General & Others Oden was a shit leader and deserved to die
- Thread starter Monkey D Theories
- Start date
Oden just wanted peace and tried to figure out a way how to save his people.
H
You already answered it yourself. If kaido came 20 years ago oden would have backing of his damiyos and civilians.
Thats what oda did make oden lose what ever he had.
Also it wouldnt expand to what kurozumi grand parents were scheming as well.Those 5 years gap makes sense it build enough resource for kaido to have decent army to fight against oden and any wano rebels. This was all done to make false promise and build silent army .
Thats what oda did make oden lose what ever he had.
Also it wouldnt expand to what kurozumi grand parents were scheming as well.Those 5 years gap makes sense it build enough resource for kaido to have decent army to fight against oden and any wano rebels. This was all done to make false promise and build silent army .
Oda gave us a very lame excuse behind what Oden did, he should have come up with something better... Yes, a few people would have died, but that's what happens in a war. Oden just made the situation worse by waiting for 5 years, and what kind of naive person would believe the proposal Orochi made, when he literally just a few minutes ago declared that his sole aim in life is to destroy Wano. What Oden did makes no sense whatsoever. As Grindelwald and Dumbledore said, some sacrifices have to be overlooked for the sake of Greater Good.
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Why are people comparing Oden's situation to examples of others acting out for the greater good? They really aren't the same at all when you look at the whole context.
All of those characters were up against literally unbeatable odds. The entire world government, the strongest pirate in the East Blue (vs a little kid that can't fight) etc.
In every case, there was literally no choice but to desperately trust in the enemy. They were getting screwed over regardless, so things couldn't have got much worse for their loved ones anyway.
This is NOT comparable to Oden's stupidity.
-Oden who helped his enemy rise up from literally nothing, to the Shogun position.
-Oden who abandoned his country for years because of his own selfish desires
-Oden who refused to squash the issue when it would've been an absolute walk in the park using WB or Roger's crew
-Oden learnt from Orochi himself that his sole purpose for being Shogun was to destroy Wano and take revenge. Oden let him stay Shogun for half a decade anyways.
-Oden who upon return danced naked in the streets for 5 whole years without a single backup plan, despite being one of the strongest people alive who could've fought back
A ton of OP characters are dumb. But this was something special. This was something else entirely. It's as the OP put it, it can almost be seen as treason.
This was not one dumb decision. There were multiple times Oden could've stopped this, but he dumbed out at literally every turn possible.
All of those characters were up against literally unbeatable odds. The entire world government, the strongest pirate in the East Blue (vs a little kid that can't fight) etc.
In every case, there was literally no choice but to desperately trust in the enemy. They were getting screwed over regardless, so things couldn't have got much worse for their loved ones anyway.
This is NOT comparable to Oden's stupidity.
-Oden who helped his enemy rise up from literally nothing, to the Shogun position.
-Oden who abandoned his country for years because of his own selfish desires
-Oden who refused to squash the issue when it would've been an absolute walk in the park using WB or Roger's crew
-Oden learnt from Orochi himself that his sole purpose for being Shogun was to destroy Wano and take revenge. Oden let him stay Shogun for half a decade anyways.
-Oden who upon return danced naked in the streets for 5 whole years without a single backup plan, despite being one of the strongest people alive who could've fought back
A ton of OP characters are dumb. But this was something special. This was something else entirely. It's as the OP put it, it can almost be seen as treason.
This was not one dumb decision. There were multiple times Oden could've stopped this, but he dumbed out at literally every turn possible.
Wait...the guy who liberated, pacified and enrichea whole region by his leadership is a bad leader 
Let me get this straight you are basically judging Oden’s action from the readers POV and knowledge. Oden did not know everything you know about Orochi or Kaido’s personalities neither he known about what Wano would become later
Furthermore, Oden’s never wanted to be Shogun, it has been said several times
You guys are basically shitting on Oden because he did not do something cool with his Uber strength. It is exactly why people where shitting on Big Mom in WCI
Let me get this straight you are basically judging Oden’s action from the readers POV and knowledge. Oden did not know everything you know about Orochi or Kaido’s personalities neither he known about what Wano would become later
Furthermore, Oden’s never wanted to be Shogun, it has been said several times
You guys are basically shitting on Oden because he did not do something cool with his Uber strength. It is exactly why people where shitting on Big Mom in WCI
I didn't address one of the prominent reason of hate on oden "he could have go to WB or Roger's crew for help"
Well picking up this as a reason itself reflects that hate for oden is more because he didn't act like the way you guys wanted him to...his acts should be based on his character and the circumstances he was in not based on fans expectations.
Oden going to WB or Roger's crew would be more stupid. Why?
Because wano is closed country with many pirates and wg eyeing on it. Don't you guys think that inviting WB and Roger's crew to wano would have drawn whole world attention to wano especially that of world government?
Do you really think that navy would simply sit quiet and let wb and Roger's crew gather in wano immediately after Roger getting one piece?
This act would have bring more danger to wano because it would have result into wano being totally destroyed with a war much bigger than MF or in worse case scenario wg getting hold over it which oden didn't intend to at any cost.
It totally make sense from oden perspective why he didn't go for help.
Well picking up this as a reason itself reflects that hate for oden is more because he didn't act like the way you guys wanted him to...his acts should be based on his character and the circumstances he was in not based on fans expectations.
Oden going to WB or Roger's crew would be more stupid. Why?
Because wano is closed country with many pirates and wg eyeing on it. Don't you guys think that inviting WB and Roger's crew to wano would have drawn whole world attention to wano especially that of world government?
Do you really think that navy would simply sit quiet and let wb and Roger's crew gather in wano immediately after Roger getting one piece?
This act would have bring more danger to wano because it would have result into wano being totally destroyed with a war much bigger than MF or in worse case scenario wg getting hold over it which oden didn't intend to at any cost.
It totally make sense from oden perspective why he didn't go for help.
Let me get this straight you are basically judging Oden’s action from the readers POV and knowledge. Oden did not know everything you know about Orochi or Kaido’s personalities neither he known about what Wano would become later
his country
was invaded
by terrorists
there is literally only one response to this. Like even if you don't want war, when your country is fucking invaded, you do something to show that your enemy cannot just walk all over you. Its why the Ayatollah decided to bomb areas close to American bases as a show of power after trump killed an Iranian general. As opposed to him stripping naked and dancing .
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If your country was invaded by terrorists, would you be okay with your leaders acting like Oden?
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they let kaido take wano kuni
plus, the navy isn't strong enough to stop whitebeard, at least not prime whitebeard
J
26 years ago Oden had better chances than 20 years ago
We know Oda wrote it.
But let's talk about characters Oda wrote
Oden is crap
He blew chances 3x
People are here talking about him going to laugh Tale as if it helped his country even
26 freaking years, wano has been under oppression
But it's alright "Oden went to Laugh Tale and decided to play it safe and save 100s"
Oden was super great
What the heck
Orochi clearly says to Oden about how he just wanna destroy wano which pissed Oden to attack Kaido there.
But you here saying "oden didnt know about orochi personality "
Liberating Kuri isnt the same as liberating wano
He failed to free Wano...instead he put wano in disaster because of his decisions
Sacrifices are meant to be taken for greater good
Oden was naive
We know Oda wrote it.
But let's talk about characters Oda wrote
Oden is crap
He blew chances 3x
People are here talking about him going to laugh Tale as if it helped his country even
26 freaking years, wano has been under oppression
But it's alright "Oden went to Laugh Tale and decided to play it safe and save 100s"
Oden was super great
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Wait...the guy who liberated, pacified and enrichea whole region by his leadership is a bad leader
Let me get this straight you are basically judging Oden’s action from the readers POV and knowledge. Oden did not know everything you know about Orochi or Kaido’s personalities neither he known about what Wano would become later
Furthermore, Oden’s never wanted to be Shogun, it has been said several times
You guys are basically shitting on Oden because he did not do something cool with his Uber strength. It is exactly why people where shitting on Big Mom in WCI
Let me get this straight you are basically judging Oden’s action from the readers POV and knowledge. Oden did not know everything you know about Orochi or Kaido’s personalities neither he known about what Wano would become later
Furthermore, Oden’s never wanted to be Shogun, it has been said several times
You guys are basically shitting on Oden because he did not do something cool with his Uber strength. It is exactly why people where shitting on Big Mom in WCI
What the heckOrochi clearly says to Oden about how he just wanna destroy wano which pissed Oden to attack Kaido there.
But you here saying "oden didnt know about orochi personality "
Liberating Kuri isnt the same as liberating wano
He failed to free Wano...instead he put wano in disaster because of his decisions
Sacrifices are meant to be taken for greater good
Oden was naive
Pretty much this, especially when he encountered honorable pirates beforehand(Whitebeard and Roger). From his perspective, it was actually a good choice.
- They offered him to free every hundred hostages at every dance
And it's not like he did it blindly. He came to check everytime if everyone was alright and had a 5year time limit. From his perspective, the pirates may or may not have been as honorable as Whitebeard/Roger, but even if in case they were lying, he could have at least tried to save as much hostages as he could during those years and ultimately fight them off after the 5years timelimit if they didn't concur to the deal anyway, and ultimately his plan was working until the "killing of Hyogoro's wife" that made him realize they broke the deal and went all in then. Before that:
- They had multiple hostages, and even if he fought right there are now, he wasn't sure to win. They had the upperhand not only because they could kill the hostages at any time, but they could use them to weaken him emotionally as well
Even if he ended up winning the battle, it'd come down to a similar situation to Orochi's. Remember the reason why he ended up being evil? It's because his family was persecuted. Oden may have been strong himself, but his family would have been persecute. The image of the Kozuki clan would have been destroyed, all of that ruining his plan:
- Opening Wano borders, which will play a huge part in the world of one piece with the ancient kingdom, ancient weapons and relational battle against world government, history that Oden likely learned from his travel with Whitebeard and Roger, something he'd not have learned if he stayed in Wano
So ultimately then, i'd say that Oden just made one mistake, which was leaving Wano, because leaving Wano, indirectly allowed the grandma/grandpa/Orochi plot to build up into killing his dad and slowly but surely detroying the country, with kidnappings allowing Orochi/Kaido to gain emotional edge over him, but it's not like he could have known all that would have happened in his absence
On the other hand, as already mentioned before while he did made that mistake, his travel all over the world allowed him to grant a knowledge in the relation between Wano and Ancient Kingdom that he didn't know before, with this leading to something more important than his life, which would be to free the world from the world government, with his purpose in life(open Wano borders) being a trigger to that.
He wanted to live long enough to accomplish that because he believed he could use his infamy as Kozuki to lead as Shogun and manage that, but when he realized it wasn't his time yet, he decided as a last effort for someone else to inherit that will, with the new reincarnation of Joyboy and Momonosuke playing a huge part in it imo, with his legacy being leaving his swords behind to accomplish that
- They offered him to free every hundred hostages at every dance
And it's not like he did it blindly. He came to check everytime if everyone was alright and had a 5year time limit. From his perspective, the pirates may or may not have been as honorable as Whitebeard/Roger, but even if in case they were lying, he could have at least tried to save as much hostages as he could during those years and ultimately fight them off after the 5years timelimit if they didn't concur to the deal anyway, and ultimately his plan was working until the "killing of Hyogoro's wife" that made him realize they broke the deal and went all in then. Before that:
- They had multiple hostages, and even if he fought right there are now, he wasn't sure to win. They had the upperhand not only because they could kill the hostages at any time, but they could use them to weaken him emotionally as well
Even if he ended up winning the battle, it'd come down to a similar situation to Orochi's. Remember the reason why he ended up being evil? It's because his family was persecuted. Oden may have been strong himself, but his family would have been persecute. The image of the Kozuki clan would have been destroyed, all of that ruining his plan:
- Opening Wano borders, which will play a huge part in the world of one piece with the ancient kingdom, ancient weapons and relational battle against world government, history that Oden likely learned from his travel with Whitebeard and Roger, something he'd not have learned if he stayed in Wano
So ultimately then, i'd say that Oden just made one mistake, which was leaving Wano, because leaving Wano, indirectly allowed the grandma/grandpa/Orochi plot to build up into killing his dad and slowly but surely detroying the country, with kidnappings allowing Orochi/Kaido to gain emotional edge over him, but it's not like he could have known all that would have happened in his absence
On the other hand, as already mentioned before while he did made that mistake, his travel all over the world allowed him to grant a knowledge in the relation between Wano and Ancient Kingdom that he didn't know before, with this leading to something more important than his life, which would be to free the world from the world government, with his purpose in life(open Wano borders) being a trigger to that.
He wanted to live long enough to accomplish that because he believed he could use his infamy as Kozuki to lead as Shogun and manage that, but when he realized it wasn't his time yet, he decided as a last effort for someone else to inherit that will, with the new reincarnation of Joyboy and Momonosuke playing a huge part in it imo, with his legacy being leaving his swords behind to accomplish that
Wait...the guy who liberated, pacified and enrichea whole region by his leadership is a bad leader
Let me get this straight you are basically judging Oden’s action from the readers POV and knowledge. Oden did not know everything you know about Orochi or Kaido’s personalities neither he known about what Wano would become later
Furthermore, Oden’s never wanted to be Shogun, it has been said several times
You guys are basically shitting on Oden because he did not do something cool with his Uber strength. It is exactly why people where shitting on Big Mom in WCI
Let me get this straight you are basically judging Oden’s action from the readers POV and knowledge. Oden did not know everything you know about Orochi or Kaido’s personalities neither he known about what Wano would become later
Furthermore, Oden’s never wanted to be Shogun, it has been said several times
You guys are basically shitting on Oden because he did not do something cool with his Uber strength. It is exactly why people where shitting on Big Mom in WCI
At least one person in this thread got the idea behind Oden ...
The lengths other teens are going to diffame a character because he didn't do "something uber cool/badass" that met their expectation is hilarious again. Happened with BM, happened with Kaido, happened with Oden, will happen with the admirals etc.
The lengths other teens are going to diffame a character because he didn't do "something uber cool/badass" that met their expectation is hilarious again. Happened with BM, happened with Kaido, happened with Oden, will happen with the admirals etc.
@Bogard and Oden had empathy towards Orochi's "suffering" of him and everyone with the name Kurozumi being persecuted. Like the fishmen that acted evil as they had been enslaved by humans, but ultimately some gained trust in them. So from this perspective of Orochi being a little crybaby that wants an apology, it would be easier to believe Orochi than Kaido himself, who has no personal affection with Wano.
Since the Wano citizens will ultimately honor Oden's choice and Oda's narrative is also that this action was noble from Oden's point of view, the only thing to debate about is whether it was naive to believe Orochi or not with the knowledge Oden had.
Since the Wano citizens will ultimately honor Oden's choice and Oda's narrative is also that this action was noble from Oden's point of view, the only thing to debate about is whether it was naive to believe Orochi or not with the knowledge Oden had.
Incompetent leader but somehow transformed kuri into a flourishing land. if being admirable and compassionate is foolish and stupid then ur fucking stupid. This man had the respect of wb and roger. Orochi and Kaido didn’t care about the people of wano and oden did. He did what he could to save these people from a mass genocide. A country is empty without its people.this man put family, friends and his own people before him.Put some respect on oden. A man as great as oden doesn’t deserve to die.
It’s possible to feel one way about Oden and another about Orochi at the same time. I don’t think Oden did enough to save Wano from the beginning, and whether or not his intentions were pure, his action or lack thereof rubs a lot of people the wrong way. Orochi is still a heinous monster who deserves to go down for his crimes, but this flashback doesn’t make Oden look much better by comparison.
Dude, Zoro literally made a deal with Hemeppo at the start of OP, which would've killed him, if Luffy didn't intervene.
Not to mention Sanji and his multiple deals during the Zou and WCI arc, all of which would've led to his and the SHs death.
Characters - especially heroes - do this "honorable, but naive" stuff all the time in fictional works.
Not to mention Sanji and his multiple deals during the Zou and WCI arc, all of which would've led to his and the SHs death.
Characters - especially heroes - do this "honorable, but naive" stuff all the time in fictional works.
I had to call you out. Shout out to you all
