Questions & Mysteries Is advanced CoC really only no touching?

[Buggy D Clown]

Yet we don't see CoA Hardening on Shanks Blade..

We are talking about Luffy, now everyone is a point of reference for AdCoC besides Zoro for some reason

 

[Rootbeer]

We are talking about Luffy, now everyone is a point of reference for AdCoC besides Zoro for some reason

Bro.. The Point of references have always been the reveals.. Shanks' first named attack..

There are Hardening there on Whitebeard and Roger's Blade.. It's still irrelevant to the attack being only AdCoC..

 

[Buggy D Clown]

Bro.. The Point of references have always been the reveals.. Shanks' first named attack..

There are Hardening there on Whitebeard and Roger's Blade.. It's still irrelevant to the attack being only AdCoC..

Yeah so Luffy's first reveal, Shanks', Roger's and Zoro's right?

 

[Rootbeer]

Yeah so Luffy's first reveal, Shanks', Roger's and Zoro's right?

- The first time AdCoC is used by the Main character Luffy
- The first time AdCoC is visually portrayed by the WSM and the Pirate King in a Clash
- The first time AdCoC is used in the first Named attack of current Yonko Shanks
- The first time AdCoC + ID CoA is visually explained by the Legendary Hero of the Marines


- The first time ID CoA + CoC + Blade is Visually shown by Roger's Kamusari
- The first time ID CoA + CoC + Blade is used by the Main character Zoro

Don't you see how Important they are in the Narrative..

 

[ConquistadoR]

Good point. So I think it just means the application of CoC with AdvCoA like I said.

Internal penetration on it's own is never drawn with a barrier IIRC. It's only when used with CoC do you see a barrier.

Kaidou does not do non contact. So if Kaidou was using advCoC, Law nor Oden would be in awe. So that point is moot anyway (actually Law himself witnessed Kaidou attacking multiple times, he was never in awe, since contact was made, only when Luffy someone who confirmed possesses highest level of advCoA uses advCoC do you get that result).

This entire non contact thing was likely just drawn into the manga so that Luffy can clash in close quarters with Kaidou without being throttled everytime.

Kaidou also uses a Kanobo to fight and has to coat it with Armament & Conquerors everytime, so he has to be able to flow haki outside as well - meaning AdvCoA but not Internal Destruction.

Post automatically merged: Apr 11, 2023

Jesus what the fuck am i even reading... "pushed cushions" and "blow balloons" good lord.

 

[Philosoraptor]

I'll just address these two points since we were mostly agreed on everything else.

If you make a big enough barrier with level 2 and imbue it with CoC then you will be attacking without touching. Hyou never considered it attacking without touching because his barriers were too small to do it. But if, say, Galaxy Fist is level 2 CoA as you acknowledged is a possibility, that would undeniably be considered attacking without touching.

Yeah possibly

I don't think the standard is size since Luffy collar removal wouldn't be considered ID. Hyo say this part is beyond his teaching of Ryou.

See now I'm confused. Portrayal-wise, Luffy used the exact same technique as Rogerbeard used - we can infer this through Oden and Law's statements. So if Luffy was using level 3 CoA, then it's highly likely that WB and Roger were too. Furthermore, you just said that you believe you can't 'not-touch' using only level 2 CoA or did I misinterpret your response? So even according to your understanding, Rogerbeard must've been using level 3 CoA no?

Level 2 users can use outward haki in: defensive barriers and CoA weapons. The Rogerbeard scenario is aCoC's( CoC aspect) creating the space between each other, not Level 3 CoA. Hence the confusion. If Rogerbeard were to hit with their aCoC it would hypothetically just look like Kaido's, Oden, Yamato, and Zoro's hits.

Furthermore, Rayleigh is an ACoC user. He was seen walking and emitting black lines vs Blackbeard. Yes, I'm aware other characters have emitted black lines and it's not necessarily ACoC but let's be real, it's Rayleigh we're talking about here. Rayleigh was emitting black lines at a time where Oda is slowly revealing to us who all the ACoC users are through the emitting of black CoC lines. Plus Zoro is an ACoC user so it's safe to assume Rayleigh was too considering Zoro hasn't reached prime Rayleigh yet

I can accept that. Minus the @Bold part, but that's not part of the topic so I won't reach.

Rayleigh is also a level 3 CoA user. We know this because Luffy used level 3 CoA to destroy the handcuffs. Yamato couldn't do it herself because she doesn't have ID CoA to destroy the cuffs from the inside. If Luffy used ID CoA to destroy the cuffs, then so did Rayleigh as they performed the exact same feat. Furthermore, when Luffy saved Hyo by removing the handcuffs, Hyo was shocked that he finally managed to get it right which means destroying the handcuffs is a level 3 feat. Hyo is a level 2 user, and he couldn't do it himself. So Rayleigh can also use ACoC + ID CoA.

Additionally, Sabo may also be a level 3 CoA user. He destroyed the ring from the inside. If he has awakened ACoC then he'd also go into that category. I said Shanks might because let's be real, it's Shanks. Bro's probably maxed out his Haki, especially if he's seemingly copied Roger. Garp is a solid bet too, as you acknowledged.

That does indeed open a can of worms... Since Ray can do ID then logically people can say his superior should as well. But it doesn't seem to be the case for every character, as pointed out.
I think we should just play safe and not pass around Level3 feats regardless since Level 2 does closely tie with Level 3. It's best to just go by who's been confirmed so far.

 

[JoNdule]

I'm just giving my opinion..

It did make a Sphere for Galaxy Impact?.. And the Ring happens when there is a AdCoC + ID CoA Clash..

I don't know but AdCoC can be either Emission Defense or Internal Destruction Defense.. So you can't just blatantly AdCoA for everything.. There's Level 2 and 3..

It does matter.. AdCoC is the only no touch..

Kaido may have CoA Emission but definitely not Internal Destruction CoA, which is why he lost against Luffy..
That's a good point Kaido didn't understand why the Scabbards could cut his Scales..

This story is simple for Oda

He didn't say "when you see someone touch someone, it's not adcoc "
Luffy understood CoC coating after being hit by Ragnarok which was coated with CoC
Kaido's attacks are coated with coc yet contact, same with Yamato

You been writing all these paragraphs by making haki more confusing that already what Oda made

 

[Nidai_Kitetsu]

Jesus what the fuck am i even reading... "pushed cushions" and "blow balloons" good lord.

Wait, I just noticed this I cant believe it =>

So you do not agree that AdCoC + ID CoA looks is akin to a Blown Balloon, while AdCoC has the appearance of a Pushed Cushion

Yo brother Rootbear, what are you smoking?

Oda's not saying, "let me draw a barrier here, but not here for fun". It's more like, "this attack makes no sense to have a barrier around it, vs this attack could benefit from ID"

This is true, agreed

If you follow that panel, Luffy is only defending (aka he only needs to use the barrier not ID) from Kaidou's attack, Kaidou is being stopped by Luffy's barrier, Kaidou is not using one himself.

Question is, why use CoC at all in such cases?

When Luffy follows up with an attack you see his hands are coated, which may imply ID is being used along with CoC. Barrier is mostly useful for defending anyway. In many cases you are stnting your attack by using a barrier, only ID is a true enhancement offensively for brawlers.

This explains why CoA is used with CoC. However, I am still not convinced that emission or barrier are exclusive to CoA just like hardening can be done with both CoA and CoC.

 

[Rootbeer]

Yo brother Rootbear, what were you i

What.. Sorry i don't get it.. Unreal examples?..

 

[ConquistadoR]

Wait, I just noticed this I cant believe it

Fandom: Oda drew Pushed Cushion and not a Blow Balloon for a reason!

Meanwhile, Oda:

 

[Rootbeer]

Fandom: Oda drew Pushed Cushion and not a Blow Balloon for a reason!

Meanwhile, Oda:

It's a freaking analogy.. Get over it..

 

[zzShinichi]

So much bandwitch, so much calories, so much neurons wasted for this shit. Meanwhile Oda laguhing his ass offf to the bank

 

[Zolo]

No touch happens
It's not guaranteed

We've seen base CoC being used via contact /collusion of attacks and also done without contact

So adcoc also works the same : you can make contact if you want

Shanks and WB contacted when they split the sky

Post automatically merged: Apr 11, 2023

So much bandwitch, so much calories, so much neurons wasted for this shit. Meanwhile Oda laguhing his ass offf to the bank

As Odas editor I can confirm, he loughs when I cry

 

[MonsterKaido]

- The first time AdCoC is used by the Main character Luffy
- The first time AdCoC is visually portrayed by the WSM and the Pirate King in a Clash
- The first time AdCoC is used in the first Named attack of current Yonko Shanks
- The first time AdCoC + ID CoA is visually explained by the Legendary Hero of the Marines


- The first time ID CoA + CoC + Blade is Visually shown by Roger's Kamusari
- The first time ID CoA + CoC + Blade is used by the Main character Zoro

Don't you see how Important they are in the Narrative..

Kaido's Ragnarok is adv coc attack

 

[K!NG HARA$H!MA]

People keep coming up with their own terminology to explain this,

Which makes things even more complicated

 

[Buggy D Clown]

- The first time AdCoC is used by the Main character Luffy
- The first time AdCoC is visually portrayed by the WSM and the Pirate King in a Clash
- The first time AdCoC is used in the first Named attack of current Yonko Shanks
- The first time AdCoC + ID CoA is visually explained by the Legendary Hero of the Marines


- The first time ID CoA + CoC + Blade is Visually shown by Roger's Kamusari
- The first time ID CoA + CoC + Blade is used by the Main character Zoro

Don't you see how Important they are in the Narrative..

Dude you are just making this shit up and then basing your whole argument on it, it was never separated nor stated in the manga

 

[Rootbeer]

Dude you are just making this shit up and then basing your whole argument on it, it was never separated nor stated in the manga

Ain't everyone making stuff up with their own interpretations?..

Post automatically merged: Apr 11, 2023

Kaido's Ragnarok is adv coc attack

I agree..

 

[Buggy D Clown]

Ain't everyone making stuff up with their own interpretations?..

Yeah but you are doing it backwards using circular logic

 

[BornInAbyss]

Ain't everyone making stuff up with their own interpretations?..

Post automatically merged: Apr 11, 2023

I agree..

Yet you say zoro has no ACoC. Yet you say that adv CoC is only no touching while ragnaroku is disproving it. You’re the epitome of being ignorant lmao.

 

[ShishioIsBack]

It was Touch, with Black Lightning to Cut King.. Everything that cuts is Touch..

No He didn't touch King, He launched a Haki Hame Ha on him, you can see CoC coming out of King's Body.

Its almost like Zoro shot a Kame Ha Me Ha wave of Haki and nearly punched a hole in King's Body with it.