Theory Kuzan is still working for the navy and the fight with Sakazuki was orchestrated by the gorosei

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Kuroshika

#21
2. I dont forgott about Kizaru, but he is no Kind of leader. He is very lightheaded and doesnt think about possibilities. For example when he wanted to head for Wano and needed to be stopped, i didnt even thought about it a second time. You cant give the lead to someone this lightheaded.
That is literally what I stated when I said they complement each others in personalities as well lol, without Kuzan, Sakazuki lacks of support for his mind
 
#22
1.Akainu’s views of justice wouldn’t let somebody as dangerous for the navy as Kuzan wandering the seas and give navy confidential informations to the pirates, that is too dangerous. He would rather have killed his friend in dignity than let him become a pirate collaborator.

2. You seem to forget Kizaru my dear, Kizaru could have been promoted FA too as I said. But even tho he is has experience and does really good job, on top of being the oldest, Sengoku didn’t even bat an eye at him. Why is that ? Why wasn’t Kizaru even taken in consideration ?
1. That is only if he questioned Aokiji loyalty. Having spent years with him he knew their methods were different bt they both were on same side of Justice.
2. You would get your answer if you recall what we have seen of Kizaru so far. I mean Kizaru followed the orders at Saboady and in Marines as he was told. Bt that is not what a leader is, a leader takes into accounts his own thoughts, moral/best thing to do. And Aokiji did that as we saw these qualities in Aokiji at Ohara Buster call, in Ennis Lobby and his ideals collides with what a true justice should look like. Sengoku must have realised this and wanted to fwd a name that won't blindly follow WG orders irrespective of how bad it is for common people.
 
K

Kuroshika

#24
Also just imagine, one of the two new Admirals could have been the spies, if it was ultimate motive here. No one knew how they looked in th3 start and Akainu could have ordered him to do so, instead of orchestrating a battle, that weakened their own forces i.e Aokiji loosing a leg based on a mere possibility.
And WG also never hinted the 3 Admirals were too powerful for em to control, they always have been there. They have the power to disband any of em, also have the support of the member countries.
The battle was turned to their advantage, Kuzan is now known as a former navy soldier who left for pirates after his friend almost killed him. Perfect cover.
The gorosei had authority over Sengoku who was followed by the admirals because of their bond of friendship and respect. The admirals are Loyal to Sengoku, not to the gorosei. That’s why Saka trash talks them. They could have orchestrated a fight in order to get rid of Sakazuki, because he is working for himself and you can’t control or corrupt him. But it didn’t end up as they planned. The Gorosei have been shown manipulating the world from the shadows, in their castle, we don’t even know their names yet they are ruling the world. Ryo or Fuji could be spies, but Fujitora seems similar to Sakazuki yet they don’t know how to work together. There are many breaches in the actual structure of the navy that allows the Gorosei to control them better, they can’t plot shit. They can’t understand each other. That is why Fuji and Ryo are here. They are strong enough to protect the navy, and the CD, but they are not powerful enough as a team to plan an actual rebellion against the gorosei
 
A

ardym

#25
2. I dont forgott about Kizaru, but he is no Kind of leader. He is very lightheaded and doesnt think about possibilities. For example when he wanted to head for Wano and needed to be stopped, i didnt even thought about it a second time. You cant give the lead to someone this lightheaded.
Kizaru is for sure is not a leader , he more like a marionette
 
K

Kuroshika

#26
And he took that Support in form of Issho now. But that doesnt Change why they couldnt take Kizaru als FA.
The support from Issho is weaker than the one from Kuzan, Issho is still a newbie and Sakazuki doesn’t seem to take him seriously. He’s anger is barely contained.
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Kizaru is for sure is not a leader , he more like a marionette
Seems like you underestimate him lol
Kizaru is very intelligent. He acts dumb but he is not.
 
A

ardym

#27
The support from Issho is weaker than the one from Kuzan, Issho is still a newbie and Sakazuki doesn’t seem to take him seriously. He’s anger is barely contained.
Fujitora has his own mind just like Kuzan , and can imagine that he will desert the marines
 
K

Kuroshika

#28
Fujitora has his own mind just like Kuzan , and can imagine that he will desert the marines
I know that, reinforcing the fact that Issho (and probably Ryo too) went admirals out of nowhere and that was clearly a WG move to restrain admirals from their powers. Kuzan and Sakazuki were shown being arguing, but it was never violent. Because they know each other and they learned to work together over the years, wich is not the case with Fujitora
 
A

ardym

#29
I know that, reinforcing the fact that Issho (and probably Ryo too) went admirals out of nowhere and that was clearly a WG move to restrain admirals from their powers. Kuzan and Sakazuki were shown being arguing, but it was never violent. Because they know each other and they learned to work together over the years, wich is not the case with Fujitora
still Akainu has brought upon himself and his system is gonna be failure and he will lose at the end , Kuzan if he survives he will be at the winner sinde at the end.
 
K

Kuroshika

#30
still Akainu has brought upon himself and his system is gonna be failure and he will lose at the end , Kuzan if he survives he will be at the winner sinde at the end.
Sakazuki and Borsalino can’t afford to lose Kuzan and they know it. Kuzan is still with them
 

Pantheos

Heavy Metal
#31
The support from Issho is weaker than the one from Kuzan, Issho is still a newbie and Sakazuki doesn’t seem to take him seriously. He’s anger is barely contained.
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Seems like you underestimate him lol
Kizaru is very intelligent. He acts dumb but he is not.

Exactly, his Anger is barely contained. Isshio does his part, but Kuzan obviously isnt. If Kuzan would be something around Akainu still, he would manage that Anger, or in other words: cool him down.
Also, Akainu isnt that Kind of character who accepts he is full of Anger and Needs somebody like Kuzan, so why should he try to replace him in that way?

As i said, your consipirancy-Theory about the Admirals and the WG could be true, but i dont see the hints you see. ^^
 
K

Kuroshika

#33
Exactly, his Anger is barely contained. Isshio does his part, but Kuzan obviously isnt. If Kuzan would be something around Akainu still, he would manage that Anger, or in other words: cool him down.
Also, Akainu isnt that Kind of character who accepts he is full of Anger and Needs somebody like Kuzan, so why should he try to replace him in that way?

As i said, your consipirancy-Theory about the Admirals and the WG could be true, but i dont see the hints you see. ^^
Oh come one they learned to acknowledge their own weaknesses lmao
Zephyr told them
 

Reborn

Throughout Heaven & Earth,I alone am d Honored One
#35
The central theme of your speculation is fine - Kuzan working along with Sakazuki or with marines but the arguments you made is flawed.

First, Gorosei were upset on Kuzan leaving marines so there is no sense why they orchestrated the fight

Second, this gamble looks way too one sided for Kuzan than for Sakazuki. It's like Kuzan is losing everything while Sakazuki gained everything

Third, Jinbei description of fight doesn't give feel of it being made up. It speaks of all seriousness and they being equally matched up. ("until/but" at the end to me implies Akainu pulled something on 10th day to defeat Kuzan which made Kuzan leave the marine for good)
Fourth, Kuzan deserved to be FA. Him being lazy doesn't deprive of that status. Sengoku preferred him because he awe him more worthy to carry the responsibility because of his ideals.
 
K

Kuroshika

#36
And you think Akainu accept his weakness and his Need for someone like Kuzan? I doubt.
Well, doubt lmao I’m pretty positive he can
First, Gorosei were upset on Kuzan leaving marines so there is no sense why they orchestrated the fight
they can lie and they lie a lot
Also : they have a reason to blame Sakazuki wich puts them in a powerful position towards him
Second, this gamble looks way too one sided for Kuzan than for Sakazuki. It's like Kuzan is losing everything while Sakazuki gained everything
Kuzan gained to stay alive where Sakazuki could have ended him, pretty sure Kuzan didn’t have a choice to refuse
Third, Jinbei description of fight doesn't give feel of it being made up. It speaks of all seriousness and they being equally matched up. ("until/but" at the end to me implies Akainu pulled something on 10th day to defeat Kuzan which made Kuzan leave the marine for good)
Fourth, Kuzan deserved to be FA. Him being lazy doesn't deprive of that status. Sengoku preferred him because he awe him more worthy to carry the responsibility because of his ideals.
jimbei ain’t no gorosei he doesn’t know shit he just knows a fight happened lmao he can talk all he wants doesn’t make him know the details, + he a pirate so obviously neither Kuzan or Saka told him shit

The lack of experience and motivation Kuzan has is clearly unworthy
 
#38
Then he wouldn't have told Smoker to contact Akainu. Apart from that his words were, that "even outside the navy you can change a lot". And given the conversation Akainu had with the Gorosei, it further suggests that Aokiji is done with the navy.
 

Uncle Van

Monké Don't Do Taxes
#39
Aokiji being a Revo never made any sense. He tried to kill Robin(the Light of the Revolution) and tried killing Luffy 3 times in MF(tries to kill Luffy but Marco stopped him, froze the ocean to prevent Jinbe from escaping with Luffy, froze the ocean to kill Law).

Aokiji was willing to become the Fleet Admiral and still gives Akainu heads up on things that can harm the marines. Akainu even said Aokiji has nothing to do with the Navy and the Gorosei seem to be none the wiser as well.

Either Kuzan is completely independent or is working for CP0(they can even act without the Gorosei knowing). The "anonymous tip" that revealed Baltigo's location to CP0 points to Aokiji, since BB and his crew found out about it first through Burgess and coincidentally, CP0 shows up afterwards.
 
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