Character Discussion Can Oda write Zoro becoming WSS without winning the fight?
- Thread starter ImmaIvanoM
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Did you see the scene in Arlong Park where Luffy picked up a pair of Swords? That's what it looks like when an extremely strong individual tries to wield Swords, with zero skill. Could Luffy hold a pair of Swords, call himself a Swordsman, and then punch his way to the title of WSS, like he was doing on Wano? Cause his actual skills with a Sword are grade A garbage.
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The logical blunder of assuming Mihawk wasn't Wss when he was dueling Shanks to stalemate is such a delirious notion, which is the one of the only 2 ways
Let me ask the proponents this, knowing that the marines knew about their duels and shanks being inferior in skill , if Mihawk wasn't the WSS then when he was dueling with shanks.. And he never won against Shanks which is a canonical reality.
Then why tf does the title even exist?
Especially knowing that :
- there is a clear and sole known exception that he couldn't over come to become Wss later.
And
- it would only make sense that he attained the title by defeating the required competition before he even first fought shanks.
if he got it after stalemating shanks then wouldn't there be a box left unchecked in the competition ?
Ie: mihawk could never beat the required competition to be entitled WSS. Wouldn't that not make him WSS?
So him being Wss means one of the 2:
- either him being WSS before shanks and his stalemate ( why else would someone like white beard consider it legendary)
- or they deemed him WSS COZ SHANKS LOST AN ARM which isn't a metric to gauge current shanks, who's using his only arm to split skis with whitebeard, meaning shanks still remains an exception to the WSS title.
Let me ask the proponents this, knowing that the marines knew about their duels and shanks being inferior in skill , if Mihawk wasn't the WSS then when he was dueling with shanks.. And he never won against Shanks which is a canonical reality.
Then why tf does the title even exist?
Especially knowing that :
- there is a clear and sole known exception that he couldn't over come to become Wss later.
And
- it would only make sense that he attained the title by defeating the required competition before he even first fought shanks.
if he got it after stalemating shanks then wouldn't there be a box left unchecked in the competition ?
Ie: mihawk could never beat the required competition to be entitled WSS. Wouldn't that not make him WSS?
So him being Wss means one of the 2:
- either him being WSS before shanks and his stalemate ( why else would someone like white beard consider it legendary)
- or they deemed him WSS COZ SHANKS LOST AN ARM which isn't a metric to gauge current shanks, who's using his only arm to split skis with whitebeard, meaning shanks still remains an exception to the WSS title.
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And when did we get to know that Mihawk failed or Shanks failed to defeat the other? All we know that they both fought equally then Shanks lost an arm and Mihawk was later named the Strongest.
Ok how about i explain where the "Strongest" part comes in. Chapter 50 Mihawk came on Panel with the title "Sekai Saikyō no Kenshi" You can use Dai Kengou sure why not even tho the latest chapters still said "Sekai Saikyō no Kenshi" but whatever he has both titles. Now lets focus here.
Chapter 50 Zoro attacked Mihawk and found out that his Strength is beyond what he imagined. Which means he couldn't even push him.
Now Mihawk used Skills to beat Zoro here while Zoro tried both Strength and Skill and failed. Which means Zoro lacked Strength.
Now if you remember every scene Zoro is training he is 80% of the time "lifting heavy weights" and keeps calling himself "Weak" not "Unskilled".
Now use your imagination here and think of this.... If Shanks was "STRONGER" than Mihawk. Wouldn't Shanks vs Mihawk = Zoro vs Mihawk in Chapter 50?
Mihawk has all the skills but lacks Strength which means he couldn't even "Clash" with Shanks. How in the world would their duel "echo" throughout the grandline? Or why would they call them legendary duels if Mihawk was not able to swing his sword equally to Shanks who was supposed to be his "equal".
imagine a truck "Shanks" and a bike "Mihawk charged at each others both have swords on front. Whats going to happen here?
- Truck crashes into the bike and the bike is destroyed. Obvious outcome and no one would care.
- Bike uses "skill" to evade and slash a Truck from the side. Is that even gonna do anything? the Truck is bigger and Stronger.
Now if you think about it.. Mihawk is bitter at Shanks for the arm thing.. and everything we know so far hints at Mihawk not claiming the Title by beating Shanks but by Shanks losing his arm and Mihawk declared the Strongest out of them since Shanks can no longer equal him with 1 arm.
But honestly i know that this post will mean nothing to you or anyone else
.
So yes you are correct Mihawk is not the Strongest and Shanks is stronger with 1 arm because hes Shanks. :cheers:
Ok how about i explain where the "Strongest" part comes in. Chapter 50 Mihawk came on Panel with the title "Sekai Saikyō no Kenshi" You can use Dai Kengou sure why not even tho the latest chapters still said "Sekai Saikyō no Kenshi" but whatever he has both titles. Now lets focus here.
Chapter 50 Zoro attacked Mihawk and found out that his Strength is beyond what he imagined. Which means he couldn't even push him.
Now Mihawk used Skills to beat Zoro here while Zoro tried both Strength and Skill and failed. Which means Zoro lacked Strength.
Now if you remember every scene Zoro is training he is 80% of the time "lifting heavy weights" and keeps calling himself "Weak" not "Unskilled".
Now use your imagination here and think of this.... If Shanks was "STRONGER" than Mihawk. Wouldn't Shanks vs Mihawk = Zoro vs Mihawk in Chapter 50?
Mihawk has all the skills but lacks Strength which means he couldn't even "Clash" with Shanks. How in the world would their duel "echo" throughout the grandline? Or why would they call them legendary duels if Mihawk was not able to swing his sword equally to Shanks who was supposed to be his "equal".
imagine a truck "Shanks" and a bike "Mihawk charged at each others both have swords on front. Whats going to happen here?
- Truck crashes into the bike and the bike is destroyed. Obvious outcome and no one would care.
- Bike uses "skill" to evade and slash a Truck from the side. Is that even gonna do anything? the Truck is bigger and Stronger.
Now if you think about it.. Mihawk is bitter at Shanks for the arm thing.. and everything we know so far hints at Mihawk not claiming the Title by beating Shanks but by Shanks losing his arm and Mihawk declared the Strongest out of them since Shanks can no longer equal him with 1 arm.
But honestly i know that this post will mean nothing to you or anyone else
. So yes you are correct Mihawk is not the Strongest and Shanks is stronger with 1 arm because hes Shanks. :cheers:
Oda already defined what a swordsman is
We saw it during the king and Zoro fight. Literally most of King’s fight with Zoro involved King using a sword. And he used it well too. He used it well enough that he actually bested Zoro twice in sword clashes… So your argument about Luffy using a sword badly doesn’t work because King can use a sword VERY WELL and he is still NOT a swordsman
Oda defined a swordsman as someone who uses sword techniques and styles. That’s it.
Mihawk is the man who can defeat EVERY SINGLE PERSON WHO USES SWORD TECHNIQUES AND STYLES
Or Mihawk can’t actually defeat every single person who uses sword techniques and styles and simply has the best sword styles but is actually able to be beaten by very many other people who uses sword techniques… Right?
@Tai long
If there exists someone Mihawk can’t beat then why is that person WSS
what do you mean “do something mihawk can’t do”? Are you saying you think Oda can write it that Zoro becomes WSS without even fighting ANYONE? Then why has Zoro been fighting people for over 1000 chapters if his goal can be achieved without fighting?
@Herrera95
You’re saying you expect that the 1000 chapters of Zoro’s journey to achieve his dream and fighting and winning all his fights to reach the top, will end with a cutting contest? Zoro won’t fight anyone to achieve his goal?
We saw it during the king and Zoro fight. Literally most of King’s fight with Zoro involved King using a sword. And he used it well too. He used it well enough that he actually bested Zoro twice in sword clashes… So your argument about Luffy using a sword badly doesn’t work because King can use a sword VERY WELL and he is still NOT a swordsman
Oda defined a swordsman as someone who uses sword techniques and styles. That’s it.
Mihawk is the man who can defeat EVERY SINGLE PERSON WHO USES SWORD TECHNIQUES AND STYLES
Or Mihawk can’t actually defeat every single person who uses sword techniques and styles and simply has the best sword styles but is actually able to be beaten by very many other people who uses sword techniques… Right?
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@Tai long
If there exists someone Mihawk can’t beat then why is that person WSS
what do you mean “do something mihawk can’t do”? Are you saying you think Oda can write it that Zoro becomes WSS without even fighting ANYONE? Then why has Zoro been fighting people for over 1000 chapters if his goal can be achieved without fighting?
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@Herrera95
You’re saying you expect that the 1000 chapters of Zoro’s journey to achieve his dream and fighting and winning all his fights to reach the top, will end with a cutting contest? Zoro won’t fight anyone to achieve his goal?
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What are you even trying to get at here? Mihawk has a better style, but loses to someone with a better technique? Lol, that doesn't even make any sense. Everyone has a different style of Swordsmanship, but the style is defined by their skill!/technique. They go hand in hand. You can't have better skill, but a worst style.
Of course Zoro will defeat Mihawk, thats probably the most obvious fight that will happen in the manga.
Oda is even saving the moment Zoro turn his Blades Black for this fight.
Cant beliave someone think Zoro will become the WSS after cutting a random thing or defeating any other character that isnt the guy who is his end-goal for the last 25y of story lol
Oda is even saving the moment Zoro turn his Blades Black for this fight.
Cant beliave someone think Zoro will become the WSS after cutting a random thing or defeating any other character that isnt the guy who is his end-goal for the last 25y of story lol
No I mean Mihawk has better skill techniques and style, But the swordsman he is fighting is massively faster than him and massively stronger than him and he simply gets SPEED BLITZED AND ONE SHOT
is that possible? For Mihawk to lose a sword fight against another swordsman simply because they have better stats than him?
is that possible? For Mihawk to lose a sword fight against another swordsman simply because they have better stats than him?
But what makes the WSS the WSS? Is it their skill or them winning the fight?
because if it’s their skill then it should theoretically be possible that Oda writes it that Zoro doesn’t have to win his final fight right?
@Garp the Fist
When would Oda introduce this?
Oda would have to both introduce this thing that can’t be cut and he would have introduce the lore that people give a fuck about whether it can’t be cut… Like we are 1000 chapters in and no one seems to care about how well mihawk can cut anything, they simply care about defeating mihawk… Now Oda will have to introduce that ACTUALLY people all along actually really cared about this cutting thing and actually being able to cut it supersedes defeating mihawk
because if it’s their skill then it should theoretically be possible that Oda writes it that Zoro doesn’t have to win his final fight right?
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@Garp the Fist
When would Oda introduce this?
Oda would have to both introduce this thing that can’t be cut and he would have introduce the lore that people give a fuck about whether it can’t be cut… Like we are 1000 chapters in and no one seems to care about how well mihawk can cut anything, they simply care about defeating mihawk… Now Oda will have to introduce that ACTUALLY people all along actually really cared about this cutting thing and actually being able to cut it supersedes defeating mihawk
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What makes someone win in OP is the narrative / plot. Zoro must win by narrative, not due to detailed stats, or which stat he is stronger than Mihawk in. Thus by plot, Zoro will be both a stronger overall than Mihawk (shown by Zoro winning the fight) and also the stronger swordsman (shown by Zoro having greater technique that wins the fight). Thats what i think, if you wanna discuss about Zoro vs Mihawk related to WSS.
In Hajime no Ippo, Ippo loses his title match against Date Eiji.
Since Date retires before Ippo can go for a rematch, Ippo gets the title by beating Sendo (who he had already defeated previously) and no ones cries about "hurr durr but he lost to Date".
So, yeah, he can become WSS without fighting Mihawk.
Will he do it? No.
Since Date retires before Ippo can go for a rematch, Ippo gets the title by beating Sendo (who he had already defeated previously) and no ones cries about "hurr durr but he lost to Date".
So, yeah, he can become WSS without fighting Mihawk.
Will he do it? No.
