanship isn’t going to suddenly change that fact.
Because of that, Zoro’s end goal simply has nothing to do with Roger because he’s not swordsman first if you get what I mean. Guys like Mihawk, Vista, Zoro,Law, Fujitora etc are and have been specified as such. With Roger he’s not been potrayed that way, neither has he ever been labeled or specified as such as well.
also side note about the GOAT swordsman statement, according to @Den_Den_Mushi , the raw text doesn’t say that. I would ask for a translation from Den on that matter though.
With what we got, Roger wasn’t known for his swordsmanship he was known more as the guy who did the impossible by finding Raftel, matching someone like Prime Whitebeard in battle etc.
Swordsmanship is not something that comes up in the grand scheme of Roger’s character. One panel showing him displaying some swordsmanship isn’t going to suddenly change that fact.
Because of that, Zoro’s end goal simply has nothing to do with Roger because he’s not swordsman first if you get what I mean. Guys like Mihawk, Vista, Zoro,Law, Fujitora etc are and have been specified as such. With Roger he’s not been potrayed that way, neither has he ever been labeled or specified as such as well.
also side note about the GOAT swordsman statement, according to @Den_Den_Mushi , the raw text doesn’t say that. I would ask for a translation from Den on that matter though.
Oda was very clear what a swordsman is in the Cabaji vs Zoro fight in the begining of the series.
He used many techniques and tricks that had nothing to do with swordsmanship but Oda still considered him a swordsman.
Daz Bones was also considered a swordsman by Zoro even then he had no sword.
If those 2 are swordsmen in Zoro's(Oda's) eyes, then Roger is definitely a swordsman.
Zoro's goal has nothing to do with any swordsman. He just wa SBS to be the GOATswordsman. He wants his name to be known throughout the heavens. When he made his promise to Kuina, he never mentioned any swordsman.
Any swordsman that stands in his way towards achieving his dream will be defeated and zoro wont lose to them, it is as simple as that based on his promise to Kuinaand his chat with Cabaji.
All this requirements like primarily using a sword etc are all fan made requirements. If you look at the manag, the only requirement is that zoro sees you as a swordsman. Even if you don't have a sword like the caseof Daz bones
As for Zoro and swordsmen, you are talking about someone (Zoro) who had a world famous sword (wado) since his childhood but never even knew that. If he doesnt even know that, then knowing a lot about the swordsman world is an unrealistic goal.
The only swordsman he knows is Mihawk cause he is the wss. Everyone and their grand mother knows about Mihawk. Zoro has no reason to chase after Roger as Roger is dead. His sites are on Mihawk right now cause he isthe current was. He also showed this i dont care attitude when in Wanoand receiving info on Ryuma. He also doesnt care about it.
He used many techniques and tricks that had nothing to do with swordsmanship but Oda still considered him a swordsman.
Daz Bones was also considered a swordsman by Zoro even then he had no sword.
If those 2 are swordsmen in Zoro's(Oda's) eyes, then Roger is definitely a swordsman.
Zoro's goal has nothing to do with any swordsman. He just wa SBS to be the GOATswordsman. He wants his name to be known throughout the heavens. When he made his promise to Kuina, he never mentioned any swordsman.
Any swordsman that stands in his way towards achieving his dream will be defeated and zoro wont lose to them, it is as simple as that based on his promise to Kuinaand his chat with Cabaji.
All this requirements like primarily using a sword etc are all fan made requirements. If you look at the manag, the only requirement is that zoro sees you as a swordsman. Even if you don't have a sword like the caseof Daz bones
As for Zoro and swordsmen, you are talking about someone (Zoro) who had a world famous sword (wado) since his childhood but never even knew that. If he doesnt even know that, then knowing a lot about the swordsman world is an unrealistic goal.
The only swordsman he knows is Mihawk cause he is the wss. Everyone and their grand mother knows about Mihawk. Zoro has no reason to chase after Roger as Roger is dead. His sites are on Mihawk right now cause he isthe current was. He also showed this i dont care attitude when in Wanoand receiving info on Ryuma. He also doesnt care about it.
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Yeah my problem with that is that it creates a precedent for people being so good with a sword but not be classified as a swordsmen... Just cheapens Zoro's dream for me if they can be dudes stronger than him and being so good with sword but just because of some bs they are not considered as one
Mihawk is great but all the other cool sword using mtfs pretty much have DF and shit and Oda can now just state they don't count as swordsmen? Making Zoro's dream come with a huge asterisk to it?
It's a dangerous route and hope Od clears this shit up in satisfying way
Mihawk is great but all the other cool sword using mtfs pretty much have DF and shit and Oda can now just state they don't count as swordsmen? Making Zoro's dream come with a huge asterisk to it?
It's a dangerous route and hope Od clears this shit up in satisfying way
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In these cases you bring up these characters being swordsmen are specified/fall under the context of Zoro’s goal and honor as a swordsman. Cabaji straight up called himself a swordsman for example. I’m already familiar with all these points tho, saw them alot back on the thread you created on OJ about what a swordsman is. I ain’t saying Roger ain’t a swordsman at all from what he has shown so far, he is a swordsman of some sort based on that.
But with Roger there’s simply nothing indicating he’s a swordsman in the same vein as Mihawk and the others. If that was the case, Oda would have been clear about that in day one and it would be connected with Zoro as someone he would surpass as the greater swordsman when it is all said and done. Since Roger has none of this going for him and only one sequence of him displaying swordsmanship in what was otherwise a 3 day offpaneled fight, he simply has nothing to do with Zoro’s goal.
Its as simple as that tbh imo. Because you think it would be important for Oda early on to add atleast a footnote that “Hey Roger was a swordsman” but that isn’t mentioned anywhere. This could only mean that having some swordsmanship doesn’t always mean that you are swordsman first like Mihawk and the others are.
Btw Imma move this if you don’t mind to the Roger swordsman thread if it gets long just cuz I ain’t wanna fill the Zoro FC with too much of this topic.
But with Roger there’s simply nothing indicating he’s a swordsman in the same vein as Mihawk and the others. If that was the case, Oda would have been clear about that in day one and it would be connected with Zoro as someone he would surpass as the greater swordsman when it is all said and done. Since Roger has none of this going for him and only one sequence of him displaying swordsmanship in what was otherwise a 3 day offpaneled fight, he simply has nothing to do with Zoro’s goal.
Its as simple as that tbh imo. Because you think it would be important for Oda early on to add atleast a footnote that “Hey Roger was a swordsman” but that isn’t mentioned anywhere. This could only mean that having some swordsmanship doesn’t always mean that you are swordsman first like Mihawk and the others are.
Btw Imma move this if you don’t mind to the Roger swordsman thread if it gets long just cuz I ain’t wanna fill the Zoro FC with too much of this topic.
Am not sure why you guys are worried about this.
Cabaji was considered a swordsman by Zoro(Oda)
Daz bones who doesnt even have a sword was considered a swordsman by Zoro(Oda)
If those 2 were considered swordsmen by Oda, I dont see why he wont consider Roger a swordsman.
If Oda didnt want Roger, Rocks, BM, Shanks etc to be swordsmen, he would not have given them swords.
Oda is someone who workeD ON SAMURAI X. A manag about weapons etc.
If he didnt wnt someone to be a swordsman but wanted them to use weapons he had already help in a manga with multiple types of weapons. So he wants lacking knowledge when it comes to weapons
He is also the one that decided to make Zoro want to be the strongest swordsman off all time.
If you read the manga there is no where it restricts by setting a boundary for the people called swordsmen. As a matter of fact, it actually expands and includes people who shouldn't even be considered swordsmen (Daz boned) into the category of swordsmen.
Oda would be writing himself in acorner if he turned around and said Roger is not aswordsman when he said Daz bones is a swordsman
Cabaji was considered a swordsman by Zoro(Oda)
Daz bones who doesnt even have a sword was considered a swordsman by Zoro(Oda)
If those 2 were considered swordsmen by Oda, I dont see why he wont consider Roger a swordsman.
If Oda didnt want Roger, Rocks, BM, Shanks etc to be swordsmen, he would not have given them swords.
Oda is someone who workeD ON SAMURAI X. A manag about weapons etc.
If he didnt wnt someone to be a swordsman but wanted them to use weapons he had already help in a manga with multiple types of weapons. So he wants lacking knowledge when it comes to weapons
He is also the one that decided to make Zoro want to be the strongest swordsman off all time.
If you read the manga there is no where it restricts by setting a boundary for the people called swordsmen. As a matter of fact, it actually expands and includes people who shouldn't even be considered swordsmen (Daz boned) into the category of swordsmen.
Oda would be writing himself in acorner if he turned around and said Roger is not aswordsman when he said Daz bones is a swordsman
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Aight.
I don’t think he’ll say that, would just result in him contradicting himself for sure. Thing is though like I said we can’t look at the recent chapter and conclude that Roger is a swordsman just like Mihawk for example. If that is the case, on top of everything I said he would also be the WSS of his time (should be a no brainer) yet an important fact like that never came outta Oda’s mouth. So either he isn’t a swordsman like Mihawk and Co, or Oda is now after 25 years deciding to come out with this, which would be a retcon.
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I don’t think he’ll say that, would just result in him contradicting himself for sure. Thing is though like I said we can’t look at the recent chapter and conclude that Roger is a swordsman just like Mihawk for example. If that is the case, on top of everything I said he would also be the WSS of his time (should be a no brainer) yet an important fact like that never came outta Oda’s mouth. So either he isn’t a swordsman like Mihawk and Co, or Oda is now after 25 years deciding to come out with this, which would be a retcon.
