Powers & Abilities Gear 5 IS a better power-up than Super Saiyan (not a joke/bait thread)
- Thread starter CoC: Color of Clowns
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the "are you having fun" tone happened before gear 5. The tone of the fight had nothing to do with gear 5, its because of how oda wrote kaido. Oda basically made it seem like orochi was the actual evil one so that he could make kaido just seem like a guy that just wanted a good fight or whatever. So thats why luffy could act chummy with him, luffy never acted that way with crocodile or doflamingo because those guys were actually evil and luffy legitimately hated them.
I like how gear 5 fights kaido carefree and joyfully. Its just that the damage was done before gear 5 started. Because before gear5 we already were used to kaido being throttled and knocked around everywhere. at this point people are just feeling sorry for kaido getting this endless beatdown
I like how gear 5 fights kaido carefree and joyfully. Its just that the damage was done before gear 5 started. Because before gear5 we already were used to kaido being throttled and knocked around everywhere. at this point people are just feeling sorry for kaido getting this endless beatdown
Super Saiyan is arguably the most iconic transformation in fiction. Universally loved and hype when it first happened.
G5 is..............controversial to say the least.
G5 kills hype, makes villains who are hyped/built up for years and maybe even decade+ turn into a joke with stupid shenanigans. It actively hurts the story in my view, by making these imposing villains look like they are in tom and jerry.
If I wanna laugh, I'll watch tom and jerry, or we have Buggy in OP. Shouldn't be at the expense of arc villains.
G5 is..............controversial to say the least.
G5 kills hype, makes villains who are hyped/built up for years and maybe even decade+ turn into a joke with stupid shenanigans. It actively hurts the story in my view, by making these imposing villains look like they are in tom and jerry.
If I wanna laugh, I'll watch tom and jerry, or we have Buggy in OP. Shouldn't be at the expense of arc villains.
???
Goku barely wins his fights lol. Vs Piccolo he was basically paralyzed, same as Vs Vegeta(which he needed help from Gohan, Krillin and Yajirobe) and Buu saga (which he needed the help from basically everyone lol)
He also lost a few times. Vs Mercenary Tao, Vs Demon King Piccolo, Vs Raditz, Vs Cell. Goku was broken if we compare him to the people he grew up with, but as the series kept creeping in power he was usually on the weaker end compared to his enemies(which is why Toriyama kept increasing the scale)
Goku barely wins his fights lol. Vs Piccolo he was basically paralyzed, same as Vs Vegeta(which he needed help from Gohan, Krillin and Yajirobe) and Buu saga (which he needed the help from basically everyone lol)
He also lost a few times. Vs Mercenary Tao, Vs Demon King Piccolo, Vs Raditz, Vs Cell. Goku was broken if we compare him to the people he grew up with, but as the series kept creeping in power he was usually on the weaker end compared to his enemies(which is why Toriyama kept increasing the scale)
For me Super Saiyan transformation was most epic one. Perhaps because I watched it on anime first or because of nostalgia but I still remember getting goosebumps over it.
It was unprecedented transformation and build up for it was awesome.
However , Gear 5 is unique. It's not your regular power up. The goofiness Gear 5 has can actually go down as most creative power up ever if Toei delivers on it.
Manga can never do justice with looney toon powers of G5 so how much great it will be totally depends on how Toei handles it. So far, I am liking it. The drum sounds starting from slow tempo was really great and I felt hyped for it even when luffy isn't my favourite.
But overall, SSJ is still more epic for me
It was unprecedented transformation and build up for it was awesome.
However , Gear 5 is unique. It's not your regular power up. The goofiness Gear 5 has can actually go down as most creative power up ever if Toei delivers on it.
Manga can never do justice with looney toon powers of G5 so how much great it will be totally depends on how Toei handles it. So far, I am liking it. The drum sounds starting from slow tempo was really great and I felt hyped for it even when luffy isn't my favourite.
But overall, SSJ is still more epic for me
No series has ever made me come to detest the concept of foreshadowing like One Piece has.
First of all, just because something is foreshadowed doesn't automatically make it good. Secondly, how much of One Piece's "foreshadowing" is actually foreshadowing and how much of it is just Oda retroactively connecting a bunch of random dots?
There is an interview with Oda where Oda flat out states that the 11 Supernova weren't planned and they were conceived of about one chapter before their introduction purely because Sabaody needed some extra "excitement". Some of these guys go on to form the backbone of Luffy's New World allies with Law being especially indispensable. The idea that the same author who continually adds random crap throughout his story because it "spices it up" and ends up surprised by how impactful/popular some of his characters become (e.g. Law), also planned things so meticulously in advance that a freaking shadow from over a decade ago is meant to be foreshadowing is somewhere between egregious reach and copium overdose.
Thirdly, even if it is foreshadowing, there comes a point where you just cannot reasonably expect people to remember such minor stuff from years ago. Like damn, I would have been in secondary school when I first saw Skypiea and in primary school when Skypiea first came out. People just aren't going to remember such minor, trivial moments like "Hey, look at Luffy's shadow". Especially not in a gargantuan series where 100-150 chapters now completes a single arc. Compare that to Dragon Ball Z where 150 chapters gets you from Raditz to the Androids.
First of all, just because something is foreshadowed doesn't automatically make it good. Secondly, how much of One Piece's "foreshadowing" is actually foreshadowing and how much of it is just Oda retroactively connecting a bunch of random dots?
There is an interview with Oda where Oda flat out states that the 11 Supernova weren't planned and they were conceived of about one chapter before their introduction purely because Sabaody needed some extra "excitement". Some of these guys go on to form the backbone of Luffy's New World allies with Law being especially indispensable. The idea that the same author who continually adds random crap throughout his story because it "spices it up" and ends up surprised by how impactful/popular some of his characters become (e.g. Law), also planned things so meticulously in advance that a freaking shadow from over a decade ago is meant to be foreshadowing is somewhere between egregious reach and copium overdose.
Thirdly, even if it is foreshadowing, there comes a point where you just cannot reasonably expect people to remember such minor stuff from years ago. Like damn, I would have been in secondary school when I first saw Skypiea and in primary school when Skypiea first came out. People just aren't going to remember such minor, trivial moments like "Hey, look at Luffy's shadow". Especially not in a gargantuan series where 100-150 chapters now completes a single arc. Compare that to Dragon Ball Z where 150 chapters gets you from Raditz to the Androids.
Oh I think you and I are gonna have fun.
Do you remember Gear 2 and gear 3? Those are foreshadowings.
Do you remember Shanks stealing the fruit in chapter 1 ? This is a foreshadowing
Do you remember the Nika conversation ? This is a foreshadowing
Do you remember the joy boy conversation in Fishmen island ? This is a foreshadowing.
No, foreshadowing doesn't necessarally mean a story is good. But its one of the best indication it is. The gear 5 is one of the best plot twist of the entiere serie. But the thing you forget is that its not only good because of the foreshadowing, its also the best because of everything else:
- Gear 5 push the theme of freedom to its limits which is the core theme of One Piece but also Luffy
- Gear 5 extend the lore around the One Piece, making its appearance a HUGE worldbuilding moment, not just a cool transformation
- Gear 5 put the spectator on his head by twisting not only a transformation but the ENTIRE story on its head by the fact that something like the gomu gomu fruit it reput into question. This is something only prodigies stories are able to do. So needless to say that it doesn't happen often, even Shakespear had hard time doing that.
- Gear 5 extend the symbolism present in One Piece around the theme of the sun, the down and the moon. Which create an echo chamùber of theme that resonnate all over the story. This is again, something only the best stories can do.
Now for the comparison:
- Supersayan was foreshadow one time (meaning with the same principle "someone saying that the ultimate warrior exist")
- Supersayan is like a lot of story a product of anger. This is not only basic but also very problematic as it portray the idea that when you are angry you can developp a super power. This is a product of toxic masculinity that men face all around the world in media, meaning that in media character are expected to be hero when they are angry and smashing stuff, when in reality, this is the behavior of a violent person.
- While supersayan is cool, it doesn't resonnate in any symbolic way shape or form
- While supersayan is cool, it doesn't turn the story on its head
- While supersayan is cool, it doesn't push forward the world building or the knowledge we have of the fantasy world of Dragon ball.
So yeah
This is not even a match. Not only gear 5 benefit of a bigger hype, gear 5 is also better both in storytelling and symbolism.
Oh and one last thing: Gear 5 is created in such a manner that it transcend the format. By creating a transformation that reminds us of the toons, gear 5 pushes the manga format to its limits breaking the barrier of what is possible in one's story.
Do you remember Gear 2 and gear 3? Those are foreshadowings.
Do you remember Shanks stealing the fruit in chapter 1 ? This is a foreshadowing
Do you remember the Nika conversation ? This is a foreshadowing
Do you remember the joy boy conversation in Fishmen island ? This is a foreshadowing.
No, foreshadowing doesn't necessarally mean a story is good. But its one of the best indication it is. The gear 5 is one of the best plot twist of the entiere serie. But the thing you forget is that its not only good because of the foreshadowing, its also the best because of everything else:
- Gear 5 push the theme of freedom to its limits which is the core theme of One Piece but also Luffy
- Gear 5 extend the lore around the One Piece, making its appearance a HUGE worldbuilding moment, not just a cool transformation
- Gear 5 put the spectator on his head by twisting not only a transformation but the ENTIRE story on its head by the fact that something like the gomu gomu fruit it reput into question. This is something only prodigies stories are able to do. So needless to say that it doesn't happen often, even Shakespear had hard time doing that.
- Gear 5 extend the symbolism present in One Piece around the theme of the sun, the down and the moon. Which create an echo chamùber of theme that resonnate all over the story. This is again, something only the best stories can do.
Now for the comparison:
- Supersayan was foreshadow one time (meaning with the same principle "someone saying that the ultimate warrior exist")
- Supersayan is like a lot of story a product of anger. This is not only basic but also very problematic as it portray the idea that when you are angry you can developp a super power. This is a product of toxic masculinity that men face all around the world in media, meaning that in media character are expected to be hero when they are angry and smashing stuff, when in reality, this is the behavior of a violent person.
- While supersayan is cool, it doesn't resonnate in any symbolic way shape or form
- While supersayan is cool, it doesn't turn the story on its head
- While supersayan is cool, it doesn't push forward the world building or the knowledge we have of the fantasy world of Dragon ball.
So yeah
This is not even a match. Not only gear 5 benefit of a bigger hype, gear 5 is also better both in storytelling and symbolism.
Oh and one last thing: Gear 5 is created in such a manner that it transcend the format. By creating a transformation that reminds us of the toons, gear 5 pushes the manga format to its limits breaking the barrier of what is possible in one's story.
I honestly never thought a shonen power up would do more for me than Super Saiyan. All the other transformations after (Ascended Saiyan, Super Saiyan 3, etc) didn't do much for me (I thought 3 was stupid as hell due to the hair). 4 in GT was okay, but GT was... ugh, and sadly, I've never got into Super because at this point I'm just waiting for the series to end to catch up to it. So, no Ultra Instinct or God stuff here, just the original DRAGON BALL Z, HUNT THE DRAGON, HUNT THE DRAGON, DRAGONBAAAAAALL ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ (guitar riffs intensify)
Goku had been serious at times in fights, but Super Saiyan was the first time we saw his full warrior spirit come out, the raging great ape inside. While this was lost later on, what made the original Super Saiyan transformation startling was Goku was PISSED. Even at his worst, Goku had always had some level of happines and joy in his fights.
Freiza was the first time he actually got PISSED, to the point he was willing to snap and bark at Gohan, surprising the hell out of Gohan, who had NEVER seen his father act like that. Super Saiyan was the Saiyan bloodlust and battle instinct in Goku perfectly mixing with his human kindness and desire to protect his friends and family.
Afterwards, the series has never really known what to do with his character; Goku already peaked years ago, IMO. Gohan SHOULD HAVE become the new protagonist after the Cell Saga, but instead, Super Saiyan became a joke for a while, which is my biggest issue with it. Its original portayal was AMAZING, but, a lot of the Super Saiyan stuff has been just... bad since. Uninspired. Rather than be an ultimate form where Goku acts like a badass, it just became another convenient stepping stone transformation.
This is what separates Super Saiyan from Gear 5. Gear 5 IS LUFFY'S PEAK. Gear 5 isn't some transformation sequence that's going to be discarded for a new one in a few volumes. Gear 5 is Luffy's ultimate form, all of his training, kindness, and dreams coming together.
If you never read Skypiea, you might be stupid enough to act like Gear 5 was a retcon. Nope; Oda has been planning this crap for a LOOOOOONG time, with panels in Skypiea directly being referenced in the first few Gear 5 panels; you even have Conis in Skypiea praying to the real god to save them from Enel. Who saves them? The Sun God, Nika. Luffy being a true hero/deity who defeats false deities was shown as far back as Skypiea, and then again in Sabaody with the Charlos punch, then again in Dressrosa with Doffy being the Heavenly Demon.
Luffy being an immortal figure (within the context of reaching the end of the story, he could die at the end) who defeats false gods is a canon plot point.
Furthermore, Luffy's Fruit NEVER made any sense to begin with, because the closer he grew to Awakening, the less his Fruit made sense. Gear 2 involved him using his rubber body to artificially increase his blood flow and oxygen intake to artifically dope his body through pumping the blood faster. How the fuck does that make any sense, even in One Piece? Gear 3 is literally the dude turning his body parts into giant balloons. WTF, he didn't eat the balloon fruit, this is not how rubber limbs would work. Same thing with Gear 4 to an extreme extent, as he's inflating his muscles; Kaido even comments on Snake Man's redirect attacks, saying they make NO SENSE in the context of Luffy having a Rubber Fruit.
Even amonst other Devil Fruit users, people have always reacted to Luffy's Fruit with a level of disbelief and at times terror. He's always been our giggling rubber psychopath.
Through Wano Act 3, we hear Hyrogoro refer to Luffy as a Wisdom God while in Gear 4, and also see the discussions with Who's Who and Mr. Go hyping up the potential of Joy Boy and Luffy's Fruit.
This is how you do a stealth reveal: connect a bunch of powerful characters (Shanks and Joy Boy) to the narrative; tease it right during a huge fight; have the protagonist lose in a tragic way; reveal their power just when things are looking grim, and have another character hype the hell out of them (bonus points if you foreshadowed this years ago like Oda did with Skypiea). Super Saiyan checks a lot of these boxes, too.
But, Luffy had to seriously bust his ass off to reach Gear 5. He did explicit training for it, that actually led to his Haki and body reaching levels that could keep up with his Awakening. Goku did gravity and martial arts training, but none of it really connected to him going Super Saiyan (maybe Kaioken a little?).
The lore behind Super Saiyans was always murky at best, and the actual build up to Goku transforming, while cool, didn't have as much emotional build up to it. There aren't fucking Dargon Balls in One Piece, if Nami dies, chick is dead.
Krillin died, yeah, but... we all knew that fucker was coming back again. Death in One Piece is death, it just rarely happens and Oda has a fakeout death fetish.
Really wish Kaido had offed another Scabbard or something at least when he came down from the roof after Luffy's "death".
As cool as Super Saiyan was, it was another "Shonen Protagonist gets really angry and shows their true power that's been teased for a while" moment. That's happened before PLENTY it's just Super Saiyan did it best at its time. Gear 5 is much more unique and unexpected.
Super Saiyan ruined Dragon Ball on some level. During the rest of Z post Namek, any non-Android or Saiyan character was beyond useless, which as far as I know, is still the case in Super. Dragon Ball Z was already on the path the abandoning any non-Saiyan's as serious fighters as early as the Yamcha death pose, but, Super Saiyan and its subsequent forms guaranteed non-Saiyans would also be hot doggy doo doo.
In the One Piece universe, some drunk homeless looking dude with one arm that lets people pick on him in bar fights could fuck Luffy up with no Devil Fruit whatsoever. Gear 5 did nothing to break One Piece's narrative, powerscaling, or characters (so far). It's the peak of them.
Luffy has always been a goofy fighter who uses weird ass techniques in battle, it's one of the reasons his enemies don't know what to do with him at times. Luffy has always gone around liberating people and making allies wherever he went. Luffy has always saved people when they were at their lowest with his smile and courage. Gear 5 is the natural evolution of his character and traits.
Gear 5 is the peak of One Piece, a laughing, goofy goober beating up the strongest people in the world in the most ridiculous ways possible, just because he loves his friends and wants to have a big party with them.
All of our power-scaling and shitfuck agenda are a product of our addiction to spoilers, delusions, and at times (I bet on ZKK after Wano ended) outright mental illness. Oda doesn't give a fuck about that shit, to him, Gear 5 is peak Luffy.
Super Saiyan, like most power up, involved the main character screaming and growing incredibly strong all at once. While the presentation was FANTASTIC the basic elements had all been done before.
Gear 5 subverts shonen tropes completely, by having a quiet, then booming drum beat sound. Rather than scream or rage, as his heartbeat dances with liberation and joy, the corner of Luffy's lips creep up his cheeks until he's grinning like a madman.
Rather than rage, he gets up, starts dancing and bouncing, then, with a maniac smile, smashes down into Onigashima, pulls Kaido back up, and gives him the Toon Force.
This is Luffy's ULTIMATE REJECTION OF KAIDO. Kaido, who thinks a party is getting drunk, then dropping his giant house on a bunch of other people's smaller houses to kill them, starts getting his ass handed to him by some giggling monster who just wants to dance to his own heartbeat.
Luffy just spits on all of Kaido's drunken rage, remorse, sorrow, hatred, whining, by laughing in his face and smirking... through the fight, Kaido is nothing like Frieza. He isn't a powerful, unstoppable force. He has trauma. He's broken. He's suicidal. He lets people get easy attacks in because he wants to die, gets pissed when they can't kill him, then is a hypocrite, dodges strong strikes, and gets pissed at Luffy when Luffys calls him out for it.
Freiza vs Goku was a 1v1 where a known unstoppable force is playing with its food, like a cat with a mouse, but Goku keeps growing, until Frieza finally breaks him emotionally, and pushes him past his known limits.
Kaido vs Luffy is a suicidal drunk old man hoping some young guy full of hops and dreams will become Joy Boy and will finally kill him.
That is why Kaido was SO PISSED when Mr. Go fucked over Luffy. Kaido WANTED TO BE LIBERATED more than anyone. If you look at his faces before Luffy's death, Kaido is having the time of his life. He's truly smiling, no longer out of rage or hatred, but pure enjoyment FOR LUFFY (Kaido looking kinda hot here, too, not going to lie).
THAT IS WHAT MAKES GEAR 5 SO POWERFUL. As a straight fight, Goku vs Frieza is superior to Luffy vs Kaido, to me. BUT the emotional stakes in Luffy vs Kaido hits so much harder.
Gear 5 being a powerup the protagonist gets to liberate his suicidial arch-enemy is just... such amazing, witty writing.
Kaido was the one MOST LIBERATED by Joy Boy. Luffy actually made that old, genocidal bastard smile again.
Frieza is just an evil bastard who is REALLY good and REALLY entertaining at being an evil bastard. As much as I love Dragon Ball Z, it's nowhere near as deep as One Piece when it comes to plot, characters, and motivations.
I can definitely agree Goku vs Frieza is a more satisfying fight overall, BUT, Gear 5 is a greater power-up than Super Saiyan to me, because it is much more important to the plot and connected to Luffy as an overall character.
Super Saiyan may be the more iconic moment (definitely as of now) but Gear 5 is a superior power-up, and truly shows what One Piece is; a story about how dreams, will, friendship, and laughter can change the world.
After over a 1,000 chapters, 1,000 episodes, seeing Luffy reach his peak, and still be himself... seeing his peak being him laughing his ass off while using a giant dragon as a jump rope... that's peak creativity to me. Gear 5 was something no one expected, and having the cartoon protagonist literally become a cartoon protagonist is such a zany idea few people have the balls or ovaries to try.
I fucking hope Oda doesn't make Gear 6 or some dumb shit, having a final form of Gear 5 or different forms like Gear 4 is fine, but NO FUCKING RANDOM GIANT HAIR GROWTH, ODA, DO NOT GIVE LUFFY HAIR LONGER THAN THE LENGTH OF HIS BODY, FUCK SUPER SAIYAN 3.
Gear 5 is PERFECT for this series, and is my favorite power up of all time based on how it connects to the character, story, and world.
WE'RE TOON PIECE NOW, BABY
Goku had been serious at times in fights, but Super Saiyan was the first time we saw his full warrior spirit come out, the raging great ape inside. While this was lost later on, what made the original Super Saiyan transformation startling was Goku was PISSED. Even at his worst, Goku had always had some level of happines and joy in his fights.
Freiza was the first time he actually got PISSED, to the point he was willing to snap and bark at Gohan, surprising the hell out of Gohan, who had NEVER seen his father act like that. Super Saiyan was the Saiyan bloodlust and battle instinct in Goku perfectly mixing with his human kindness and desire to protect his friends and family.
Afterwards, the series has never really known what to do with his character; Goku already peaked years ago, IMO. Gohan SHOULD HAVE become the new protagonist after the Cell Saga, but instead, Super Saiyan became a joke for a while, which is my biggest issue with it. Its original portayal was AMAZING, but, a lot of the Super Saiyan stuff has been just... bad since. Uninspired. Rather than be an ultimate form where Goku acts like a badass, it just became another convenient stepping stone transformation.
This is what separates Super Saiyan from Gear 5. Gear 5 IS LUFFY'S PEAK. Gear 5 isn't some transformation sequence that's going to be discarded for a new one in a few volumes. Gear 5 is Luffy's ultimate form, all of his training, kindness, and dreams coming together.
Gear 5 has years of development and foreshadowing
If you never read Skypiea, you might be stupid enough to act like Gear 5 was a retcon. Nope; Oda has been planning this crap for a LOOOOOONG time, with panels in Skypiea directly being referenced in the first few Gear 5 panels; you even have Conis in Skypiea praying to the real god to save them from Enel. Who saves them? The Sun God, Nika. Luffy being a true hero/deity who defeats false deities was shown as far back as Skypiea, and then again in Sabaody with the Charlos punch, then again in Dressrosa with Doffy being the Heavenly Demon.
Luffy being an immortal figure (within the context of reaching the end of the story, he could die at the end) who defeats false gods is a canon plot point.
Furthermore, Luffy's Fruit NEVER made any sense to begin with, because the closer he grew to Awakening, the less his Fruit made sense. Gear 2 involved him using his rubber body to artificially increase his blood flow and oxygen intake to artifically dope his body through pumping the blood faster. How the fuck does that make any sense, even in One Piece? Gear 3 is literally the dude turning his body parts into giant balloons. WTF, he didn't eat the balloon fruit, this is not how rubber limbs would work. Same thing with Gear 4 to an extreme extent, as he's inflating his muscles; Kaido even comments on Snake Man's redirect attacks, saying they make NO SENSE in the context of Luffy having a Rubber Fruit.
Even amonst other Devil Fruit users, people have always reacted to Luffy's Fruit with a level of disbelief and at times terror. He's always been our giggling rubber psychopath.
Through Wano Act 3, we hear Hyrogoro refer to Luffy as a Wisdom God while in Gear 4, and also see the discussions with Who's Who and Mr. Go hyping up the potential of Joy Boy and Luffy's Fruit.
This is how you do a stealth reveal: connect a bunch of powerful characters (Shanks and Joy Boy) to the narrative; tease it right during a huge fight; have the protagonist lose in a tragic way; reveal their power just when things are looking grim, and have another character hype the hell out of them (bonus points if you foreshadowed this years ago like Oda did with Skypiea). Super Saiyan checks a lot of these boxes, too.
But, Luffy had to seriously bust his ass off to reach Gear 5. He did explicit training for it, that actually led to his Haki and body reaching levels that could keep up with his Awakening. Goku did gravity and martial arts training, but none of it really connected to him going Super Saiyan (maybe Kaioken a little?).
The lore behind Super Saiyans was always murky at best, and the actual build up to Goku transforming, while cool, didn't have as much emotional build up to it. There aren't fucking Dargon Balls in One Piece, if Nami dies, chick is dead.
Krillin died, yeah, but... we all knew that fucker was coming back again. Death in One Piece is death, it just rarely happens and Oda has a fakeout death fetish.
Really wish Kaido had offed another Scabbard or something at least when he came down from the roof after Luffy's "death".
As cool as Super Saiyan was, it was another "Shonen Protagonist gets really angry and shows their true power that's been teased for a while" moment. That's happened before PLENTY it's just Super Saiyan did it best at its time. Gear 5 is much more unique and unexpected.
Gear 5 Perfectly Fits Luffy as a Character and the Series' Narrative
Super Saiyan ruined Dragon Ball on some level. During the rest of Z post Namek, any non-Android or Saiyan character was beyond useless, which as far as I know, is still the case in Super. Dragon Ball Z was already on the path the abandoning any non-Saiyan's as serious fighters as early as the Yamcha death pose, but, Super Saiyan and its subsequent forms guaranteed non-Saiyans would also be hot doggy doo doo.
In the One Piece universe, some drunk homeless looking dude with one arm that lets people pick on him in bar fights could fuck Luffy up with no Devil Fruit whatsoever. Gear 5 did nothing to break One Piece's narrative, powerscaling, or characters (so far). It's the peak of them.
Luffy has always been a goofy fighter who uses weird ass techniques in battle, it's one of the reasons his enemies don't know what to do with him at times. Luffy has always gone around liberating people and making allies wherever he went. Luffy has always saved people when they were at their lowest with his smile and courage. Gear 5 is the natural evolution of his character and traits.
Gear 5 is the peak of One Piece, a laughing, goofy goober beating up the strongest people in the world in the most ridiculous ways possible, just because he loves his friends and wants to have a big party with them.
All of our power-scaling and shitfuck agenda are a product of our addiction to spoilers, delusions, and at times (I bet on ZKK after Wano ended) outright mental illness. Oda doesn't give a fuck about that shit, to him, Gear 5 is peak Luffy.
Super Saiyan, like most power up, involved the main character screaming and growing incredibly strong all at once. While the presentation was FANTASTIC the basic elements had all been done before.
Gear 5 subverts shonen tropes completely, by having a quiet, then booming drum beat sound. Rather than scream or rage, as his heartbeat dances with liberation and joy, the corner of Luffy's lips creep up his cheeks until he's grinning like a madman.
Rather than rage, he gets up, starts dancing and bouncing, then, with a maniac smile, smashes down into Onigashima, pulls Kaido back up, and gives him the Toon Force.
This is Luffy's ULTIMATE REJECTION OF KAIDO. Kaido, who thinks a party is getting drunk, then dropping his giant house on a bunch of other people's smaller houses to kill them, starts getting his ass handed to him by some giggling monster who just wants to dance to his own heartbeat.
Luffy just spits on all of Kaido's drunken rage, remorse, sorrow, hatred, whining, by laughing in his face and smirking... through the fight, Kaido is nothing like Frieza. He isn't a powerful, unstoppable force. He has trauma. He's broken. He's suicidal. He lets people get easy attacks in because he wants to die, gets pissed when they can't kill him, then is a hypocrite, dodges strong strikes, and gets pissed at Luffy when Luffys calls him out for it.
Freiza vs Goku was a 1v1 where a known unstoppable force is playing with its food, like a cat with a mouse, but Goku keeps growing, until Frieza finally breaks him emotionally, and pushes him past his known limits.
Kaido vs Luffy is a suicidal drunk old man hoping some young guy full of hops and dreams will become Joy Boy and will finally kill him.
That is why Kaido was SO PISSED when Mr. Go fucked over Luffy. Kaido WANTED TO BE LIBERATED more than anyone. If you look at his faces before Luffy's death, Kaido is having the time of his life. He's truly smiling, no longer out of rage or hatred, but pure enjoyment FOR LUFFY (Kaido looking kinda hot here, too, not going to lie).
THAT IS WHAT MAKES GEAR 5 SO POWERFUL. As a straight fight, Goku vs Frieza is superior to Luffy vs Kaido, to me. BUT the emotional stakes in Luffy vs Kaido hits so much harder.
Gear 5 being a powerup the protagonist gets to liberate his suicidial arch-enemy is just... such amazing, witty writing.
Kaido was the one MOST LIBERATED by Joy Boy. Luffy actually made that old, genocidal bastard smile again.
Frieza is just an evil bastard who is REALLY good and REALLY entertaining at being an evil bastard. As much as I love Dragon Ball Z, it's nowhere near as deep as One Piece when it comes to plot, characters, and motivations.
I can definitely agree Goku vs Frieza is a more satisfying fight overall, BUT, Gear 5 is a greater power-up than Super Saiyan to me, because it is much more important to the plot and connected to Luffy as an overall character.
Super Saiyan may be the more iconic moment (definitely as of now) but Gear 5 is a superior power-up, and truly shows what One Piece is; a story about how dreams, will, friendship, and laughter can change the world.
After over a 1,000 chapters, 1,000 episodes, seeing Luffy reach his peak, and still be himself... seeing his peak being him laughing his ass off while using a giant dragon as a jump rope... that's peak creativity to me. Gear 5 was something no one expected, and having the cartoon protagonist literally become a cartoon protagonist is such a zany idea few people have the balls or ovaries to try.
I fucking hope Oda doesn't make Gear 6 or some dumb shit, having a final form of Gear 5 or different forms like Gear 4 is fine, but NO FUCKING RANDOM GIANT HAIR GROWTH, ODA, DO NOT GIVE LUFFY HAIR LONGER THAN THE LENGTH OF HIS BODY, FUCK SUPER SAIYAN 3.
Gear 5 is PERFECT for this series, and is my favorite power up of all time based on how it connects to the character, story, and world.
WE'RE TOON PIECE NOW, BABY
adding to the fact, what makes G5 unique is that it is actually Luffy equivalent rage mode like Kurama mode of Naruto or Ichigo's hollow mode but Luffy didn't lose his self...and while it is shonen equivalent, it is not rage mage but "joy" mode...
Yeah, I agree that G5 should be peak and there should be no G6 or anything..I think it is a stupid wriiting to go for G6 when G5 is the culmination of all gears and Oda called Luffy peak...he just needs to amplify the diversity and potential of G5 mode...
Gear 5, Gon's adult rage, some of AoT transformations are mich better than SSJ1.
But ssj1 is iconic since it was on the tv, when anime wasnt known or famous, when most of us were kids.
Now most or many followers are teens or adults, we wont get the same emotions. At Kid, I even believed I could transform myself and tried many times.
With One Piece kr any other anime, I do play to transform or whatever, but just playing, I really dont think I can transform
But ssj1 is iconic since it was on the tv, when anime wasnt known or famous, when most of us were kids.
Now most or many followers are teens or adults, we wont get the same emotions. At Kid, I even believed I could transform myself and tried many times.
With One Piece kr any other anime, I do play to transform or whatever, but just playing, I really dont think I can transform
